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Old 10-04-2010, 09:07 AM
 
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"Then Jesus said unto them, Take heed and beware of the leaven of the Pharisees and of the Sadducees" (Mat 16:6).

"Then understood they how that he bade them not beware of the leaven of bread, but of the doctrine of the Pharisees and of the Sadducees" (Mat 16:12).

And what did the Pharisees and Sadducees teach?
The Pharisees taught eternal torment.
The Sadducees taught eternal annihilation.

Jesus taught age-during chastening.

BEWARE the teaching of the Pharisees and Sadducees!
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Old 10-04-2010, 09:31 AM
 
Location: Italy
6,387 posts, read 5,967,738 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Eusebius View Post
"Then Jesus said unto them, Take heed and beware of the leaven of the Pharisees and of the Sadducees" (Mat 16:6).

"Then understood they how that he bade them not beware of the leaven of bread, but of the doctrine of the Pharisees and of the Sadducees" (Mat 16:12).

And what did the Pharisees and Sadducees teach?
The Pharisees taught eternal torment.
The Sadducees taught eternal annihilation.

Jesus taught age-during chastening.

BEWARE the teaching of the Pharisees and Sadducees!
Eusebius,
I am not going to say that you are wrong, because you might be right.
However, we can read that one gospel tells us what the Pharisees and Sadducees were guilty of, and that was hypocrisy. See Luke 12:1.

Although the doctrine of eternal damnation and condemnation in general is not what the early church preached, so you may be right also.

Blessings!
brian
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Old 10-04-2010, 11:31 AM
 
17,966 posts, read 14,902,788 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ahigherway View Post
Eusebius,
I am not going to say that you are wrong, because you might be right.
However, we can read that one gospel tells us what the Pharisees and Sadducees were guilty of, and that was hypocrisy. See Luke 12:1.

Although the doctrine of eternal damnation and condemnation in general is not what the early church preached, so you may be right also.

Blessings!
brian
Hi Brian, good points. I'm not saying you are wrong either, but how did the Pharisees teach hypocrisy? Could it be in this instance that Jesus meant the bad influence of the Pharisees as a leavening agent rather than a humbling one?

In one instance Jesus was bringing out the teachings of the Pharisees and Sadducees. But here He is singling out just the Pharisees and their leaven?

I think Jesus, in saying "beware of the leaven of the Pharisees which is hypocrisy" meant this:

"LEAVEN is a ferment which spoils whatever it touches, until it is stopped by heat. It is a symbol of evil and wickedness (1 Cor.5:8), and, among religious zealots like the Pharisees, hypocrisy (Luke 12:1). It takes very little of it to swell a vast amount of dough, and a tiny measure of evil will spoil a whole group of saints. When there was a serious moral lapse among the Corinthians, and they were puffed up over it, Paul called for the most energetic action" (Unsearchable Riches vol.49, p.39).
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Old 10-04-2010, 11:38 AM
 
Location: Nashville, TN
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Try again. They were hypocrites who had no love for God in their hearts. They were more interested in looking good for men on the outside. Their motives were wrong.
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Old 10-04-2010, 12:57 PM
 
17,966 posts, read 14,902,788 times
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I don't have to try again. I got it right the first time. You try again... till you get it right.
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Old 10-04-2010, 01:15 PM
 
Location: Houston
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The bottom line is, you're probably right, but no one likes it when their faith is based principally on the fear of eternal damnation or eternal nothingness.
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Old 10-04-2010, 02:16 PM
 
Location: Italy
6,387 posts, read 5,967,738 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Eusebius View Post
Hi Brian, good points. I'm not saying you are wrong either, but how did the Pharisees teach hypocrisy? Could it be in this instance that Jesus meant the bad influence of the Pharisees as a leavening agent rather than a humbling one?

In one instance Jesus was bringing out the teachings of the Pharisees and Sadducees. But here He is singling out just the Pharisees and their leaven?

I think Jesus, in saying "beware of the leaven of the Pharisees which is hypocrisy" meant this:

"LEAVEN is a ferment which spoils whatever it touches, until it is stopped by heat. It is a symbol of evil and wickedness (1 Cor.5:8), and, among religious zealots like the Pharisees, hypocrisy (Luke 12:1). It takes very little of it to swell a vast amount of dough, and a tiny measure of evil will spoil a whole group of saints. When there was a serious moral lapse among the Corinthians, and they were puffed up over it, Paul called for the most energetic action" (Unsearchable Riches vol.49, p.39).
I believe it's also true, that the Pharisees and Sadducees are symbolic of the flesh of man, in every one of us, which is selfish and full of envy, and which must continue until the coming of Christ within us cleanses the temple (us) and His Throne (our heart) is where He sits.

Blessings!
brian
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Old 10-04-2010, 05:34 PM
 
5,503 posts, read 5,180,755 times
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Default What is a leaven?

A leavening agent is any one of a number of substances used in doughs and batters that cause a foaming action which lightens and softens the finished product. The leavening agent incorporates gas bubbles into the dough—this may be air incorporated by mechanical means, but usually it is carbon dioxide produced by biological agents, or by chemical agents reacting with moisture, heat, acidity, or other triggers. When a dough or batter is mixed, the starch in the flour mixes with the water in the dough to form a matrix (often supported further by proteins like gluten or other polysaccharides like pentosans or xanthan gum), then gelatinizes and "sets"; the holes left by the gas bubbles remain.

This is a metaphor about how "The Word of God" had been mixed with YEAST, to make it puff up until there is nothing left to consume but air bubbles...not substantial enough to sate the spiritual hunger...

Peace!
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Old 10-05-2010, 03:58 PM
 
9,360 posts, read 8,942,760 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Eusebius View Post
"Then Jesus said unto them, Take heed and beware of the leaven of the Pharisees and of the Sadducees" (Mat 16:6).

"Then understood they how that he bade them not beware of the leaven of bread, but of the doctrine of the Pharisees and of the Sadducees" (Mat 16:12).

And what did the Pharisees and Sadducees teach?
The Pharisees taught eternal torment.
The Sadducees taught eternal annihilation.

Jesus taught age-during chastening.

BEWARE the teaching of the Pharisees and Sadducees!
Where did you find this in the Word of God ? ........ The Pharisees were religous legalist who rejected faith in God and took every thing literal , plus rejecting the Word and character of The Lord God for the authority of the cleric.......... Sadducees were even more religous and did not believe in the life after and did not believe in the Angels of the Lord God . did not believe in the devil ......... The leaven of these doctrines is arrogant pride, see leaven puffs up bread to be eaten , the leaven doctrines is people who are hotty puffed up pride ideas in their heart before their God
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Old 10-05-2010, 05:14 PM
 
Location: Seattle, Wa
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Verse 7: And they reasoned among themselves, saying, [It is] because we have taken no bread.

Your inferrence is incorrect.
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