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Let's settle this eisegetical nonsense. Let the readers of the forum decide whether this really means God WILL have all men come to salvation and the knowledge of the truth shall we?
1 Timothy 2:4 ὃς πάντας ἀνθρώπους θέλει σωθῆναι καὶ εἰς ἐπίγνωσιν ἀληθείας ἐλθεῖν. who desires all people to be saved and come to full knowledge of the truth. Verb: Third Person Present Active Indicative Singular
Matthew 16:24 τότε ὁ Ἰησοῦς εἶπεν τοῖς μαθηταῖς αὐτοῦ· εἴ τις θέλει ὀπίσω μου ἐλθεῖν, ἀπαρνησάσθω ἑαυτὸν καὶ ἀράτω τὸν σταυρὸν αὐτοῦ καὶ ἀκολουθείτω μοι.
Then Jesus said to his disciples, "If anyone desires to come after me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross, and follow me.
Verb: Third Person Present Active Indicative Singular
Matthew 27:43 πέποιθεν ἐπὶ τὸν θεόν, ῥυσάσθω νῦν εἰ θέλει αὐτόν· εἶπεν γὰρ ὅτι θεοῦ εἰμι υἱός.
He trusts in God. Let God deliver him now, if he wants him; for he said, 'I am the Son of God.'"
Verb: Third Person Present Active Indicative Singular
Mark 8:34 καὶ προσκαλεσάμενος τὸν ὄχλον σὺν τοῖς μαθηταῖς αὐτοῦ εἶπεν αὐτοῖς· εἴ τις θέλει ὀπίσω μου ἐλθεῖν / ἀκολουθεῖν, ἀπαρνησάσθω ἑαυτὸν καὶ ἀράτω τὸν σταυρὸν αὐτοῦ καὶ ἀκολουθείτω μοι.
He called the multitude to himself with his disciples, and said to them, "Whoever wants to come after me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross, and follow me.
Verb: Third Person Present Active Indicative Singular
Mark 9:35 καὶ καθίσας ἐφώνησεν τοὺς δώδεκα καὶ λέγει αὐτοῖς· εἴ τις θέλει πρῶτος εἶναι, ἔσται πάντων ἔσχατος καὶ πάντων διάκονος.
He sat down, and called the twelve; and he said to them, "If any man wants to be first, he shall be last of all, and servant of all."
Verb: Third Person Present Active Indicative Singular
Luke 5:39 [καὶ] οὐδεὶς πιὼν παλαιὸν θέλει νέον· λέγει γάρ· ὁ παλαιὸς χρηστός ἐστιν.
No man having drunk old wine immediately desires new, for he says, 'The old is better.'"
Verb: Third Person Present Active Indicative Singular
Luke 9:23 ἔλεγεν δὲ πρὸς πάντας· εἴ τις θέλει ὀπίσω μου ἔρχεσθαι ἀρνησάσθω ἑαυτὸν καὶ ἀράτω τὸν σταυρὸν αὐτοῦ καθ' ἡμέραν καὶ ἀκολουθείτω μοι.
He said to all, "If anyone desires to come after me, let him deny himself, take up his cross, and follow me.
Verb: Third Person Present Active Indicative Singular
Luke 13:31 ἐν αὐτῇ τῇ ὥρᾳ προσῆλθάν τινες Φαρισαῖοι λέγοντες αὐτῷ· ἔξελθε καὶ πορεύου ἐντεῦθεν ὅτι Ἡρῴδης θέλει σε ἀποκτεῖναι.
On that same day, some Pharisees came, saying to him, "Get out of here, and go away, for Herod wants to kill you."
Verb: Third Person Present Active Indicative Singular
John 3:8 τὸ πνεῦμα ὅπου θέλει πνεῖ καὶ τὴν φωνὴν αὐτοῦ ἀκούεις, ἀλλ' οὐκ οἶδας πόθεν ἔρχεται καὶ ποῦ ὑπάγει· οὕτως ἐστὶν πᾶς ὁ γεγεννημένος ἐκ τοῦ πνεύματος.
The wind blows where it wants to, and you hear its sound, but don't know where it comes from and where it is going. So is everyone who is born of the Spirit."
Verb: Third Person Present Active Indicative Singular
John 5:21 ὥσπερ γὰρ ὁ πατὴρ ἐγείρει τοὺς νεκροὺς καὶ ζῳοποιεῖ, οὕτως καὶ ὁ υἱὸς οὓς θέλει ζῳοποιεῖ.
For as the Father raises the dead and gives them life, even so the Son also gives life to whom he desires.
Verb: Third Person Present Active Indicative Singular
Acts 2:12 ἐξίσταντο δὲ πάντες καὶ διηποροῦντο / διηπόρουν, ἄλλος πρὸς ἄλλον λέγοντες· τί θέλει τοῦτο εἶναι;
They were all amazed, and were perplexed, saying one to another, "What does this mean?"
Verb: Third Person Present Active Indicative Singular
Acts 17:20 ξενίζοντα γάρ τινα εἰσφέρεις εἰς τὰς ἀκοὰς ἡμῶν· βουλόμεθα οὖν γνῶναι τίνα θέλει ταῦτα εἶναι.
For you bring certain strange things to our ears. We want to know therefore what these things mean."
Verb: Third Person Present Active Indicative Singular
Romans 9:18 ἄρα οὖν ὃν θέλει ἐλεεῖ ὃν δὲ θέλει σκληρύνει.
So then, he has mercy on whom he desires, and he hardens whom he desires.
Verb: Third Person Present Active Indicative Singular
Romans 9:18 ἄρα οὖν ὃν θέλει ἐλεεῖ ὃν δὲ θέλει σκληρύνει.
So then, he has mercy on whom he desires, and he hardens whom he desires.
Verb: Third Person Present Active Indicative Singular
1 Corinthians 7:36 Εἰ δέ τις ἀσχημονεῖν ἐπὶ τὴν παρθένον αὐτοῦ νομίζει, ἐὰν ᾖ ὑπέρακμος καὶ οὕτως ὀφείλει γίνεσθαι, ὃ θέλει ποιείτω οὐχ ἁμαρτάνει, γαμείτωσαν.
But if any man thinks that he is behaving inappropriately toward his virgin, if she is past the flower of her age, and if need so requires, let him do what he desires. He doesn't sin. Let them marry.
Verb: Third Person Present Active Indicative Singular
1 Corinthians 7:39 Γυνὴ δέδεται ἐφ' ὅσον χρόνον ζῇ ὁ ἀνὴρ αὐτῆς· ἐὰν δὲ κοιμηθῇ ὁ ἀνήρ, ἐλευθέρα ἐστὶν ᾧ θέλει γαμηθῆναι μόνον ἐν κυρίῳ.
A wife is bound by law for as long as her husband lives; but if the husband is dead, she is free to be married to whoever she desires, only in the Lord.
Verb: Third Person Present Active Indicative Singular
2 Thessalonians 3:10 καὶ γὰρ ὅτε ἦμεν πρὸς ὑμᾶς, τοῦτο παρηγγέλλομεν ὑμῖν ὅτι, εἴ τις οὐ θέλει ἐργάζεσθαι μηδὲ ἐσθιέτω.
For even when we were with you, we commanded you this: "If anyone will not work, neither let him eat."
Verb: Third Person Present Active Indicative Singular
Revelation 2:21 καὶ ἔδωκα αὐτῇ χρόνον ἵνα μετανοήσῃ καὶ οὐ θέλει μετανοῆσαι ἐκ τῆς πορνείας αὐτῆς.
I gave her time to repent, but she refuses to repent of her sexual immorality.
Verb: Third Person Present Active Indicative Singular
Revelation 11:5 καὶ εἴ τις αὐτοὺς θέλει ἀδικῆσαι πῦρ ἐκπορεύεται ἐκ τοῦ στόματος αὐτῶν καὶ κατεσθίει τοὺς ἐχθροὺς αὐτῶν· καὶ εἴ τις θελήσῃ αὐτοὺς ἀδικῆσαι, οὕτως δεῖ αὐτὸν ἀποκτανθῆναι.
If anyone desires to harm them, fire proceeds out of their mouth and devours their enemies. If anyone desires to harm them, he must be killed in this way.
Verb: Third Person Present Active Indicative Singular
It appears all you universalists have got it all wrong.
Bye Bye universalist paradigm of 1 Tim 2:4.
I rest my case, once again.
But there is more...as we will see in this thread.
I honestly don't understand what you think you have proven here sciotamicks. Are you saying it should be "desire" instead of "will"? What does that matter?
I honestly don't understand what you think you have proven here sciotamicks. Are you saying it should be "desire" instead of "will"? What does that matter?
I am saying what God desires, He does not always get...hence the Jews.
Matt 23:37O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, [thou] that killest the prophets, and stonest them which are sent unto thee, how often would I have gathered thy children together, even as a hen gathereth her chickens under [her] wings, and ye would not!
But the fat lady ain't sung yet. He WILL have the Jews or indeed the whole house of Israel saved.
Indeed, national Israel will yet come out of their graves and receive a new heart of flesh and have God's Laws written therein.
The Church, or spiritual Israel will be resurrected as spirit sons of god in the first resurrection.
The Church has not replaced national Israel. National Israel will possess the lands and the covenant promises. Gos is not Esau. Israel is the Lord's inheritance.
No replacement theology here. No one except Daniel Himself will stand for Daniel's lot on the 1335th Day.
Not only will national Israel be restored to its former estate, but the scriptures say that Sodom and her sisters and Samaria and her sisters will all be restored to their former estates as well. All these will be resurrected in flesh bodies.
All the infants and children and all who were born and who died throughout history without ever hearing of God or the name of the Christ will be resurrected in flesh bodies and will be afforeded 100 years under the teachings and admonishment of the resurrected sons of God. All will finally know the truth and learn righteousness without influence by Satan.
God is just and fair. We have been fortunate and have had churches, pastors, teachers, and our Bibles. Billions have died and many are alive today who have not had the opportunities we have had.
We must remember: Those saved today were predestinated for salvation from before the foundation of the world.
No one can come to salvation of his/her own volition or free will. No one can come unless the Father drags him to Him. Man's carnal mind is against God by the will of God. It is God's will that works in you to do His good pleasure. God purposely creates some vessels to honor and other vessels to dishonor. It is all His WILL.
The creature waits in eager anticipation for the manisfestation of the sons of God. Is the creature just plain stupid? Why on earth would the creature wait in eager anticipation for those who were going to cast him/her into a lake of fire?
But the fat lady ain't sung yet. He WILL have the Jews or indeed the whole house of Israel saved.
Indeed, national Israel will yet come out of their graves and receive a new heart of flesh and have God's Laws written therein.
The Church, or spiritual Israel will be resurrected as spirit sons of god in the first resurrection.
The Church has not replaced national Israel. National Israel will possess the lands and the covenant promises. Gos is not Esau. Israel is the Lord's inheritance.
No replacement theology here. No one except Daniel Himself will stand for Daniel's lot on the 1335th Day.
Not only will national Israel be restored to its former estate, but the scriptures say that Sodom and her sisters and Samaria and her sisters will all be restored to their former estates as well. All these will be resurrected in flesh bodies.
All the infants and children and all who were born and who died throughout history without ever hearing of God or the name of the Christ will be resurrected in flesh bodies and will be afforeded 100 years under the teachings and admonishment of the resurrected sons of God. All will finally know the truth and learn righteousness without influence by Satan.
God is just and fair. We have been fortunate and have had churches, pastors, teachers, and our Bibles. Billions have died and many are alive today who have not had the opportunities we have had.
We must remember: Those saved today were predestinated for salvation from before the foundation of the world.
No one can come to salvation of his/her own volition or free will. No one can come unless the Father drags him to Him. Man's carnal mind is against God by the will of God. It is God's will that works in you to do His good pleasure. God purposely creates some vessels to honor and other vessels to dishonor. It is all His WILL.
The creature waits in eager anticipation for the manisfestation of the sons of God. Is the creature just plain stupid? Why on earth would the creature wait in eager anticipation for those who were going to cast him/her into a lake of fire?
Get real!!
Rhetoric and eisegesis. Can you provide any scriptural foundation to your claims, or is this just hot air, for the sake of hot air?
Either rebutt the OP with sound exegsis, or simply bow out and conceded in your own philosophies and ideaologies. Because that is what it is, ideology, not theology.
What do you want first? It would be lengthy indeed for me to respond with scriptures for all of this.
What do you want first? The predestination scriptures? The vessels created to dishonor scriptures?
The manisfestation of the sons of God scriptures? The child living to be 100 years old scriptures?
What do you want first?
Lorraine Day, M.D. Christians say that their religion is founded on the Bible, and the Bible ONLY! If the Bible says it, then it must be true. But there's one word that Christians love to hate --- or at least they try to ignore--- and that's the word predestination, even though it appears in the Bible FOUR times: Romans 8: 29, 30 and Eph. 1:5, 11. "And we know that ALL things work together for good to them that love God, to them who are called according to His purpose.
Because whom He foreknew, He also predestinated to be conformed to the image of His Son,that he might be the firstborn among many brethren. Moreover whom He did predestinate, them He also called: and whom He called, them He also justified: and whom He justified, them He also glorified." Romans 8:28,29,30
"According as He hath chosen us in Him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before Him in love: having predestinated us unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to Himself, according to the good pleasure of His will." Eph 1:5 "...in whom we also have been chosen to an inheritance, being predestinatedaccording to the purpose of Him who worketh ALL things after the counsel of His own will." Eph 1:11
These texts are clear: God has predestinated those whom He chose before the foundation of the world. Since the Bible talks about predestination, then we at least have to deal with it. What does it mean?
These texts either mean that God has predestinated some to be saved and some to be lost, (which most of us can't agree with since God doesn't play favorites), or God has predestinated ALL to be saved. This makes everyone shudder to think that God could actually be so wonderful that He could draw ALL back to Him and put in their hearts the desire to be like Him, even though that's what God's Word says He will do.
God will be "ALL in ALL" (1 Cor 15:28)
"He is the Saviour of ALL mankind, especially of those who believe" (1 Tim 4:10)
"God wills that ALL men be saved, and come to a knowledge of the truth"(1 Tim 2:1-6)
"And I, if I be lifted up from the earth, WILL draw ALL unto me" (John 12:32).
God is not willing that any should perish but that ALL should come to repentance.
2 Peter 3:9
There are 16 additional texts which give this same message.
Isaiah 65:20 There shall be no more thence an infant of days, nor an old man that hath not filled his days: for the child shall die [to self; in the 'lake of fire.'- This is a positive statement] an hundred years old; but the sinner [who has not yet died to self in the 'lake of fire] being an hundred years old shall be accursed [this is not a positive statement].
There is only one 'new heavens and new earth.' It comes down from God out of heaven after the millennium. It is then, and not until then, that "the fulness of the Gentiles comes in". Sodom returning to God as resurrected flesh and blood bodies at the great white throne judgment symbolizes 'the fulness of the Gentiles."
Ezekiel 16:55When thy sisters, Sodom and her daughters, shall return to their former estate, and Samaria and her daughters shall return to their former estate [this is at the white throne judgment, after the millennium], then thou and thy daughters shall return to your former estate.
Many who teach universal reconciliation use this scripture to prove that even Sodom will be saved. But even they do not notice the "when?...then!..." part of this verse.
When eschatology is not the subject, as in the book of Revelation, we sometimes make it the point. When eschatology is the point of a scripture ("when?... then!... ) we some times ignore it. The subject of Ezekiel 16 is the salvation of 'Judah and Jerusalem' who have committed sins that are greater then her sisters 'Sodom and Samaria.' In spite of this fact, God declares that He is yet going to honor His promise to redeem His people 'Israel... according to the flesh.' But this will be done on His timetable. And He tells us that His time for the salvation of Israel is "when Sodom and her daughters" are saved.
Before I get bombarded with your posts accusing me of saying there is no eschatology in Revelation, let me point out that I did not say that. What I did say is "eschatology is not the subject...of the book of Revelation. The subject of the book of Revelation is "the Revelation of Jesus Christ. While that is accomplished in a process of opening 7 seals, the seals and their order is not the subject.
The subject is the Revelation of Jesus Christ, and since it is addressed to "him that hath an ear" in "the seven churches", it is therefore Jesus Christ in us that is the subject of this book. Eschatology is a distant second to this, the main theme, of this book.
Now since "Judah and Jerusalem" are the subject of both Ezekiel 16 and Isaiah 65:20, it should be clear that this is one and the same event being discussed in these two scriptures. This is the time of the day of the 'second resurrection,' the "great white throne judgment" and the "lake of fire."
While this is certainly not the "better resurrection" of Hebrews 11, neither is it the negative thing that the Christian religion has made it out to be. After all "death and hell are cast into the lake of fire." The "lake of fire is nothing less than the "destruction of death" mentioned by Paul in 1 Corinthians 15.
1 Corinthians 15:25 For he must reign, till he hath put all enemies under his feet. 1 Corinthians 15:26 The last enemy that shall be destroyed is death.
How is this accomplished? Who is it that will "judge this world?
1 Corinthians 6:2 Do ye not know thatthe saints shall judge the world?
Are "the saints" then this "lake of fire?" What say the scriptures?
Isaiah 33:14 The sinners in Zion are afraid; fearfulness hath surprised the hypocrites. Who among us shall dwell with the devouring fire? who among us shall dwell with everlasting burnings? Isaiah 33:15He that walketh righteously, and speaketh uprightly; he that despiseth the gain of oppressions, that shaketh his hands from holding of bribes, that stoppeth his ears from hearing of blood, and shutteth his eyes from seeing evil;
Yes, it was the three Hebrew children who were, in type, right at home with "one like unto the son of God" in Nebuchadnezzar's fiery furnace. Now since "our God is a consuming fire" and since "when He shall appear, we shall be like Him" why would not those who are in Christ be represented by a "lake (not an 'ocean because "many are called but few are chosen') of fire?"
[CENTER]Lake Of Fire Revealed In Genesis
[/CENTER]
Those in that 'lake of fire are typified by Joseph's brothers. They were 'tormented' in Joseph's presence.
Genesis 42:8 And Joseph knew his brethren, but they knew not him. Genesis 42:9 And Joseph remembered the dreams which he dreamed of them, and said unto them, Ye [are] spies; to see the nakedness of the land ye are come. Genesis 42:10 And they said unto him, Nay, my lord, but to buy food are thy servants come. Genesis 42:11 We are all one man's sons; we are true [honest] men, thy servants are no spies. Genesis 42:12 And he said unto them, Nay, but to see the nakedness of the land ye are come. Genesis 42:13 And they said, Thy servants are twelve brethren, the sons of one man in the land of Canaan; and, behold, the youngest is this day with our father, and one is not. Genesis 42:14 And Joseph said unto them, That is it that I spake unto you, saying, Ye are spies: Genesis 42:15 Hereby ye shall be proved: By the life of Pharaoh ye shall not go forth hence, except your youngest brother come hither. Genesis 42:16 Send one of you, and let him fetch your brother, and ye shall be kept in prison, that your words may be proved, whether [there be any] truth in you: or else by the life of Pharaoh surely ye are spies. Genesis 42:17 And he put them all together into ward three days. Genesis 42:18 And Joseph said unto them the third day, This do, and live; for I fear God: Genesis 42:19 If ye be true [honest] men, let one of your brethren be bound in the house of your prison: go ye, carry corn for the famine of your houses: Genesis 42:20 But bring your youngest brother unto me; so shall your words be verified, and ye shall not die. And they did so. Genesis 42:21 And they said one to another, We are verily guilty concerning our brother, in that we saw the anguish of his soul, when he besought us, and we would not hear; therefore is this distress come upon us. Genesis 42:22 And Reuben answered them, saying, Spake I not unto you, saying, Do not sin against the child; and ye would not hear? therefore, behold, also his blood is required. Genesis 42:23And they knew not that Joseph understood them; for he spake unto them by an interpreter.
Revelation 14:10 The same shall drink of the wine of the wrath of God, which is poured out without mixture into the cup of his indignation; and he shall be tormented with fire and brimstone in the presence of the holy angels, and in the presence of the Lamb:
This is just the beginning of the torment of Joseph's brothers, not because Joseph wanted to torment them so long, but because they could never believe that Joseph was not like them and would not seek revenge as soon as Jacob died.
Joseph never bothered to correct this view of himself until after the death of his father. In other words:
Psalms 18:26 With the pure thou wilt shew thyself pure; and with the froward thou wilt shew thyself froward. Luke 19:22 And he saith unto him, Out of thine own mouth will I judge thee, thou wicked servant. Thou knewest that I was an austere man, taking up that I laid not down, and reaping that I did not sow:
Did Christ bother to correct this evil man? No, that is not the time nor the way in which Christ operates. Here are His own words:
Luke 12:49 I am come to send fire on the earth; and what will I, if it be already kindled?
What Is The 'Fire?'
What exactly is this fire? It is the same fire in every case.
Hebrews 12:29 For our God is a consuming fire.
But this 'fire' comes to some "predestined...few" while they are yet in this body of flesh. These are those referred to by Christ when He said:
John 12:24 Verily, verily, I say unto you, Except a corn of wheat fall into the ground and die [to self and to the flesh], it abideth alone: but if it die [to self and the flesh], it bringeth forth much fruit.
Christ spoke of this "blessed and holy" few when he said:
Mark 9:49For every one shall be salted with fire, and every sacrifice shall be salted with salt.
Paul spoke of these few also:
1 Corinthians 3:13Every man's work shall be made manifest: for the day shall declare it, because it shall be revealed by fire; and the fire shall try every man's work of what sort it is. 1 Corinthians 3:14 If any man's work abide which he hath built thereupon, he shall receive a reward. 1 Corinthians 3:15 If any man's work shall be burned, he shall suffer loss: but he himself shall be saved; yet so as by fire.
Peter spoke of this same group of overcomers in every generation since Christ:
1 Peter 4:12 Beloved, think it not strange concerning the fiery trial which is to try you, as though some strange thing happened unto you: 1 Peter 4:13 But rejoice, inasmuch as ye are partakers of Christ's sufferings; that, when his glory shall be revealed, ye may be glad also with exceeding joy.
The Sinner
And what of the rest of mankind?
There will be every thing from Joseph Stalin who killed millions of his own people, to aborted babies cast into the lake of fire. Here Christ reveals the principle on which they will all be judged:
Luke 12:46 The lord of that servant will come in a day when he looketh not for him, and at an hour when he is not aware, and will cut him in sunder, and will appoint him his portion [as a messenger of Satan in the lake of fire] with the unbelievers. Luke 12:47 And that servant, which knew his lord's will, and prepared not [himself], neither did according to his will, shall be beaten with many stripes. Luke 12:48 But he that knew not, and did commit things worthy of stripes, shall be beaten with few stripes. For unto whomsoever much is given, of him shall be much required: and to whom men have committed much, of him they will ask the more.
This is just Christ's way of repeating the message of Isa 65:20:
Isaiah 65:20 There shall be no more thence an infant of days, nor an old man that hath not filled his days: for the [repentant] child shall die [to self] an hundred years old; but the [unrepentant] sinner being an hundred years old [ and still not 'dead to self'] shall be accursed.
What and When is Judgment Day?
We are led to believe that 'judgment' is a negative experience. Indeed it is negative for the flesh, but it is always positive for the spirit:
1 Corinthians 5:5 To deliver such an one unto Satan for the destruction of the flesh, that the spirit may be saved in the day of the Lord Jesus.
This echoes the teaching Paul had just given these Corinthian brothers concerning judgment:
1 Corinthians 3:13Every man's work shall be made manifest: for the day shall declare it, because it shall be revealed by fire; and the fire shall try every man's work of what sort it is. 1 Corinthians 3:14 If any man's work abide which he hath built thereupon, he shall receive a reward. 1 Corinthians 3:15If any man's work shall be burned, he shall suffer loss: but he himself shall be saved; yet so as by fire.
When does this take place? It is at different times for different groups. There are two scriptural groups for two separate judgments. Those who are 'chosen' out of the 'called' are being judged even as we speak. All others will be judged at the 'great white throne judgment.'
Here are the scriptures:
First Christ:
Matthew 21:44 And whosoever shall fall on this stone [judge himself now while yet in the flesh] shall be broken: but on whomsoever it shall fall [in the lake of fire, at the white throne judgment], it will grind him to powder.
Now Paul:
1 Corinthians 11:31 For if we would judge ourselves [now], we should not be judged. 1 Corinthians 11:32 But when we are [now] judged, we are chastened of the Lord, that we should not be condemned [to the great white throne judgment] with the world.
"When we are judged we are chastened of the Lord" is just as true of the white throne judgment as it is of our "chastening of the Lord" at this time. Judgment is good!
Here is Paul again:
Hebrews 12:6 For whom the Lord loveth he chasteneth, and scourgeth every son whom he receiveth.
And finally, here is Peter:
1 Peter 4:17 For the time is come that judgment must begin at the house of God: and if it first begin at us, what shall the end be of them that obey not the gospel of God?
If God is gracious enough to us that we are in the first resurrection, it will be because He has seen fit to "first begin at us" with judgment. But judgment always follows death. It is not vice-versa.
Hebrews 9:27 And as it is appointed unto men once to die, but after this the judgment: Hebrews 9:28 So Christ was once offered to bear the sins of many; and unto them that look for him shall he appear the second time without sin unto salvation.
Those who receive these words in a natural sense are not being 'judged... now.' "For the time is come that judgment must begin at the house of God..."
John 12:24 Verily, verily, I say unto you, Except a corn of wheat fall into the ground and die [now while yet in the flesh], it abideth alone: but if it die, it bringeth forth much fruit.
So, if you are wondering what judgment day will be like if you are the chosen of Christ, wonder no longer. You are in that day.
It is a day of being "broken on that rejected stone." It is a day of "falling into the ground and dying to bring forth much fruit." It is a day that will burn and purify the "gold, silver and precious stones."
1 Peter 4:12 Beloved, think it not strange concerning the fiery trial which is to try you, as though some strange thing happened unto you: 1 Peter 4:13 But rejoice, inasmuch as ye are partakers of Christ's sufferings; that, when his glory shall be revealed, ye may be glad also with exceeding joy. 1 Peter 4:14 If ye be reproached for the name of Christ, happy [are ye]; for the spirit of glory and of God resteth upon you: on their part he is evil spoken of, but on your part he is glorified.
We may suffer now, but the reward that awaits us is beyond our wildest dreams. "When his glory shall be revealed, ye may be glad also with exceeding joy."
I hope I have been of some service.
I am saying what God desires, He does not always get...hence the Jews.
Matt 23:37O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, [thou] that killest the prophets, and stonest them which are sent unto thee, how often would I have gathered thy children together, even as a hen gathereth her chickens under [her] wings, and ye would not!
Christ wanted them, but did they?
Proven wrong again.
Your premise is seriously flawed here if you think because God only "desires" all men to be saved, that it won't happen. Your premise is seriously flawed if you think God desires something that He doesn't ever get.
The main error is assuming Matt 23:37 means He will never get the Jews. Like Hezzekiah said above - the fat lady ain't sung yet.
God will achieve what He desires. But don't take my word for it - just look at what scripture says:
Isaiah 46:10 I make known the end from the beginning,
from ancient times, what is still to come.
I say: My purpose will stand,
and I will do all that I please.
Job 23:13 "But He is unique and who can turn Him?
And what His soul desires, that He does.
Isaiah 55:11 So will My word be which goes forth from My mouth;
It will not return to Me empty,
Without accomplishing what I desire,
And without succeeding in the matter for which I sent it.
So we see that God does all that He pleases and His word does not return void without accomplishing what He desires. Since He desires to save all men, He will do it - it will be accomplished by His word.
Peace out bro - its good news.
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