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Churches are free to embrace or oppose gay marriage. Marriage equality is about citizens of this country having equal rights. People want gay marriage so that they can get the same benefits, rights and privileges as straight couples. This isn't about the church. If a church doesn't want to perform or condone gay marriages - that is fine. But gay couples should have the same rights - as in visitation rights in the hospital, tax breaks, etc. as straight couples. It's about the government - not religion.
There are two issues in this debate which too many people can't separate:
1. The issue of individual sin and that's not exclusive to homosexuals, though you'll have a hard time finding believers who will admit their sins before going off on someone elses.
2. The law and the Constitution. This has nothing to do with the Church and everything to do with the God-given rights of man protected by the Declaration of Independence and the Constitution. You cannot deny one citizen his rights, even for the "right" reasons, without undermining the ideals expressed in those documents and making our great experiment in self rule into a lie.
And, don't forget that the Bible says God appoints rulers and kings to carry out His will. Whomever is in office is there because God wants him there for some purpose. God is still on His throne, our votes not withstanding.
Last edited by Miss Blue; 02-25-2011 at 08:40 AM..
Conservatives have vowed to make gay marriage a primary issue in the 2012 election. With the US economy in its worst shape since at least 1933 and two never-ending wars still raging in the Middle East, why is it gay issues are such a high priority for conservatives in these dark, bleak times? The reason is many, such as NC Sen James Forrester, believe that these ailments are punishment from God for this country's toleration of homosexuals. They believe that if we get tough on homosexuals God will sort everything else out. That belief is a lot more common than you think.
So IN THEIR OWN MINDS, by crusading against gay rights and gay equality everywhere, they are in sense saving this country from destruction.
Last edited by Miss Blue; 02-25-2011 at 08:44 AM..
If God destroys US, it will be because of the blood of the innocent, - the 40 million murdered babies through legalized abortion. But of course God doesn't destroy countries these days because of our sins, he blesses them for the things we do right, like support of Israel. Has God lessened his blessings for us because of our sins such as murder of innocent, sexual immorality (including homosexuality), rejection of Christ etc? Sometimes it sure seems that way, but us, the believeres will always be blessed since we are His people.
No. God is destroying this country because people are having sex before they get married. And no, I don't believe that either. But it's just as easy to blame it on one thing as it is the other.
God is not destroying this country and homosexuals are not evil. It's really that simple. Greed might destroy this country. Greed and power and narcissism. But not love. Homosexuals want to get married because they love each other.
I think people need to stop looking at the bad things going on in this world as a punishment from God and realize that it was humans who got us into these messes and it is humans that will get us out. If we try to be part of the solution and stop playing the blame game - we will all be much more productive.
ok, I can see that. I may not understand but I see that. However, God's law still apply (especially to the Christians). Love does not change what God has for us. Love is one of the most used excuse to violate God's law. I don't think God's wrath has come upon us because of same-sex marriage. God's wrath has been poured on Jesus Christ, but his wrath has come upon those who are not under Jesus Christ.
Can someone explain the "visitation rights in the hospital" to me? I never understood what people meant by that. Why would people care who you visit in the hospital?
Can someone explain the "visitation rights in the hospital" to me? I never understood what people meant by that. Why would people care who you visit in the hospital?
If a person is in the hospital and do not have a medical or enduring power of attorney, and that same person is not capable of giving consent (eg in a coma, trauma cases), then consent for the medical procedures and visitation restrictions fall to the family. A partner of X years would be excluded from visiting and making decisions while the parents of the hospitalized person would have all the rights, even if they have not spoken in years.
Can someone explain the "visitation rights in the hospital" to me? I never understood what people meant by that. Why would people care who you visit in the hospital?
When someone is in intensive care or things like that - sometimes only the immediate family is allowed visitation rights. Sometimes the person is unconcious or in a coma and cannot speak for themselves. Since gay marriage is still not legal in many states - this would mean that a gay partner cannot visit his or her partner seeing as how they are not legally recognized as part of the immediate family. It has often happened that a person has not been allowed to see their dying partner in the hospital. I can't even imagine what that must be like.
If a person is in the hospital and do not have a medical or enduring power of attorney, and that same person is not capable of giving consent (eg in a coma, trauma cases), then consent for the medical procedures and visitation restrictions fall to the family. A partner of X years would be excluded from visiting and making decisions while the parents of the hospitalized person would have all the rights, even if they have not spoken in years.
I have seen it play out more than once.
I usually just walk in and visit, family or no family.
Growing up I was taught that homosexuality was the ultimate sin against God and He would completely and totally destroy America if this country were to ever legalize it. The rational part of me says thats hogwash and the liberal Christian part of me says God is love and we are under the age of Grace and not the age of wrath. However, there is a part of me that, having heard the message of fire and brimstone every Sunday for 22 years, is a bit fearful of it happening. I look at things like the collapsing economy and skyrocketing oil prices and wonder if that may be punishment from God (Things spiraled out of control after California legalized gay marriage in Summer of 2008 but became relatively placid after Prop 8 passed until now when things are collapsing once again). I wonder if $100 oil and the crashing stock market has anything to do with Obama's DOMA policy? Does God still punish nations as in the Old Testament or does he deal more on an individual level in this age?
I very seldom try to speculate what God may or may not do or why....but I think Bible believing Christians should read the end of the book and know 'something' is coming at 'some point'. Since this was written long before anyone today was even alive...I think it sort of foolish to point fingers at other people.
I don't think it is my place to call the world to order....it is only my place to call MYSELF to order by treating others in a spirit of love regardless of whether I agree or don't agree with their chosen lifestyle or political reasoning. I'm not God and neither are a whole lot of other people who take it upon themselves to speak for Him.
As I stated....these are only my personal opinions on the matter.
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