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Old 10-29-2010, 06:37 PM
 
Location: Somewhere in Kentucky
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Every church I have ever been to said to thank God for the good things in life that you have and I agree with that. However, when something bad happens, they teach you to never blame God. If everything is through Him, wouldn't bad things be as well?
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Old 10-29-2010, 06:56 PM
 
5,503 posts, read 4,879,886 times
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Originally Posted by kentuckydad95 View Post
Every church I have ever been to said to thank God for the good things in life that you have and I agree with that. However, when something bad happens, they teach you to never blame God. If everything is through Him, wouldn't bad things be as well?
Since I can't fully fathom The Creator's Divine plan...I take comfort in the book of Job 1:12...the dialogue between God and Satan...

Blessings...
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Old 10-29-2010, 07:25 PM
 
Location: arizona ... most of the time
11,826 posts, read 10,799,467 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kentuckydad95 View Post
Every church I have ever been to said to thank God for the good things in life that you have and I agree with that. However, when something bad happens, they teach you to never blame God. If everything is through Him, wouldn't bad things be as well?

"God cannot be tempted by evil, nor does he tempt anyone; but each one is tempted when, by his own evil desire, he is dragged away and enticed" James 1:13-14

"Bad" things are the result of sin and evil....which is soley the fault of Satan, the curse of sin and their own evil desires.
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Old 10-29-2010, 07:29 PM
 
Location: Florida
73,524 posts, read 39,363,468 times
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Originally Posted by twin.spin View Post
"God cannot be tempted by evil, nor does he tempt anyone; but each one is tempted when, by his own evil desire, he is dragged away and enticed" James 1:13-14

"Bad" things are the result of sin and evil....which is soley the fault of Satan, the curse of sin and their own evil desires.
And sometimes things seem bad today, and it turns out to be a great thing in later on. Like getting laid off, only to land a much better job later. Leave it to God.
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Old 10-29-2010, 07:46 PM
 
Location: God's Country
22,142 posts, read 31,540,047 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by twin.spin View Post
"God cannot be tempted by evil, nor does he tempt anyone; but each one is tempted when, by his own evil desire, he is dragged away and enticed" James 1:13-14

"Bad" things are the result of sin and evil....which is soley the fault of Satan, the curse of sin and their own evil desires.
Romans 8:28
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Old 10-29-2010, 08:53 PM
 
Location: El Paso, TX
26,157 posts, read 19,263,294 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kentuckydad95 View Post
Every church I have ever been to said to thank God for the good things in life that you have and I agree with that. However, when something bad happens, they teach you to never blame God. If everything is through Him, wouldn't bad things be as well?
Believers can come under deserved suffering or undeserved suffering. The disobedient believer can come under divine discipline which is deserved suffering. And God knows how to hit each believer where it hurts him most, in order to get his attention.

Hebrews 12:4 ''You have not yet resisted to the point of shedding blood in your striving against sin; 5] and you have forgotten the exhortation which is addressed to you as sons, ''My son, do not regard lightly the discipline of the Lord. Nor faint when you are reproved by Him; 6] For those whom the Lord loves He disciplines, and He scourges every son whom He receives.''

The believer can also come under undeserved suffering in order to accelerate his spiritual growth. Suffering causes the growing believer to call on the Bible doctrine resident in his soul and apply it to his suffering. Undeserved suffering causes the spiritually growing believer to claim the promises of God in order to endure the suffering.

Phil 1:29 'For to you it has been granted for Christ sake not only to believe in Him, but also to suffer for His sake,

Suffering is a very big part of the believers life. Undeserved suffering is spiritual exercise which strengthens the believer and brings him closer to God.

In Jobs case, God allowed Satan to bring suffering to Job (Job 1:12). This was God honoring Job who was spritually mature enough to handle it and become even closer to God as a result. Very few believers are mature enough for God to allow them to come under the intensity of undeserved suffering that God allowed Satan to bring to Job.

God allows just the right amount of suffering into the growing believers life to get maximum results in that believers spiritual life.

On the other hand, God can apply the sin unto death to the disobedient believer who fails to respond to divine discipline by bringing death to that believer under intense suffering and taking him home to heaven in a state of disgrace.

This is not to say that the growing believer constantly suffers. But there will be times in his life when he will come under it.

And many times, people suffer simply because they make bad decisions in life.

The believer is to give thanks to God in all things.

Last edited by Michael Way; 10-29-2010 at 09:07 PM..
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Old 10-29-2010, 09:27 PM
 
16,308 posts, read 26,145,833 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kentuckydad95 View Post
Every church I have ever been to said to thank God for the good things in life that you have and I agree with that. However, when something bad happens, they teach you to never blame God. If everything is through Him, wouldn't bad things be as well?
Accepting the accolades and praise when things go well while denying culpability when things go wrong. A rather selfish juvenile behavior don't ya think?
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Old 10-29-2010, 09:49 PM
 
Location: Cleveland, Ohio
3,381 posts, read 3,687,124 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike555 View Post
Believers can come under deserved suffering or undeserved suffering. The disobedient believer can come under divine discipline which is deserved suffering. And God knows how to hit each believer where it hurts him most, in order to get his attention.

Hebrews 12:4 ''You have not yet resisted to the point of shedding blood in your striving against sin; 5] and you have forgotten the exhortation which is addressed to you as sons, ''My son, do not regard lightly the discipline of the Lord. Nor faint when you are reproved by Him; 6] For those whom the Lord loves He disciplines, and He scourges every son whom He receives.''

The believer can also come under undeserved suffering in order to accelerate his spiritual growth. Suffering causes the growing believer to call on the Bible doctrine resident in his soul and apply it to his suffering. Undeserved suffering causes the spiritually growing believer to claim the promises of God in order to endure the suffering.

Phil 1:29 'For to you it has been granted for Christ sake not only to believe in Him, but also to suffer for His sake,

Suffering is a very big part of the believers life. Undeserved suffering is spiritual exercise which strengthens the believer and brings him closer to God.

In Jobs case, God allowed Satan to bring suffering to Job (Job 1:12). This was God honoring Job who was spritually mature enough to handle it and become even closer to God as a result. Very few believers are mature enough for God to allow them to come under the intensity of undeserved suffering that God allowed Satan to bring to Job.

God allows just the right amount of suffering into the growing believers life to get maximum results in that believers spiritual life.

On the other hand, God can apply the sin unto death to the disobedient believer who fails to respond to divine discipline by bringing death to that believer under intense suffering and taking him home to heaven in a state of disgrace.

This is not to say that the growing believer constantly suffers. But there will be times in his life when he will come under it.

And many times, people suffer simply because they make bad decisions in life.

The believer is to give thanks to God in all things.

I love it when preachers preach this kind of stupidity. Allowing men to be tested to the point of death is all fine and dandy, but when it comes to "testing" children or women?? I mean, really. If you think bad things happen just because of bad choices or because God is testing somebody, what do you and other pastors say to those who were raped or whatever? God is truly testing you right now? Or, he's testing you through a fire but not after a rape? Or, he's testing you through cancer but not through your child being raped and murdered? Is he or is he not sovereign? Job said he brought all that calamity on him; God killed his kids, his wife, smashed all of his belongings to smithereens, and gave him a horrible skin condition that created immense amounts of pain.

We all need to stop playing games and stop beating around the crazy bush. There are 2 or more messages going on in the Bible. You all need to pick one.

Over 10 years I've been going through this monologue in my head, and listening to traditional Christianity's explanations almost made me absolutely crazy. Almost, but not quite.

I just think there's a lot more going on than we realize, and it's not all in the Bible.

Last edited by herefornow; 10-29-2010 at 11:02 PM..
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Old 10-29-2010, 10:03 PM
 
Location: God's Country
22,142 posts, read 31,540,047 times
Reputation: 30925
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike555 View Post
Believers can come under deserved suffering or undeserved suffering. The disobedient believer can come under divine discipline which is deserved suffering. And God knows how to hit each believer where it hurts him most, in order to get his attention.

Hebrews 12:4 ''You have not yet resisted to the point of shedding blood in your striving against sin; 5] and you have forgotten the exhortation which is addressed to you as sons, ''My son, do not regard lightly the discipline of the Lord. Nor faint when you are reproved by Him; 6] For those whom the Lord loves He disciplines, and He scourges every son whom He receives.''

The believer can also come under undeserved suffering in order to accelerate his spiritual growth. Suffering causes the growing believer to call on the Bible doctrine resident in his soul and apply it to his suffering. Undeserved suffering causes the spiritually growing believer to claim the promises of God in order to endure the suffering.

Phil 1:29 'For to you it has been granted for Christ sake not only to believe in Him, but also to suffer for His sake,

Suffering is a very big part of the believers life. Undeserved suffering is spiritual exercise which strengthens the believer and brings him closer to God.

In Jobs case, God allowed Satan to bring suffering to Job (Job 1:12). This was God honoring Job who was spritually mature enough to handle it and become even closer to God as a result. Very few believers are mature enough for God to allow them to come under the intensity of undeserved suffering that God allowed Satan to bring to Job.

God allows just the right amount of suffering into the growing believers life to get maximum results in that believers spiritual life.

On the other hand, God can apply the sin unto death to the disobedient believer who fails to respond to divine discipline by bringing death to that believer under intense suffering and taking him home to heaven in a state of disgrace.

This is not to say that the growing believer constantly suffers. But there will be times in his life when he will come under it.

And many times, people suffer simply because they make bad decisions in life.

The believer is to give thanks to God in all things.
GREAT post Mike Romans 5:3-4 "We can rejoice too when we run into problems and trails, for we know they are good for us, they help us learn to endure. And Endurance develops strength of character in us, and character strengthens our confident exception of salvation."

We can rejoice in suffering, not because we like pain or tragedy, but because we know God is in control and using difficulties to build our character and deepen our trust in Him.
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Old 10-29-2010, 10:30 PM
 
Location: Cleveland, Ohio
3,381 posts, read 3,687,124 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by I LOVE NORTH CAROLINA View Post
GREAT post Mike Romans 5:3-4 "We can rejoice too when we run into problems and trails, for we know they are good for us, they help us learn to endure. And Endurance develops strength of character in us, and character strengthens our confident exception of salvation."

We can rejoice in suffering, not because we like pain or tragedy, but because we know God is in control and using difficulties to build our character and deepen our trust in Him.

I really wish I had could tell the kids I worked with at the psych hospital, who had been sexually abused and were now zombified on meds, that God loved them. I just couldn't do it. I cried almost everyday. One particular story makes me so angry to this day that I end up a complete mess if I even think about it. Most of these kids aren't miracle stories. Most of them end up as misfits on drugs and they end up on the lowest rungs of life. I really just couldn't tell them that God is soverign and he allowed this to happen to them because, well, he wanted man to have free will and he allowed the nastiest character he could come up with into his garden with 2 very innocent spiritual children, and now we all have to suffer because this is what happens when we don't listen, and he is a God of love, so........

And, then, if I was a traditional Christian I would have to tell these kids that he's going to torment them for eternity if they don't believe in God or don't have the right doctrine or if they go to one of those "cultish" churches they are listening to the wrong Spirit and can't be saved.

Building character? It wasn't all the things I had been through in my life, it was those kids that finally broke me out of my stupor. When it comes down to the children.......

Let's just say my buttons have been pushed.

Round and round and round we go.

Puzzle pieces, puzzle pieces.

Last edited by herefornow; 10-29-2010 at 10:40 PM..
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