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Uh, HotinAZ, where did I say anything about "world"? The verse says "the creation." The creation is going to be freed into the glorious freedom of the children of God.
Is that not wonderful news?
Uh, Eusebius, you did by quoting the verses from John and 1st John. Do you even read what you post?
Uh, Eusebius, you did by quoting the verses from John and 1st John. Do you even read what you post?
Oh, now I see where you are coming from:
Joh 4:42 Besides, to the woman they said that "No longer because of your speaking are we believing, for we ourselves have heard Him, and we are aware that this truly is the Saviour of the world, the Christ."
1Jo 4:14 And we have gazed upon Him, and are testifying that the Father has dispatched the Son, the Saviour of the world."
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HotinAZ wrote: First off, the 'world' you speak of is NOT the planet earth, and her inhabitants. The 'world' Christ speaks of, is HIS WORLD, HIS KINGDOM.
So, in John 4:42 did those Samaritan women believe Jesus was just the Saviour of His kingdom? So, "God so loved Christ's kingdom that He gave His only begotten Son." Is that what you think?
Luk 12:29 And do not you be seeking what you may be eating and what you may be drinking, and be not in suspense. (30) For, for all these the nations of the world are seeking. Now your Father is aware that you need these."
So the nations of Christ's kingdom are seeking eating and drinking?
HotinAZ, where it states that God loves the world it means He loves all the people of the world.
Where Jesus is the saviour of the world it means He is the Saviour of all the people of the world.
The other day I read in the Bible that the Whole Creation Freed into the Believer's Freedom.
There must be some mistake.
Concordant Literal: Rom 8:21 that the creation itself, also, shall be freed from the slavery of corruption into the glorious freedom of the children of God."
And I thought, there must be a mistake so i looked in some other bibles for this heresy too:
American Bible Union Version 1865: that the creation itself also shall be delivered from the bondage of corruption into the glorious liberty of the children of God.
(ALT) because even the creation itself will be set free from the slavery of the corruption into the liberty of the glory of the children of God.
(ASV) that the creation itself also shall be delivered from the bondage of corruption into the liberty of the glory of the children of God.
(CEV) that creation would be set free from decay and would share in the glorious freedom of his children.
(ESV) that the creation itself will be set free from its bondage to decay and obtain the freedom of the glory of the children of God.
(GNB) that creation itself would one day be set free from its slavery to decay and would share the glorious freedom of the children of God.
(HCSB) that the creation itself will also be set free from the bondage of corruption into the glorious freedom of God's children.
(ISV) that the creation itself would also be set free from slavery to decay in order to share the glorious freedom of God's children.
(LITV) that also the creation will be freed from the slavery of corruption to the freedom of the glory of the children of God.
(MKJV) that the creation itself also shall be delivered from the bondage of corruption into the glorious liberty of the children of God.
(MSG) until both creation and all the creatures are ready and can be released at the same moment into the glorious times ahead. Meanwhile, the joyful anticipation deepens. !
In King James Version 8;16¨The Spirit itself beareth witness with our spirit, that we are children of God.....verse19-21..for the earnest expectation of the CREATURE waiteth for the manifestation of the sons of God.... for the CREATURE was made subject to vanity not willingly but by reason of him who hath sudjected the same in hope....... Because the CREATURE itself also shall be delivered from the bondage of corruption into the glorious liberty of the children of God............ Apostle Paul is talking about sinners of this world authority to the spirit of corruption being freed by redemption of Jesus Christ to the authority of Holy Spirit, or people becoming born again and receiving the Lords Holy Spirit to keep and protect and transform into this New Creation of Born again believers...... This the penticostal experience that all Christians go through when they receive Jesus Spirit and live the life in relationship with Jesus, and not a end time judgement gift for people who died and lost their souls
In King James Version 8;16¨The Spirit itself beareth witness with our spirit, that we are children of God.....verse19-21..for the earnest expectation of the CREATURE waiteth for the manifestation of the sons of God.... for the CREATURE was made subject to vanity not willingly but by reason of him who hath sudjected the same in hope....... Because the CREATURE itself also shall be delivered from the bondage of corruption into the glorious liberty of the children of God............ Apostle Paul is talking about sinners of this world authority to the spirit of corruption being freed by redemption of Jesus Christ to the authority of Holy Spirit, or people becoming born again and receiving the Lords Holy Spirit to keep and protect and transform into this New Creation of Born again believers...... This the penticostal experience that all Christians go through when they receive Jesus Spirit and live the life in relationship with Jesus, and not a end time judgement gift for people who died and lost their souls
The creature is a creation. The children of God already have freedom. The creature which is the creation all will be freed from the slavery of corruption into the glorious freedom of the children of God. Presently the creature or creation does not have this glorious freedom but they will. Rest assured, they will.
Also, there is nothing in Romans 8 about people having a Pentacostal experience.
Joh 4:42 Besides, to the woman they said that "No longer because of your speaking are we believing, for we ourselves have heard Him, and we are aware that this truly is the Saviour of the world, the Christ."
1Jo 4:14 And we have gazed upon Him, and are testifying that the Father has dispatched the Son, the Saviour of the world."
Sweet!
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So, in John 4:42 did those Samaritan women believe Jesus was just the Saviour of His kingdom?
The world in that context, was Israel. Israel was prophesied to have the Redeemer come from her. They were looking for their King.
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So, "God so loved Christ's kingdom that He gave His only begotten Son." Is that what you think?
Again, this is talking of those of the faith of Abraham, Issac, and Jacob. It includes more than just Israel, because it is the realization of the promise TO Abraham.
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Luk 12:29 And do not you be seeking what you may be eating and what you may be drinking, and be not in suspense. (30) For, for all these the nations of the world are seeking. Now your Father is aware that you need these."
So the nations of Christ's kingdom are seeking eating and drinking?
No, those of Christ's kingdom are seeking Him, not food and drink. We rely on the Father for these things, don't you? Everyone else is running to and fro looking to be self satisfied, hense the analogy of food and drink. Primary concerns.
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HotinAZ, where it states that God loves the world it means He loves all the people of the world.
God does love all, and seeks their repentance unto forgiveness through His Son, who died so that they MAY live in union with Him. If not? Then THEY have reaped what they have sown, which is death eternal.
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Where Jesus is the saviour of the world it means He is the Saviour of all the people of the world.
For those who believe. For those IN His Kingdom. Those outside, refusing to come in, are not saved. It is your doctrinal blindness that refuses to let you see what a simple word,,,"world" means. UR gets in the way of the Truth, so by this, you are enslaved to a false doctrine.
Romans 8:21 is talking about the κτίσις - which is humankind, specifically, those who place their faith in Christ.
Where on earth did you get this absurdly delimited definition of humankind? You have serious comprehension problems, sciota.
(BTW humankind in Greek is ανθρωπότητα)
Last edited by MysticPhD; 10-11-2010 at 09:46 PM..
Where on earth did you get this absurdly delimited definition of humankind? You have serious comprehension problems, sciota.
Why do you have to be so mean Mystic? I mean, always, you bring out the worst in people....not me...anymore.
I love you, but I believe you are in error. I urge you to study κτίσις
The natural world of creation, as in the planet, sun, stars, moon, trees, even the animals, but we won't go there yet, was good to God.
It is man that fell.
Read:
Wherefore, as by one man sin entered into the world, and death by sin; and so death passed upon all men, for that all have sinned:
Now read:
For we know that the whole creation groaneth and travaileth in pain together until now. And not only [they] , but ourselves also, which have the firstfruits of the Spirit, even we ourselves groan within ourselves, waiting for the adoption, [to wit], the redemption of our body.
Is Paul talking about anything other than mankind here?
Blessings to you.
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