Chicago 2022 (Cicero, Berwyn, Summit: felony, restaurant, military)

[TBideon]

Agreed. Not enough stable people moving in to balance the cancers plaguing the city.

[BRU67]

Originally Posted by Drewjdeg

The fact that immigration has decreased is going to be the wildcard for Chicago going forward in the 2020s. A lot of studies have a linked the decrease in crime in the 90s to the surging immigration during the period. We won't have that anytime soon, and that's going to be a big negative for Chicago (IMO).

Most of the immigration to Chicago during the 1990s and 2000s heyday was low skilled labor which came to service the growth in the restaurant and construction industries. That growth was being driven by Chicago's robust professional sector, not the other way around

So just bringing in a bunch of low skilled immigrants is not going to help very much. It would probably hurt actually. If Chicago wants to attract immigrants who can meaningfully contribute to the economy, then they should try to grow the tech sector, which will grow the economy and then create room for the services of low skill immigration. You can't just force this.

Put another way, immigration is usually a symptom, not a cause, of a strong regional economy. And the reverse is of course true.

But with the way we're going, it wouldn't surprise me at all if we did use millions in tax dollars to move 10,000 refugees from the southern border and other impoverished countries here. But it would be a dumb idea which would be ineffective at best.

[personone]

Originally Posted by BRU67

Most of the immigration to Chicago during the 1990s and 2000s heyday was low skilled labor which came to service the growth in the restaurant and construction industries. That growth was being driven by Chicago's robust professional sector, not the other way around

So just bringing in a bunch of low skilled immigrants is not going to help very much. It would probably hurt actually. If Chicago wants to attract immigrants who can meaningfully contribute to the economy, then they should try to grow the tech sector, which will grow the economy and then create room for the services of low skill immigration. You can't just force this.

Put another way, immigration is usually a symptom, not a cause, of a strong regional economy. And the reverse is of course true.

But with the way we're going, it wouldn't surprise me at all if we did use millions in tax dollars to move 10,000 refugees from the southern border and other impoverished countries here. But it would be a dumb idea which would be ineffective at best.

I have mentioned this several times. Tech is key in this decade. The healthiest financial cities are the ones with tech. Unfortunately tech is competitive, and it seems to develop organically in cities. You would think that being the hub of the Midwest and one of the most affordable “major” cities would make it an attractive location for tech, but that hasn’t been the case. People on this site have claimed that Chicago is starting to develop some infrastructure for tech, but I haven’t seen any tangible evidence. It seems more like wishful thinking at this point. I still think that people underestimate how Chicago’s negative reputation and constant presence in the media hurts it in attracting businesses and talent. And to make things worse, the fact that the crime has spread downtown where companies would locate, is even more damaging.

The other wildcard will be the impact of remote work. It could impact where companies choose to be located. This could also prevent tech from physically relocating here.

[Drewjdeg]

Originally Posted by BRU67

Most of the immigration to Chicago during the 1990s and 2000s heyday was low skilled labor which came to service the growth in the restaurant and construction industries. That growth was being driven by Chicago's robust professional sector, not the other way around

So just bringing in a bunch of low skilled immigrants is not going to help very much. It would probably hurt actually. If Chicago wants to attract immigrants who can meaningfully contribute to the economy, then they should try to grow the tech sector, which will grow the economy and then create room for the services of low skill immigration. You can't just force this.

Put another way, immigration is usually a symptom, not a cause, of a strong regional economy. And the reverse is of course true.

But with the way we're going, it wouldn't surprise me at all if we did use millions in tax dollars to move 10,000 refugees from the southern border and other impoverished countries here. But it would be a dumb idea which would be ineffective at best.

Well yeah, I think most people agree that bringing in highly educated and skilled immigrants is beneficial. That’s why Canada has the express entry system; Chicago should be able to clone that system and bypass the archaic and bureaucratic system we have at the federal level (which makes it hard for skilled people to immigrate here).

A lot of declining rust belt cities have benefited from refugees, so we’ll have to agree to disagree on that (not worth debating).

What most people agree on is that Chicago could use more legal immigrants.

[Drewjdeg]

Originally Posted by personone

I have mentioned this several times. Tech is key in this decade. The healthiest financial cities are the ones with tech. Unfortunately tech is competitive, and it seems to develop organically in cities. You would think that being the hub of the Midwest and one of the most affordable “major” cities would make it an attractive location for tech, but that hasn’t been the case. People on this site have claimed that Chicago is starting to develop some infrastructure for tech, but I haven’t seen any tangible evidence. It seems more like wishful thinking at this point. I still think that people underestimate how Chicago’s negative reputation and constant presence in the media hurts it in attracting businesses and talent. And to make things worse, the fact that the crime has spread downtown where companies would locate, is even more damaging.

The other wildcard will be the impact of remote work. It could impact where companies choose to be located. This could also prevent tech from physically relocating here.

In quantitative finance, Chicago is definitely #2 behind New York. Citadel, Jump Trading, Discover, etc. Do you not consider that tech? Where do you not see tangible evidence?

The tech economy in Chicago is not as strong as Seattle, San Francisco, NY - but Chicago is still way ahead of cities like Houston.

[BRU67]

Originally Posted by Drewjdeg

Well yeah, I think most people agree that bringing in highly educated and skilled immigrants is beneficial. That’s why Canada has the express entry system; Chicago should be able to clone that system and bypass the archaic and bureaucratic system we have at the federal level (which makes it hard for skilled people to immigrate here).

A lot of declining rust belt cities have benefited from refugees, so we’ll have to agree to disagree on that (not worth debating).

What most people agree on is that Chicago could use more legal immigrants.

Even undocumented immigration is not a drain when the overall economy is doing well. Well, I mentioned Berwyn earlier and part of its problem was many low skilled undocumented immigrants moved in and ended up tanking the school scores and, in turn, property values, in that one market. But regionally, it's not a drain. It's a reaction to a strong economy and Chicago had that for quite some time.

When you add low skill workers into a region where there's not jobs for them, that's when the problems come in. This is why immigration should be regulated to match what skills a particular society needs, low skill or high skill. That's what most countries do but for some reason, here, this is a very political issue, so that practical concern does not tend to be the primary driver of immigration policy.

[Justabystander]

Originally Posted by Drewjdeg

In quantitative finance, Chicago is definitely #2 behind New York. Citadel, Jump Trading, Discover, etc. Do you not consider that tech? Where do you not see tangible evidence?

The tech economy in Chicago is not as strong as Seattle, San Francisco, NY - but Chicago is still way ahead of cities like Houston.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/peteran...h=4b9f2f581f16

Here is a 2021 article by Forbes about tech in Chicago. Extremely complimentary. Mod cut.

[Greencheese]

Originally Posted by BRU67

Even undocumented immigration is not a drain when the overall economy is doing well. Well, I mentioned Berwyn earlier and part of its problem was many low skilled undocumented immigrants moved in and ended up tanking the school scores and, in turn, property values, in that one market. But regionally, it's not a drain. It's a reaction to a strong economy and Chicago had that for quite some time.

When you add low skill workers into a region where there's not jobs for them, that's when the problems come in. This is why immigration should be regulated to match what skills a particular society needs, low skill or high skill. That's what most countries do but for some reason, here, this is a very political issue, so that practical concern does not tend to be the primary driver of immigration policy.

So literally what you're saying is illegal immigration doesn't hurt anyone but then also its detrimental to a local area that those illegals move into and Berwyn got crushed because of it. Seems this is identical the Chicago thought process on violence, hey as long as the problems stay over there we can pretend its all okey dokey.

[BRU67]

Originally Posted by Greencheese

So literally what you're saying is illegal immigration doesn't hurt anyone but then also its detrimental to a local area that those illegals move into and Berwyn got crushed because of it. Seems this is identical the Chicago thought process on violence, hey as long as the problems stay over there we can pretend its all okey dokey.

Yup, that's pretty much what happened. Communities like Berwyn, Cicero, Summit, and some City neighborhoods subsidized the cheap labor that helped Chicago boom in the 1990s and '00s. I was griping about that all the time back then. Seemed unfair. But no one really seemed to care until the economy collapsed in the late 2000s, then it became a big issue with conservatives. Trump was able to then capitalize on that of course, and the rest, as they say, is history.

[Grlzrl]

I don't know about 2022 but I have a friend who is friends with a judge who says if you think now is bad with regards to crime, you ain't seen nothing yet because cashless bail takes affect in 2023.