The people of Illinois are unfree? (Bridgeport: living in, restaurants, law)

[Gelasia]

Originally Posted by Mister Mappy

So, are you often in private booths at sex shops?

I was wondering the same thing

[Mister Mappy]

Originally Posted by aragx6

You do understand that was the point right?

The ban was always framed as a health issue, but when you get down to it and really question people on their reasoning, nearly everyone I've met admits they just don't like it -- this goes along with my point about carcinogens from car exhaust.

The thing is why should people don't smoke have to tolerate second hand smoke? A 200 pound woman isn't forcing what she is eating down someone's else's throat. A smoker is forcing what they smoke down someone else's throat. Sorry, I'm never going to agree with this. If you want to smoke, fine, but it does affect other people who may not like it, and shouldn't have to tolerate it.

[aragx6]

Originally Posted by Mister Mappy

The thing is why should people don't smoke have to tolerate second hand smoke? A 200 pound woman isn't forcing what she is eating down someone's else's throat. A smoker is forcing what they smoke down someone else's throat. Sorry, I'm never going to agree with this. If you want to smoke, fine, but it does affect other people who may not like it, and shouldn't have to tolerate it.

We're both missing the point. it's not you or me that's unfree. It's the bar owner who is unfree in Illinois.

You and me are free to go to whatever establishments we like. He's, however, not allowed to run his business the way he sees fit.

[hank0604]

Originally Posted by Mister Mappy

The thing is why should people don't smoke have to tolerate second hand smoke? A 200 pound woman isn't forcing what she is eating down someone's else's throat. A smoker is forcing what they smoke down someone else's throat. Sorry, I'm never going to agree with this. If you want to smoke, fine, but it does affect other people who may not like it, and shouldn't have to tolerate it.

If you go back and actually read more than the first sentence of my post, you'll see that I was not complaining about the smoking ban. Hell, my home state of LA did it two years ago, and I, as a smoker, was relieved. I don't want to have to go to the cleaners every monday because of smoke smell in my coat from the weekend.

My post was about the irrational hate that people have towards smokers. If someone is smoking within the law (outside, at least 25 feet from any door) it should not concern anyone else. But for some reason, it does. With all the health risks out there, people seem to focus all of their attention on smoking, for no real reason that I can see. Anyone who smokes now does so of their own free will, knowing the health risks. What difference does it make to anyone else? The point was that fat people are just as dangerous to themselves as smokers, but no one goes out and yells at the fat people for being fat.

[Mister Mappy]

Originally Posted by hank0604

If you go back and actually read more than the first sentence of my post, you'll see that I was not complaining about the smoking ban. Hell, my home state of LA did it two years ago, and I, as a smoker, was relieved. I don't want to have to go to the cleaners every monday because of smoke smell in my coat from the weekend.

My post was about the irrational hate that people have towards smokers. If someone is smoking within the law (outside, at least 25 feet from any door) it should not concern anyone else. But for some reason, it does. With all the health risks out there, people seem to focus all of their attention on smoking, for no real reason that I can see. Anyone who smokes now does so of their own free will, knowing the health risks. What difference does it make to anyone else? The point was that fat people are just as dangerous to themselves as smokers, but no one goes out and yells at the fat people for being fat.

I'll admit I did miss your separate last line on your first post. Honestly, I've never said anything to smokers except to a friend of a friend who insisted on smoking in MY house. (She was brought to a party I was giving by said friend.)

I would never go into a legally designated smoking area, and tell people they shouldn't smoke. That's their business. I'll just stay out of the designated smoking area.

[crbcrbrgv]

Originally Posted by aragx6

We're both missing the point. it's not you or me that's unfree. It's the bar owner who is unfree in Illinois.

You and me are free to go to whatever establishments we like. He's, however, not allowed to run his business the way he sees fit.

That's exactly right. Nobody forces people to go to a restaurant. If you don't want to go to a smoke filled restaurant, don't go to a smoke filled restaurant. Leave it up to the owner to decide though.

[Irishtom29]

Originally Posted by crbcrbrgv

That's exactly right. Nobody forces people to go to a restaurant. If you don't want to go to a smoke filled restaurant, don't go to a smoke filled restaurant. Leave it up to the owner to decide though.

Yes, which leads me to think that anti-smoking laws have less to do with health than with giving nosey parkers and finger-wagging old schoolmarms something to feel superior about and beat people over the head with. A modern form of Puritanism.

As for the stink, well at one time almost everybody stank. And there's many a day I came home from a hot day working in the steelmills and powerhouses stinking and a good honest stink it was. Not stinking shouldn't have the force of law behind it.

[linicx]

Originally Posted by hank0604

Damn, I guess I need to give my dad the uzi and .45 back.

I don't feel like my freedoms are limited here. On the contrary, I actually feel more liberated here. In Shreveport, LA where I grew up, everything was so small and backward that your future there was very limited. Here, though, I don't feel like there is anything (legal) that I wouldn't have the opportunity to do. Chicago is enabling.

You might be interested to know that Shreveport is all grown up into a beautiful city. I've visited several times and enjoy it.

Some of the comments the OP posted aren't exactly accurate. The no smoking ban that became law has been quite effective.

IL does have some stringent laws about carrying loaded guns. It dosn't mean you can't hunt or that you can't have guns at home, or that you can't carry your rifle in a truck or car. We can and we do. How you carry weapons in the vehicle is the question. It you are licensed to carry a side arm, then that is seperate issue.

Crime is not any worse in IL than anywhere else. So what if Chicago tax is 10%? You are not paying 10% for groceries. I lived in a city that 8% tax on everything incluing groceries and cars. In fact canned animal food was double taxed because could humans could eat it.

[hank0604]

Originally Posted by linicx

You might be interested to know that Shreveport is all grown up into a beautiful city. I've visited several times and enjoy it.
.

You're right, Shreveport is on the up-and-up. My parents and most of my old college buddies are still there, so I make it back a couple times a year. There is now a legitimate film industry there; if you want to work on the production/crew side of film making, you can do that in Shreveport. And like I still say, I have played golf from Destin to Vancouver and Austin to New York, and I still say that Shreveport has the best golf courses anywhere (combining factors like weather, price, tranquility, and pace of play).

[Lookout Kid]

Originally Posted by aragx6

We're both missing the point. it's not you or me that's unfree. It's the bar owner who is unfree in Illinois.

I couldn't care less about bar owners losing this "freedom". The smoking ban is wonderful, and it will never be repealed.