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Whoever believes in the Son has eternal life, but whoever rejects the Son will not see life, for God’s wrath remains on him
Have you investigated God's wrath?
Eph. 5:6 Let no one deceive you with empty words, for because of such things God's wrath comes on those who are disobedient.
So...what if you are obedient yet don't believe?
Or...disobedient and yet do believe?
Rom. 12:19 Do not take revenge, my friends, but leave room for God's wrath, for it is written: "It is mine to avenge; I will repay," says the Lord.
How does the Lord repay?
Rom. 9:22 What if God, choosing to show his wrath and make his power known, bore with great patience the objects of his wrath--prepared for destruction?
What if he repays with patience? Does his patience ever run out?
Rom. 9:23 What if he did this to make the riches of his glory known to the objects of his mercy...
What if God repays with patience to make his glory known? He is glorified by his own patience?
1 John 4:16 And so we know and rely on the love God has for us. God is love. Whoever lives in love lives in God, and God in him.
1 Corinthians 13:4
Love is patient, love is kind. It does not envy, it does not boast, it is not proud.
Sounds like it's in his perfect character to forgive the unbeliever without their permission....because he is love...
Eph. 5:6 Let no one deceive you with empty words, for because of such things God's wrath comes on those who are disobedient.
So...what if you are obedient yet don't believe?
Or...disobedient and yet do believe?
Rom. 12:19 Do not take revenge, my friends, but leave room for God's wrath, for it is written: "It is mine to avenge; I will repay," says the Lord.
How does the Lord repay?
Rom. 9:22 What if God, choosing to show his wrath and make his power known, bore with great patience the objects of his wrath--prepared for destruction?
What if he repays with patience? Does his patience ever run out?
Rom. 9:23 What if he did this to make the riches of his glory known to the objects of his mercy...
What if God repays with patience to make his glory known? He is glorified by his own patience?
1 John 4:16 And so we know and rely on the love God has for us. God is love. Whoever lives in love lives in God, and God in him.
1 Corinthians 13:4
Love is patient, love is kind. It does not envy, it does not boast, it is not proud.
Sounds like it's in his perfect character to forgive the unbeliever without their permission....because he is love...
"Do not be deceived: God cannot be mocked. A man reaps what he sows."
God's patience does run out. Only the wanton accusations to the contrary denies that.
God's patience ran out with Satan's rebellion in heaven
God's patience ran out with Adam & Eve in the Garden
God's patience ran out with the people of the tower of Babel
God's patience ran out with the people of Noah's day
God's patience ran out with Pharaoh
God's patience ran out with Israels constant complaining
God's patience ran out with Israels unfaithfulness (read about the captivities)
God's patience ran out and poured out his wrath and Jesus
God's patience will run out with those who will reject Jesus....and will force those evil unbelievers to drink the cup of his full wrath.
"Do not be deceived: God cannot be mocked. A man reaps what he sows."
God's patience does run out. Only the wanton accusations to the contrary denies that.
God's patience ran out with Satan's rebellion in heaven
God's patience ran out with Adam & Eve in the Garden
God's patience ran out with the people of the tower of Babel
God's patience ran out with the people of Noah's day
God's patience ran out with Pharaoh
God's patience ran out with Israels constant complaining
God's patience ran out with Israels unfaithfulness (read about the captivities)
God's patience ran out and poured out his wrath and Jesus
God's patience will run out with those who will reject Jesus....and will force those evil unbelievers to drink the cup of his full wrath.
Then God is not love...
It's easy to blame all that misfortune on God.... Is he also responsible for the times I stub my toe?
You want it to be true? Watching people burn for "disobedience?"
I thought of this question in a recent thread but didn't want to derail it so here we are....
I hear people (Christians mostly) say that all you have to do is trust, believe, and/or have faith that God/Christianity is real yet I know countless humans that truly and with all their heart believe things that aren't true. Whether they are aware or not that the belief is erroneous.... What merit is it to believe, trust, or have faith in something?
I guess I'm asking why people say that is a requirement to be saved.... If I believe my husband is faithful, yet he's found cheating....what of my belief then? I just don't get how the belief, faith, or trust helps you when it comes to salvation.. Help?
It is not simply belief for the sake of belief. It is the person or being that is believed in that is just as important.
Belief is a requirement to be saved because God set that requirement in place. Our part is fully trusting God. God's part is carrying out our salvation as He said He would.
If you are talking about your husband, that's a little different. God is infallible. Your husband is not. His character is a large factor in whether or not you believe in him. Just because you put your full faith in him does not mean he is going to act right 100% of the time.
It is not simply belief for the sake of belief. It is the person or being that is believed in that is just as important.
Belief is a requirement to be saved because God set that requirement in place. Our part is fully trusting God. God's part is carrying out our salvation as He said He would.
If you are talking about your husband, that's a little different. God is infallible. Your husband is not. His character is a large factor in whether or not you believe in him. Just because you put your full faith in him does not mean he is going to act right 100% of the time.
Whether it is a belief in God or my husbands faithfulness, I am still the same believer...one belief wrong about the faithfulness of my husband and one belief right about God... What good is my belief if it doesn't affect the object of my belief.... Yet Christianity says it is about the object of the belief in that you are rewarded for believing....
I could believe it's always sunny in Washington state but it wouldn't change the facts.... :-)
I'm not arguing that a person shouldn't believe or that it's useless but then if it isn't going to affect the object of your trust (the truth is not swayed by what you believe) then why condemn others who don't believe the same?
After all... Why would a God of love take away the Law then put a new set of rules out there that are just silly... Which way to go??? Presbyterian, Catholic, new Adventist, Pentecostal.... None of them have quite the same thing to say about the way to heaven or salvation. Yet which of their versions of God is the one that will ensure I'm saved by the correct belief?
That's kinda what brought about the question.... Why do people think that their belief excuses their bad behavior?
Because humans deceive themselves. I think the wrestling match between the Spirit of truth and the lies we tell ourselves is a great struggle (obviously), otherwise all the one billion "believers" on the earth (or is it 2 billion??) would be acting like sweet angels and would bring peace into the world. I reckon that is the reason we all have to die - to get rid of our corrupt nature. It is painfully obvious that there is something seriously wrong with mankind. I think your question is very reasonable. There is a scripture somewhere that speaks to that, saying "can faith save if one has no good works". I can't remember where it is.
Because humans deceive themselves. I think the wrestling match between the Spirit of truth and the lies we tell ourselves is a great struggle (obviously), otherwise all the one billion "believers" on the earth (or is it 2 billion??) would be acting like sweet angels and would bring peace into the world. I reckon that is the reason we all have to die - to get rid of our corrupt nature. It is painfully obvious that there is something seriously wrong with mankind. I think your question is very reasonable. There is a scripture somewhere that speaks to that, saying "can faith save if one has no good works". I can't remember where it is.
James 2.13-14?
"13 For he shall have judgment without mercy, that hath shewed no mercy; and mercy rejoiceth against judgment. 14 What doth it profit, my brethren, though a man say he hath faith, and have not works? can faith save him?"
James 2:10 For whoever keeps the whole law and yet stumblesat just one point is guilty of breaking all of it.
Yes, God demands perfection and He gave us the law to prove to us that we can't do it ourselves. Everyone, who ever lived or will live, has stumbled on at least "just one point" of the law.
He created us weak and imperfect, then gave a law He knows we cannot keep. Why?
So that He could offer us the sacrificial death of Jesus as payment for our failures! All we have to do is accept that payment, and He deems us "perfect" for Christ's sake!
He does not expect you to live perfectly after salvation either, nor can you, but so long as you keep your faith and trust in Christ to answer for your sins on judgment day, God voluntarily continues to see you as perfect.
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