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All doctrines of the OT and NT are founded in Enoch, first and foremost.
Enoch teaches us that Satan and the satans are not fallen angels, and were made for what they do: tempt, test, try, and
accuse angels and men, in heaven.
The fallen Watchers who fell, became subject to the satans, who have one chief Satan over them. The Satans are the rulers of darkness in the heavenly places. When they are cast out of heaven, and down to earth, then down to Sheol, then into the Lake of Fire, the heavens and the earth will be "re-conciled" with the Father's Glory, which will be "All in All". -
That Satan is fallen is one of the most ignorant teachings of all who claim Scripture teaches that lie.
That Satan will be "saved" is the another one of the most ignorant teachings of all who claim that Scripture teaches that lie.
Blasphemy is done in ignorance, of those who do not know, but those who claim they have read such things in the Word as the salvation of the prince of darkness, have no excuse of ignorance on that subject, as there is no Scripture that teaches that Satan and his host were ever holy angels, nor do they desire to be holy angels. Their dominion is darkness, and to darkness they shall go -with all their prey, as eternal "food", for them to feast upon and torment forever.
The Satans are spirits in heaven, who were made to oppose men and angels. They cannot oppose God, for they were made to do what they do; but they tempt men and angels to oppose God. When they succeed, they get the fallen ones who are "cast aways" separated ones from the Light and the Glory, to be their eternal prey in the Lake of Fire.
1 Enoch
40 And after that I saw thousands of thousands and ten thousand times ten thousand, I saws multitude beyond number and reckoning, who stood before the Lord of Spirits.
2And on the four sides of the Lord of Spirits I saw four presences, different from those that sleep not, and I learnt their names: for the angel that went with me made known to me their names, and showed me all the hidden things.
3And I heard the voices of those four presences as they uttered praises before the Lord of glory.
4 The first voice blesses the Lord of Spirits for ever and ever.
5 And the second voice I heard blessing the Elect One and the elect ones who hang upon the Lord of Spirits.
6 And the third voice I heard pray and intercede for those who dwell on the earth and supplicate in the name of the Lord of Spirits.
7And I heard the fourth voice fending off the satans and forbidding them to come before the Lord of Spirits to accuse them who dwell on the earth.
8After that I asked the angel of peace who went with me, who showed me everything that is hidden: "Who are these four presences which I have seen and whose words I have heard and written down?"
9And he said to me: "This first is Michael, the merciful and long-suffering: and the second, who is set over all the diseases and all the wounds of the children of men, is Raphael: and the third, who is set over all the powers, is Gabriel: and the fourth, who is set over the repentance unto hope of those who inherit eternal life, is named Phanuel."
10And these are the four angels of the Lord of Spirits and the four voices I heard in those days.
41 And after that I saw all the secrets of the heavens, and how the kingdom is divided, and how the actions of men are weighed in the balance. 2And there I saw the mansions of the elect and the mansions of the holy, and mine eyes saw there all the sinners being driven from thence which deny the name of the Lord of Spirits, and being dragged off: and they could not abide because of the punishment which proceeds from the Lord of Spirits.
BTW: The four "voices/presences" seen by Enoch are the four beasts, living creatures, seen by John in Revelation. They have the same names as four of the Chief of the Chief angels [Watchers], but they are not the same creatures. They are most powerful, and are the "eyes of the LORD", being Ophannim, who have "eyes all round".
When the satans get cast out, and the heavens are regenerated and the satans and their lawful prey are in the Lake of Fire forever, then the heavens will be "clean", and God will be all in all. His Glory will fill every atom of the universe, except that which is "out", in the outer darkness, which is the blackness of darkness, and the Lake of Fire.
to perish in the book of Enoch is not annihilation, nor is it annihilation in the NT nor OT.
To perish is to be eternally unfit/ruined, for the purpose one -or something- is created for. In Adam's case, it is the state of being an "undying worm", a reject in the Lake of Fire, with no hope for being made a son of God and metamorphosing into the image of the New Man, ever.
For that reason, the Lake of Fire is called the second death, and that death is the separation from God that is totally irrevocable; unlike the first death of separation from God, which is ended in the Acceptable Year of our Lord's Atonement, in bringing us back, for the Glory to indwell us as He did our first fathe,r before the fall. He departed our creation and all things became subject to sin and death -to corruption.
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54 And I looked and turned to another part of the earth, and saw there a deep valley with burning fire. 2And they brought the kings and the mighty, and began to cast them into this deep valley. 3And there mine eyes saw how they made these their instruments, iron chains of immeasurable weight. 4And I asked the angel of peace who went with me, saying: "For whom are these chains being prepared?"
5And he said unto me: "These are being prepared for the hosts of Azazel, so that they may take them and cast them into the abyss of complete condemnation, and they shall cover their jaws with rough stones as the Lord of Spirits commanded.
6And Michael, and Gabriel, and Raphael, and Phanuel shall take hold of them on that great day, and cast them on that day into the burning furnace, that the Lord of Spirits may take vengeance on them for their unrighteousness in becoming subject to Satan and leading astray those who dwell on the earth. 7And in those days shall punishment come from the Lord of Spirits, and He will open all the chambers of waters which are above the heavens, and of the fountains which are beneath the earth. 8And all the waters shall be joined with the waters: that which is above the heavens is the masculine, and the water which is beneath the earth is the feminine. 9And they shall destroy all who dwell on the earth and those who dwell under the ends of the heaven. 10And when they have recognized their unrighteousness which they have wrought on the earth, then by these shall they perish."
Noah has a terrifying dream, and Enoch, his great-grandfather, appears to him in a vision, and tells him that there is no redemption for the fallen angels:
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65: 5And Enoch my grandfather came and stood by me, and said unto me: "Why hast thou cried unto me with a bitter cry and weeping? 6And a command has gone forth from the presence of the Lord concerning those who dwell on the earth that their ruin is accomplished because they have learnt all the secrets of the angels, and all the violence of the satans, and all their powers- the most secret ones- and all the power of those who practise sorcery, and the power of witchcraft, and the power of those who make molten images for the whole earth: 7And how silver is produced from the dust of the earth, and how soft metal originates in the earth. 8For lead and tin are not produced from the earth like the first: it is a fountain that produces them, and an angel stands therein, and that angel is pre-eminent." 9And after that my grandfather Enoch took hold of me by my hand and raised me up, and said unto me: "Go, for I have asked the Lord of Spirits as touching this commotion on the earth. 10And He said unto me: 'Because of their unrighteousness their judgement has been determined upon and shall not be withheld by Me for ever. Because of the sorceries which they have searched out and learnt, the earth and those who dwell upon it shall be destroyed.'
11"And these- they have no place of repentance for ever, because they have shown them what was hidden, and they are the damned: but as for thee, my son, the Lord of Spirits knows that thou art pure, and guiltless of this reproach concerning the secrets.
12"And He has destined thy name to be among the holy,
And will preserve thee amongst those who dwell on the earth,
And has destined thy righteous seed both for kingship and for great honours,
And from thy seed shall proceed a fountain of the righteous and holy without number for ever."
2 Peter 2:4For if God spared not the angels that sinned, but cast them down to hell, and delivered them into chains of darkness, to be reserved unto judgment;
This scripture below is giving a reference of Lucifer to the king of Babylon in a parable applying the similar judgment that had befallen Lucifer.
Isaiah 14: 4That thou shalt take up this proverb against the king of Babylon, and say, How hath the oppressor ceased! the golden city ceased!
Isaiah 14:12How art thou fallen from heaven, O Lucifer, son of the morning! how art thou cut down to the ground, which didst weaken the nations! 13For thou hast said in thine heart, I will ascend into heaven, I will exalt my throne above the stars of God: I will sit also upon the mount of the congregation, in the sides of the north:14I will ascend above the heights of the clouds; I will be like the most High.15Yet thou shalt be brought down to hell, to the sides of the pit. 16They that see thee shall narrowly look upon thee, and consider thee, saying, Is this the man that made the earth to tremble, that did shake kingdoms; 17That made the world as a wilderness, and destroyed the cities thereof; that opened not the house of his prisoners?
The Book of Enoch is a lie.
Angels cannot marry nor are they given in marriage. Jesus said so and I believe Him.
By your contentions in your OP, the sons of God cannot be fallen angels if they are being called the "sons of God".
This inconsistency and others is why it was not included in the Bible in the beginning and when it was included for a time, it became apparant that it was not in keeping with the rest of the scriptures: OT & NT.
All I ask from you is to take pause and go to Jesus in prayer for discernment because I really believe this is applicabel.
2 Timothy 4:1I charge thee therefore before God, and the Lord Jesus Christ, who shall judge the quick and the dead at his appearing and his kingdom; 2Preach the word; be instant in season, out of season; reprove, rebuke, exhort with all long suffering and doctrine. 3For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears; 4And they shall turn away their ears from the truth, and shall be turned unto fables.
Are you really going to hold the Book of Enoch over all the scriptures combined? Because if you are going to do that, you are holding a fable over all the scriptures.
The Book of Enoch is nothing more but a Jewish fable that turns from the truth.
Titus 1: 13This witness is true. Wherefore rebuke them sharply, that they may be sound in the faith; 14Not giving heed to Jewish fables, and commandments of men, that turn from the truth. 15Unto the pure all things are pure: but unto them that are defiled and unbelieving is nothing pure; but even their mind and conscience is defiled. 16They profess that they know God; but in works they deny him, being abominable, and disobedient, and unto every good work reprobate.
1 John 2:20But ye have an unction from the Holy One, and ye know all things. 21I have not written unto you because ye know not the truth, but because ye know it, and that no lie is of the truth.
Consider this truth as well:
John 3: 12If I have told you earthly things, and ye believe not, how shall ye believe, if I tell you of heavenly things? 13And no man hath ascended up to heaven, but he that came down from heaven, even the Son of man which is in heaven.
Romans 5:12Wherefore, as by one man sin entered into the world, and death by sin; and so death passed upon all men, for that all have sinned:
1 Corinthians 15: 50Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; neither doth corruption inherit incorruption. 51Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed, 52In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed. 53For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality. 54So when this corruptible shall have put on incorruption, and this mortal shall have put on immortality, then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written, Death is swallowed up in victory. 55O death, where is thy sting? O grave, where is thy victory? 56The sting of death is sin; and the strength of sin is the law. 57But thanks be to God, which giveth us the victory through our Lord Jesus Christ.
How can there be a Book of Enoch then?
Genesis 5:23And all the days of Enoch were three hundred sixty and five years: 24And Enoch walked with God: and he was not; for God took him.
It is an assumption that God took Enoch to Heaven.
2 Kings 2:11And it came to pass, as they still went on, and talked, that, behold, there appeared a chariot of fire, and horses of fire, and parted them both asunder; and Elijah went up by a whirlwind into heaven.
Compare the word "heaven" with Strong's dictionary of the original text.
Fear mongering nonsensical claptrap aimed at stirring trouble
I see you've found a new fixation, you started numerous threads on the R&P forum bashing the mormons with nonsensical rants about their beliefs that were rightfully and duly closed
Also you attacked the atheists and agnostics numerous times as well, and now you are starting on the universalists, how typical, I'm just surprised it took you this long
Have you considered this, if the book of Enoch is true, this life is set in stone anyway, and we are all just puppets on a string playing out the role we are supposed to be playing, and this surprises you
The last Book Enoch, in what is called 1 Enoch, is an indictment against the UR position, also.
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108 Another book which Enoch wrote for his son Methuselah and for those who will come after him, and keep the law in the last days.
2Ye who have done good shall wait for those days till an end is made of those who work evil, and an end of the might of the transgressors.
3And wait ye indeed till sin has passed away, for their names shall be blotted out of the book of life and out of the holy books, and their seed shall be destroyed for ever, and their spirits shall be slain, and they shall cry and make lamentation in a place that is a chaotic wilderness, and in the fire shall they burn; for there is no earth there.
4And I saw there something like an invisible cloud; for by reason of its depth I could not look over, and I saw a flame of fire blazing brightly, and things like shining mountains circling and sweeping to and fro.
5And I asked one of the holy angels who was with me and said unto him: "What is this shining thing? for it is not a heaven but only the flame of a blazing fire, and the voice of weeping and crying and lamentation and strong pain."
6And he said unto me: "This place which thou seest- here are cast the spirits of sinners and blasphemers, and of those who work wickedness, and of those who pervert everything that the Lord hath spoken through the mouth of the prophets- even the things that shall be.
7"For some of them are written and inscribed above in the heaven, in order that the angels may read them and know that which shall befall the sinners, and the spirits of the humble, and of those who have afflicted their bodies, and been recompensed by God; and of those who have been put to shame by wicked men: 8Who love God and loved neither gold nor silver nor any of the good things which are in the world, but gave over their bodies to torture. 9Who, since they came into being, longed not after earthly food, but regarded everything as a passing breath, and lived accordingly, and the Lord tried them much, and their spirits were found pure so that they should bless His name.
10"And all the blessings destined for them I have recounted in the books. And He hath assigned them their recompense, because they have been found to be such as loved heaven more than their life in the world, and though they were trodden under foot of wicked men, and experienced abuse and reviling from them and were put to shame, yet they blessed Me.
11"And now I will summon the spirits of the good who belong to the generation of light, and I will transform those who were born in darkness, who in the flesh were not recompensed with such honour as their faithfulness deserved.
12And I will bring forth in shining light those who have loved My holy name, and I will seat each on the throne of his honour. 13And they shall be resplendent for times without number; for righteousness is the judgement of God; for to the faithful He will give faithfulness in the habitation of upright paths.
14"And they shall see those who were born in darkness led into darkness, while the righteous shall be resplendent. 15And the sinners shall cry aloud and see them resplendent, and they indeed will go where days and seasons are prescribed for them."
Also you attacked the atheists and agnostics numerous times as well, and now you are starting on the universalists, how typical, I'm just surprised it took you this long
The Book of Enoch is used by Jesus for His Gospel.
Jesus is the Son of Man in heaven, whom Enoch saw, hidden, with God, in secret, who was God, who was to come, and in whose name the elect would be saved. The name was secret until its revealing. It was revealed to Jacob, first, over whom the pre-incarnate LORD God, the WORD, invoked His own secret, never before revealed, Name.
The name of the New Man then, which was"secret, and which would be revealed to the Elect", as Enoch reports, was revealed to Jacob first, by YHWH of hosts pre-incarnate, appearing to Jacob as [The] Messenger of YHWH.
Therefore the nation of Israel is called, by YHWH; "My people, called by My name";
Therefore Sirach says, "you invoked your name over us".
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2Ch 7:14 If my people, which are called by my name,
Sirach 36: 14 Have mercy on your people, upon whom your name is invoked:
Without the Torah and the prophets, the Son of Man in heaven would not have had the preparation for His revealing, and for His "Final, Acceptable Year of Atonement".
Enoch reveals the Son of Man in heaven as the One for whom the throne of Mount Eden, was made. When the Son of Man in heaven came down, He did not eave heaven empty, and was, because He was God, in the flesh of the second Man nature's creation [that second Man is called Israel], and He was in heaven, because He is Christ, the Anointed One, and the Person of YHWH the Word.
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Jhn 3:13 And no man hath ascended up to heaven, but he that came down from heaven, [even] the Son of man which is in heaven.
The ascension to heaven is to the throne of glory made for "man",, which Jesus is speaking of, and is not speaking of just going up to heaven, but ascending to the throne prepared for the Son of Man. His own prophet, Elijah ascended to heaven [but in his own untranslated body], and His own prophet, Enoch, ascended to heaven, translated in body; but the throne is reserved for the "Son of Man" who is in heaven, and who is come in flesh.
The Son of Man was in heaven, and He was on earth, in the flesh of Jesus the Christ, the Second Man, whose name, as the second human being, is "Israel".
Enoch saw the throne for the Son of Man, in heaven, and gave the prophesy of when the Son of Man would come down and sit on His throne, for the millennial Sabbath of earth's peace, when men live a thousand years, and do not die [except sinners at age 100], for they eat of the Tree of Life, from Mount Eden, transplanted to Mount Zion below the heavenly one, for the inhabitants of earth to eat of in the blessed kingdom of God come to earth, when the curse is removed and all the wicked are removed, and Peace reigns, and no one dies from corruption.
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24 And from thence I went to another place of the earth, and he showed me a mountain range of fire which burnt day and night. 2And I went beyond it and saw seven magnificent mountains all differing each from the other, and the stones thereof were magnificent and beautiful, magnificent as a whole, of glorious appearance and fair exterior: three towards the east, one founded on the other, and three towards the south, one upon the other, and deep rough ravines, no one of which joined with any other. 3And the seventh mountain was in the midst of these, and it excelled them in height, resembling the seat of a throne: and fragrant trees encircled the throne. 4And amongst them was a tree such as I had never yet smelt, neither was any amongst them nor were others like it: it had a fragrance beyond all fragrance, and its leaves and blooms and wood wither not for ever: and its fruit is beautiful, and its fruit resembles the dates of a palm. 5Then I said: "How beautiful is this tree, and fragrant, and its leaves are fair, and its blooms very delightful in appearance."
6Then answered Michael, one of the holy and honoured angels who was with me, and was their leader. {Top}
25 And he said unto me: "Enoch, why dost thou ask me regarding the fragrance of the tree, and why dost thou wish to learn the truth?"
2Then I answered him saying: "I wish to know about everything, but especially about this tree."
3And he answered saying: "This high mountain which thou hast seen, whose summit is like the throne of God, is His throne, where the Holy Great One, the Lord of Glory, the Eternal King, will sit, when He shall come down to visit the earth with goodness. 4And as for this fragrant tree no mortal is permitted to touch it till the great judgement, when He shall take vengeance on all and bring everything to its consummation for ever. 5It shall then be given to the righteous and holy. Its fruit shall be for food to the elect: it shall be transplanted to the holy place, to the temple of the Lord, the Eternal King.
6"Then shall they rejoice with joy and be glad,
And into the holy place shall they enter;
And its fragrance shall be in their bones,
And they shall live a long life on earth,
Such as thy fathers lived:
And in their days shall no sorrow or plague
Or torment or calamity touch them."
7Then blessed I the God of Glory, the Eternal King, who hath prepared such things for the righteous, and hath created them and promised to give to them.
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48 And in that place I saw the fountain of righteousness
Which was inexhaustible:
And around it were many fountains of wisdom:
And all the thirsty drank of them,
And were filled with wisdom,
And their dwellings were with the righteous and holy and elect.
2And at that hour that Son of Man was named
In the presence of the Lord of Spirits,
And his name before the Head of Days.
3Yea, before the sun and the signs were created, Before the stars of the heaven were made,
His name was named before the Lord of Spirits.
4He shall be a staff to the righteous whereon to stay themselves and not fall,
And he shall be the light of the Gentiles,
And the hope of those who are troubled of heart.
5All who dwell on earth shall fall down and worship before him,
And will praise and bless and celebrate with song the Lord of Spirits.
6And for this reason hath he been chosen and hidden before Him,
Before the creation of the world and for evermore.
7And the wisdom of the Lord of Spirits hath revealed him to the holy and righteous;
For he hath preserved the lot of the righteous,
Because they have hated and despised this world of unrighteousness,
And have hated all its works and ways in the name of the Lord of Spirits:
For in his name they are saved,
And according to his good pleasure hath it been in regard to their life.
8In these days downcast in countenance shall the kings of the earth have become,
And the strong who possess the land because of the works of their hands,
For on the day of their anguish and affliction they shall not be able to save themselves.
9And I will give them over into the hands of Mine elect:
As straw in the fire so shall they burn before the face of the holy:
As lead in the water shall they sink before the face of the righteous,
And no trace of them shall any more be found.
10And on the day of their affliction there shall be rest on the earth,
And before them they shall fall and not rise again:
And there shall be no one to take them with his hands and raise them:
For they have denied the Lord of Spirits and His Anointed.
The name of the Lord of Spirits be blessed.
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41 And after that I saw all the secrets of the heavens, and how the kingdom is divided, and how the actions of men are weighed in the balance. 2And there I saw the mansions of the elect and the mansions of the holy, and mine eyes saw there all the sinners being driven from thence which deny the name of the Lord of Spirits, and being dragged off: and they could not abide because of the punishment which proceeds from the Lord of Spirits.
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45 And this is the second Parable concerning those who deny the name of the dwelling of the holy ones and the Lord of Spirits.
2And into the heaven they shall not ascend,
And on the earth they shall not come:
Such shall be the lot of the sinners
Who have denied the name of the Lord of Spirits,
Who are thus preserved for the day of suffering and tribulation.
3On that day Mine Elect One shall sit on the throne of glory
And shall try their works,
And their places of rest shall be innumerable.
And their souls shall grow strong within them when they see Mine elect ones,
And those who have called upon My glorious name:
4Then will I cause Mine Elect One to dwell among them.
And I will transform the heaven and make it an eternal blessing and light:
5And I will transform the earth and make it a blessing:
And I will cause Mine elect ones to dwell upon it:
But the sinners and evil-doers shall not set foot thereon.
6For I have provided and satisfied with peace My righteous ones
And have caused them to dwell before Me:
But for the sinners there is judgement impending with Me,
So that I shall destroy them from the face of the earth.
So where did the doctrine of satan being a fallen angel come from? How did that lie infiltrate the Church and false sects shot off from it?
The banning of the Book of Enoch by the Christ rejecting Jews of the first century, and the much later banning of the Book of Enoch by men in the west, who followed the Christ rejecting Jews of the first century, made the great void of Truth of Revealed doctrines in the western Church, and that void was filled with all manner of imaginations of men who were groping in the dark, without the light of the revelations of Enoch.
Men who were without the light of the revelations of Enoch grasped for answers, then, for the origin of Satan, rejecting the Book that taught that the satans were spirits in heaven, which shows that the satans were made to tempt, test, and try and accuse, both holy angels and men, and for whom the Lake of Fire was created.
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Wondered why it took you this long
