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Old 03-24-2011, 04:08 AM
 
Location: Italy
6,387 posts, read 5,756,243 times
Reputation: 871

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Is that how you read the Bible??

That God put all mankind in Adam, and now He is expecting Christians to convince as many people to get saved as possible (from His own curse) before He "closes shop?"

Do you see it as your job to get people saved from God's curse?

Isn't that a bit hefty? How can a person sleep at night, if it is their responsability to get as many people to "choose Him" as possible before they die?

Is it our job to "clean up" God's mess?


Hoping we can discuss this with respect..

Blessings of love to all,
brian
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Old 03-24-2011, 04:56 AM
 
1,492 posts, read 2,462,483 times
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I don't think God did it,satan did.But God didn't let that stop Him from continuing on with His plan,nor should He have.I think there are just a lot of things we can't see,from our limited viewpoint here on earth.That's why God said to trust Him and have childlike faith...He's got it all worked out.
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Old 03-24-2011, 05:39 AM
 
1,838 posts, read 2,107,206 times
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if satan did it then that means God gave him the power to do it,God can give power and take power away,if the faith of mankind was to fail and bec0me eternally''u know what'',then why didnt God just turn satan into a weak little kitten with no power at-all,especially since their is so much at stake,like every man/woman and child that existed after Adam,then we wouldnt have this mess,but then again according to bible literalists,no-one would have been born,it sound's like a very poorly thought out plan and that seriously makes me doubt that it came from a Supreme Being..

i think your spot on here Brian!!!!!!!!...the whole thing seems way out of sink with reality.

Last edited by dobeable; 03-24-2011 at 05:40 AM.. Reason: typo's
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Old 03-24-2011, 05:45 AM
 
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I think it has to do with free will;God did not make adam and eve sin.they chose it on their own.
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Old 03-24-2011, 10:56 AM
 
351 posts, read 317,245 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SC122 View Post
I think it has to do with free will;God did not make adam and eve sin.they chose it on their own.
Hey SC122

Questions for you, Who created Adam and Eve with a carnal heart? Who put Adam and Eve in the Garden? Who put good and evil in the same tree? Who put the tree in the Garden? Who put Satin in the garden to tempt them? Who knew what was going to happen and how to make it happen?

Adam and Eve did not have a chance. Remember God is in control of his creation at all times. The clay is marred in the potters hand but the clay never leaves the potters hand.
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Old 03-24-2011, 10:58 AM
 
Location: Italy
6,387 posts, read 5,756,243 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sschulz View Post
Hey SC122

Questions for you, Who created Adam and Eve with a carnal heart? Who put Adam and Eve in the Garden? Who put good and evil in the same tree? Who put the tree in the Garden? Who put Satin in the garden to tempt them? Who knew what was going to happen and how to make it happen?

Adam and Eve did not have a chance. Remember God is in control of his creation at all times. The clay is marred in the potters hand but the clay never leaves the potters hand.
Oh, that we would never forget this!

blessings,
brian
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Old 03-24-2011, 12:08 PM
 
6,221 posts, read 7,244,768 times
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This seems on topic. From Ray Smith's paper on the Lake of Fire:

L. Ray Smith - Lake of Fire - part 2

Now listen carefully. Here is wisdom beyond its years. When a scientist creates an experiment or machine that malfunctions, is he responsible for the malfunction? Yes. Does he hold the experiment or machine responsible? No. Does he hold God responsible? No. Okay.

Now then, according to Christendom, when God creates an experiment or machine that malfunctions, is He responsible for the malfunction? No. Does He hold the experiment or machine responsible? Yes. Does He hold man responsible? Yes. See the wisdom?

I have just shown you one reason why God calls the WISDOM of this world, STUPIDITY!
"For the wisdom of this world is foolishness [Greek: stupidity] with God. For it is written, He takes the wise in their own craftiness" (I Cor. 3:19).
First, Christendom assumes that God’s creation of humans malfunctioned -- they did NOT!

Second, they assume that God is not responsible and does not take responsibility -- He DOES!

One unscriptural assumption added to another unscriptural assumption does not equal a Bible Truth!


Few indeed have ever stopped long enough to consider that just maybe God intended for the world to be in the hellish mess that we find it. Not for all eternity, but for the present, for a period of time, for a great purpose. It just seems so wrong to Christian thought to believe that God would have purposed such an evil and unhappy world. But look at the alternative. Are we to believe that God tried (albeit unsuccessfully) to make a good creation, but was unaware of its potential to run amok? And ever since, God must therefore either lack the love for humanity to straighten it out, or He lacks the power and ability. But either way it disowns God’s sovereignty and presents us with a God Who either CANNOT or WILL NOT STOP THE INSANITY! They would have us believe that God’s solution to rid the world of sin and evil is to torture most of humanity in fire for all eternity.


The whole idea is blasphemous. If a carnal-minded human can take responsibility for an invention that malfunctions, I submit, that God is bigger and more responsible than puny man. Be it known to all that God takes full responsibility for His creation, and absolutely nothing in His creation is malfunctioning. Here’s the proof:


....
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Old 03-28-2011, 10:14 AM
 
Location: Pilot Point, TX
7,625 posts, read 12,816,081 times
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As I see it, God indeed gave man the defect in order to show him the greatness of His salvation. To help us see the need for that salvation, He created the waster to destroy (satan). If you'll notice in your life and in all of scripture, it's only man that satan bothers - it's never the nature of Christ.

So any dummy can see the answer is to be changed into His image.
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Old 03-28-2011, 11:14 AM
 
5,439 posts, read 5,310,833 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SC122 View Post
I think it has to do with free will;God did not make adam and eve sin.they chose it on their own.
This is absolutely true. God can be likened unto a husbandmen who went away into a foreign land and turned over his vineyard to certain servants to work the grounds and to bring forth fruit. In due season, what will happen when he returns to find those slothful servants eating, drinking and having no regard for his desire that his vineyard should be well kept and ripe for the harvest? This shall he do: he shall take the vineyard from those wicked servants and destroy them because they dishonored the master.
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Old 03-28-2011, 11:16 AM
 
Location: Seward, Alaska
2,740 posts, read 8,337,417 times
Reputation: 1998
Quote:
Originally Posted by ahigherway View Post
Is that how you read the Bible??

That God put all mankind in Adam, and now He is expecting Christians to convince as many people to get saved as possible (from His own curse) before He "closes shop?"

Do you see it as your job to get people saved from God's curse?

Isn't that a bit hefty? How can a person sleep at night, if it is their responsability to get as many people to "choose Him" as possible before they die?

Is it our job to "clean up" God's mess?


Hoping we can discuss this with respect..

Blessings of love to all,
brian

God's disaster??? No, it is man's disaster. God wasn't in the driver's seat when Adam sinned...God didn't create this mess....we did. It doesn't matter what we think about it now, or how we "see it". Jesus said to take the Gospel to the whole world. If it wasn't necessary, then why would He say that? Doesn't matter what you or I think about it...us thinking it is too "hefty" doesn't change anything...it is what it is...
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