WEST GARFIELD PARK : Chicago (Time: low income, 2014, apartments)

[Don Cuccino]

Originally Posted by BRU67

I do not disagree with any of this as a general rule. The multi-unit market in North Lawndale and Garfield Park - and the part of South Lawndale west of Kedzie - is a bit unique in that they are seeing a lot of young, first time investors who are being pushed there due to the really hot markets in other nearby areas, where you very often need to bring the purchase price in cash to play.

They do not seem to be moving into these areas. From their buying patterns along the train lines, one could perhaps deduce they are banking on gentrification, albeit gentrification they themselves are not willing to start through their own physical presence. Whether this is causing them to use better materials, I don't know. But for the most part, you are not dealing with big developers, so I imagine the quality of their rehabs would vary.

Speculating investors, especially flippers use cheap materials, especially now that materials gone up in cost, not unique to the West Side. There are youtube videos by investors recommending this. I know quite a few of these investors who rent out to section 8. How is an impoverished neighborhood going to change if you keep filling it with poor people? I asked them this and none can answer the question, they are expecting other landlords to take the hit and lower their rents to attract struggling bohemians. So in the end they all charge $1,200 for section 8 instead of $800 to a struggling artist. Let's see how that plays out in the long run.

[BRU67]

Originally Posted by jfre81

If you really live in Little Village, are you doing that much better?

Yes, I really live in Little Village. And yes, I feel it is considerably better. Sure there are problems, such as gang violence, but the jagoff ratio seems to be much, much lower than in some other areas north of us. A lot of families, and strong signs of gentrification, particularly east of Kedzie, but we're even seeing it west of Kedzie. I'm seeing young Millennial home buyers actually moving in.

[BRU67]

Originally Posted by Don Cuccino

Speculating investors, especially flippers use cheap materials, especially now that materials gone up in cost, not unique to the West Side. There are youtube videos by investors recommending this. I know quite a few of these investors who rent out to section 8. How is an impoverished neighborhood going to change if you keep filling it with poor people? I asked them this and none can answer the question, they are expecting other landlords to take the hit and lower their rents to attract struggling bohemians. So in the end they all charge $1,200 for section 8 instead of $800 to a struggling artist. Let's see how that plays out in the long run.

Yeah, I don't know either. Presence makes perfect, as the old saying goes. They bemoan realtor redlining, business disinvestment, police officers, and underfunded social services. Yet, they aren't willing to go in themselves to put their anger over these things towards positive action, beyond making a mortgage payment that is akin to a bet. It's hypocritical. Not speaking for everyone, but that seems to be the trend.

[jfre81]

Originally Posted by BRU67

but the jagoff ratio seems to be much, much lower than in some other areas north of us

Go into some detail, if you don't mind.

[BRU67]

Originally Posted by jfre81

Go into some detail, if you don't mind.

About what? Loud parties that go into the very early hours of the morning and evolve into fights (too often with the use of handguns), flying past you on the right when you're driving, parking in the middle of the street and blocking traffic, driving ATVs down the middle of the street and sidewalks, screaming profanities into your cell phone while on public transit or in front of your house where everyone can hear, homicides rate higher than Tijuana Mexico, boarded up businesses due to broken windows, vacant lots filled with trash. Those sorts of details? If you really lived in Detroit, and not Bloomfield Hills or something, you should know of which I speak.

[jfre81]

Originally Posted by BRU67

About what? Loud parties that go into the very early hours of the morning

I should probably stop reading here. It's also summer, which means the fireworks and the mariachi bands at the parties on my block going deep into the night are going to herald the return of real normalcy over here. I'm in Belmont Gardens, on the Avondale/Logan border. Does it bother me? No, I knew what I signed up for.

Sorry bud, all I'm reading here is "sure, we have *******s here but they look like me, so I'm fine with it"

Those sorts of details? If you really lived in Detroit, and not Bloomfield Hills or something, you should know of which I speak.

It was on the border of Boynton and Ecorse/River Rouge on the south. Other end.

None of this is too far off, as an environment, from where I grew up. If you've ever been around Whiting or East Chicago, NW Indiana, I came up in a place a bit like that, only it was in Texas. Hell, my dad even worked for Amoco.
Take everyone in North Lawndale, Little Village and throw some sub-middle class whites from the south burbs and put everyone in a two-story garden apartment or a 50s ranch home. That's my hometown.
This is why I relate with folks in Garfield better than I do with folks in Bloomfield Hills. I couldn't fathom calling the HOA on my neighbors because they have a basketball hoop in their backyard.

[Don Cuccino]

Originally Posted by BRU67

Yeah, I don't know either. Presence makes perfect, as the old saying goes. They bemoan realtor redlining, business disinvestment, police officers, and underfunded social services. Yet, they aren't willing to go in themselves to put their anger over these things towards positive action, beyond making a mortgage payment that is akin to a bet. It's hypocritical. Not speaking for everyone, but that seems to be the trend.

Never met an investor who complains about any of those things. They complain that the riff don't leave or the neighborhood isn't changing fast enough but never have I heard them complain about cops or realtors redlining. On the off chance that they do complain about the cops its usually that they aren't aggressive enough. I think you're confusing neighborhood activists to investors.

[BRU67]

Originally Posted by jfre81

I should probably stop reading here. It's also summer, which means the fireworks and the mariachi bands at the parties on my block going deep into the night are going to herald the return of real normalcy over here. I'm in Belmont Gardens, on the Avondale/Logan border. Does it bother me? No, I knew what I signed up for.

Sorry bud, all I'm reading here is "sure, we have *******s here but they look like me, so I'm fine with it"



It was on the border of Boynton and Ecorse/River Rouge on the south. Other end.

None of this is too far off, as an environment, from where I grew up. If you've ever been around Whiting or East Chicago, NW Indiana, I came up in a place a bit like that, only it was in Texas. Hell, my dad even worked for Amoco.
Take everyone in North Lawndale, Little Village and throw some sub-middle class whites from the south burbs and put everyone in a two-story garden apartment or a 50s ranch home. That's my hometown.
This is why I relate with folks in Garfield better than I do with folks in Bloomfield Hills. I couldn't fathom calling the HOA on my neighbors because they have a basketball hoop in their backyard.

Backyard?? LOL! More likely, it'd either be in the front yard or middle of the street I'm doubting you're dealing with that much in Belmont Gardens, which has a solid B crime grade per Walkscore, which is good for the City.

No one is saying gangbangers are ok just so long as they look a given way. It's a major problem which has led to 9 homicides and 21 wounded in Little Village so far in 2021 - all virtually ignored by the media except the Adam Toledo shooting because it involved a cop. But there have been many other heartbreaking shootings which get little coverage. It's a problem, citywide.

But we're kind of talking about different things here. Living here day to day, I just do not experience the things I cited above. Those are quality of life issues which may be small individually, but added up, they make day to day living miserable. Gang violence is also completely unacceptable. I, for one, would like to see more initiatives to bring good paying jobs which do not require a professional degree to Chicago, as well as increased community policing and stiffer gun sentences, among other things. Parents need to get involved too. A lot of this problem stems from the home.

[BRU67]

Originally Posted by Don Cuccino

Never met an investor who complains about any of those things. They complain that the riff don't leave or the neighborhood isn't changing fast enough but never have I heard them complain about cops or realtors redlining. On the off chance that they do complain about the cops its usually that they aren't aggressive enough. I think you're confusing neighborhood activists to investors.

Sorry Don. Yeah, I was talking about the activists, and many of our fellow Chicagoans who live in safer neighborhoods and complain about the situation in our most violent areas. Not the investors.

[jfre81]

Originally Posted by BRU67

But we're kind of talking about different things here. Living here day to day, I just do not experience the things I cited above.

So when did you live in Garfield Park?