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Meetings don't make a church people do----Amos 3:3 and 2 Cor. 6.
Locations don't make a church people do---Psalms 133:1 and John 17:21.
Philosophy don't make a church truth do---Colossians 2:8 & John 8:32 &
2 Peter 1:20-21.
Lies don't make a church truth do--John 17:17 and Romans 3:1-4 and
John 8:44 and 1 John 2:27 and 2 Cor. 4:3.
Confusion don't make a church truth do---1 Cor. 14 and John 17:17 and
John 8:32 and 2 Peter 1:20-21 and Amos 3:3 and Psalms 133:1 and
1 Thess. 5:12.
Guessing don't make a church knowledge do ---Psalms 119:115 and
John 14:26 and 1 John 2:27 and Matthew 15:14 and 2 Timothy 2:15 and
1 John 2:27 and Amos 3:3 and 2 Cor. 6 and 1 Thess. 5:12 & 2 Tim. 3:16.
Good Intentions don't make a church unity do ----Amos 3:3 and
John 17:9 and 2 Cor. 6 and 1 Thess. 5:12 and Isaiah 55:8-9 and
Isaiah 64:6 and Psalms 8:4 and John 14:26 and Psalms 133:1 and
Titus 3:10 and Matthew 7:6 and Romans 10:2-3 and Matthew 5:18-20.
A Sweety don't make a church a believer does---John 8:31 and
Matthew 5:18-20 and Amos 3:3 and 2 Cor. 6 and 1 Thess. 5:12 and
Psalms 133:1 and John 17:9 and Matthew 5:6 and Romans 10:2-3.
A Blood Boaster don't make a church a Christian does-----Romans 6:1
and Romans 3:1-4 and 2 Peter 1:20-21 and John 8:31 and Luke 4:4 and
Matthew 5:18-20 and 2 Timothy 3:16.
Wisdom of man don't make a church the wisdom of God
does---Psalms 8:4 and Isaiah 55:8-9 and Isaiah 64:6 and
Matthew 5:18-20 and Matthew 4:4 and Romans 10:2-3 and 1 Cor. 1:25.
Logic don't make a church the fundamentals do----John 3:5 and
Mark 16:16 and Matthew 3:2 and Romans 6:1 and Romans 3:1-4.
Big shots don't make a church only what God saying does ---- Revelation 22:18-19 and Matthew 5:17 and 1 John 2:27 and
Matthew 15:14 and Galations 1:8-9 and Titus 3:10 and 2 Cor. 4:3 and
2 Timothy 2:15 and John 14:26 and James 1:5 and Romans 10:17 and
Psalms 119:115 and Colossians 2:8 and 2 Peter 1:20-21 and
Romans 3:1-4.
Short cut theology don't make a church all the bible do ---Luke 4:4
and Romans 6:1 and Matthew 5:18-20 and Romans 3:1-4 and
Psalms 8:4 and John 8:31 and Romans 10:2-3 and 2 Peter 1:20-21 and
2 Timothy 3:16 and John 5:39.
Liberals don't make a church the strict bible rules do ----- 1 Peter 3:3
and Romans 7:2-3 and 1 Timothy 2:9-14 and 1 Cor. 14:34-35 and
James 5:20 and Matthew 7:6 and 1 Thess. 5:12 and John 5:39 and
Matthew 4:4 and John 8:31 and John 17:9 and 2 Cor. 6 and Amos 3:3.
Extremists don't make a church the bible only does ----John 1:17 and
Romans 11:29 and Colossians 2:8 and 2 Peter 1:20-21 and Romans 3:1-4
and Revelation 22:18-19 and Matthew 5:17 and Psalms 1 and Psalms 8:4
and Isaiah 55:8-9 and Isaiah 64:6 and 1 Cor. 1:25 and Psalms 119:115
and John 14:26 and James 1:5 and 2 Timothy 2:15 and Romans 10:17.
Optimism don't make a church as much as the bible do ---- John 5:39
and 1 Cor. 8:2 and John 8:31 and Romans 6:1 and Romans 12:3.
Good News don't make a church as much as the truth do ----John 8:32
and John 5:39 and John 17:17 and Luke 6:26 and 1 Cor. 8:2 and
Matthew 13:57 and Matthew 10:34-37 and Matthew 10:22.
I did not intend for this post to be here but, I wrote it for another, couldn't post it so put it here as a similar thread and nothing was happening here anyway.
Because reason fills all things, all things have a logic to them. Logic is the necessary. Some of this stuff comes out as "laws". For example, Eve set herself into a logic of seduction, followed the logic out and became like god (not modern psychological free will mind you-that throws a monkey wrench in the whole christian movement and raises the fallen man to a high level; higher than the "new man"; hence the lack of respect for scripture nowadays, and a dependence on the psychological and social).
Simulacra follows a logic. Once one begins in simulation, the simulation follows out its own "law". In the beginning Christ shows up and demands that one take up one's own cross and become a follower; exposed to all the dangers and such like himself. That is the "true" or "real" and is the first order. The second order from this true, in the case of christianity (and here I am jumping to christendom as I haven't thought about prior to it), would be "serving".
In serving one begins to stop being a follower, and an organized "religion" is established; the aesthetic (buildings, robes, money, comfort, redefining the bible {to allow service rather than the difficulty of being a follower}), and etc; along with the loss of the ethical of the true or the original, the determination of the individual; and this ethics is replaced by an abstract ethics developed from the serving mentality-the now abstract church-a self serving ethics that works out pretty conveniently, and throws everything serious, serious about the original, not the simulation, out the window. The bible becomes mere occasion to this, or a gradual tool used for its ends.
The third order of the simulation is the state church or christendom. The state is composed of the numerical, so then the state is directly related to quantity. If all the people vanish, the state is gone. In christendom then, all are christians as the state is a christian state (this has implications for the simulacra of universalism, but that is for another thread, I suppose). Authority is attached to the state, and such, so this simulation of christianity uses the authority of the state to legitimize itself and its functions (forced church tax, forced attendance, state approved clergy, usually clergy are state officials paid by the state and such). Problem here is that god alway provides for himself and if there is one christian only, then christianity exists-it is not related to numbers as a state, as it needs no state as christianity is heterogeneous with the world and its "wisdom".
This recycles through after christendom. The state church has become the "true" church (all movement in simulation has this replacement where a simulation becomes the true and the original true is gone) replacing the original brought by christ. This new original goes through the stages of simulation as well; but the people of the time assume christendom to be the truth.
The second stage of this new cycle is, well, I don't have it all yet, but it lies within the world moving from states to global society, and with the post modern; culture comes to the fore. One now serves the christian as a cultural "being", maybe a particular type such as feminist, racial, gay, Albanian, republican, and on. Christianity is re-defined (as well as bible) in terms of these social categories (abstract; therefore, accidental categories, and so christianity here, in our age, becomes abstract and accidental as well). One hears now such things as, "I am a feminist christian", or a "gay", a "democratic", a "black", a "white", and on and on and on. The social category determines or predicates the therm christian, rather than number and universal as in christendom, and rather than, "I" as a follower in the true original.
The third order, the one to replace the simulated original of the state church is now the cultural church. And it redefines the scripture and serving concept from the accidental social category. Obviously, it uses structures in an attempt to enforce its wishes on others, but it can not use the state as it used to. Now it uses political correctness, directed (self serving) theology, worldly wisdom, and of course it will attempt to use civil rights and such; or the legal system of the state in court and public opinion. This is rapidly becoming the "true" church and instead of a following church composed of individual christians in imitation of its founder, it will mirror the diversity of the global culture being in service as defined by the categories of the social. This simulation will replace the previous simulation which had replaced the true/original (I suppose one might make a case for the catholic church replacing the true before christendom; I am not sure yet).
So now, as said the founder of this religion, there was a very narrow gate and few (individuals) find it, then being born in a state found it for you as a member of the mass (christendom), and now being some accidental social characteristic and mirroring the global culture, well, you are in like flint (the cultural church), and you didn't have to do a damn thing in the way of a rigorous follower that denied one's will. Oh, this will surely begin another cycle in the future.
Churches in america have a history of much more than being a place of worship. it has been and still is a place many socialize. Churches are very much into communtiy and social work. Churches have a tremendous number of available volunteers has many in disaster areas have seen.I was shocked at the amount of things like mobile kitchens to feed thousands that church groups arrived with after Rita.
The bible is one of those difficult texts. It is not difficult like a text by Hegel or such, but it is difficult in that it is too hard to take. If one looks at the NT to see what a follower is, well one is confronted by impossibility and by demands that are just against everything that a person of this world, and we are all persons of this world, hold dear.
Deny oneself, hate parents, sell what one has, receive no rewards, humble oneself, hate the world, seek after some non descriptive "thing"-a kingdom not off this world, put off gratification, do not marry if at all possible (which means children), seek not riches or rewards, face danger for the idea, seek not revenge, be hated by the world, be considered a fool, bare one's own cross, despise the mob, be a pilgrim here, leave father and home, and etc, etc , etc. These are the requirements. Churches deny this.
All human knowing is a problem of epistemology and where ever this is attacked, the very being of being human is at stake as men live through the idea. There is no knowledge of the founder of christianity out side of the bible, unless one accepts that god consciousness crap, and pulls absolute truth out of one's brain like a magician pulls rabbits out of his hat, and then be in conflict with this biblical information and become a new authority in his private person as opposed to this founder; after all if what one pulls out of ones' brain is the same as bible, well, then one doesn't have much that any one who can read can also have. To oppose this bible in a contradictory manner is to oppose being human as epistemology can only be constructed from this source about what this guy said. This stuff then in the bible is for the individual not the abstract mob. Churches add words that please men.
Well then, this founder said, as recorded in the bible what I wrote above and then some; such as on divorce, fornication, and such. This is the information and it is all simple enough and straight forward, and that is the problem. What to do? Well word studies, theology, common sense, rabble ideas, good meaning christians, and all that stuff of men, begin to have these words of the founder begin to say something that he didn't say even though these words of his, for now, remain in place. Churches facilitate this meaning confusion.
Everyone knows that this founder would never demand that one hate mother and father, or to never require one to deny oneself; surely there are times where one may indulge, etc. In other words this guy is a dunce and rattle brain and us men through our interpretive skills know better what he meant. After all the requirement is too high and needs to be watered down so that it is in reach of self serving men-that will make it attractive. Churches do this.
This process of making christianity attractive by getting all this ugliness out of the way is turned into doctrines and theologies that various peoples can scab around, sort of group up around what pleases them and this forms into social systems called churches. So in one church the head guy and his ol' lady have his and her Harleys and a jet-so much for not seeking riches and being a servant, another has a multimillion dollar compound out side of St Louis, so much for the same, another has been preaching for years and has been awarded by congress and presidents; so much for receiving his reward here, others have a wife and more than one perhaps, and lots of children. This when we know from this founder that the world we bring children into is pretty bad for the christian, and maybe hell awaits these children. But one needs kids and a wife-how is one to deny oneself? Others want a gay clergy that may be unmarried to a live in,, but reject the same situation for heterosexuals, etc, etc, etc. Churches remove the rigor.
How is one to preach celibacy, at least until one can marry because one is weak, if they live in fornication? How is one to preach on the avoidance of riches if he is rich? How is one to preach on abstaining from marriage if one is married? These types of questions can be extended on and on if one simply looks at what this founder said. What he said will never do as what he said is totally disagreeable for any man or woman; that is why the church is more important than the the bible because it is in these churches where we can get around this meddlesome founder and be christians to a certain extent where as followers, we follow ourselves and god should be grateful we do that and leave us alone.
This in truth, if this guy's doctrine is ever told in its truth, in other words, if the speaker just duplicates this founder's words, these words will never, ever, attract anyone. Man has the potential ability to realize that everything he holds dear is error, and move against himself even while holding onto his error; this animals do not have. It is one of the great qualities in being human. Christianity expects men to engage this ability but this ability must collide with the man himself and like a hidden gate, there are few which will find the where-with-all to do it. It is much easier to accept a notion that agrees with the error that is maintained by the man, that is why the notions that this founder hold need to be twisted into something agreeable. Churches do this.
Neither? what neither? Neither his son or the individual? Neither what a man does or what a church does? Neither the distorters of truth or the honest liars? So the whole thing is just an April Fools?
Neither? what neither? Neither his son or the individual? Neither what a man does or what a church does? Neither the distorters of truth or the honest liars? So the whole thing is just an April Fools?
God cares for neither
He has showed you, O man, what is good. And what does the LORD require of you? To act justly and to love mercy
and to walk humbly with your God. Micah 6:8
LORD does not look at the things people look at. People look at the outward appearance, but the LORD looks at the heart.” 1 Sam 16:8
For the eyes of the LORD range throughout the earth to strengthen those whose hearts are fully committed to him. 2 Chron 16:9.
Life is not about a bible and going to church, it's about being transformed into his likeness by growing in the grace and knowledge that is continually towards us(His likeness is not a bible, nor a creed of beliefs)
The Lord does not look at the things people look at", sounds good but then we get "to act justly and to love mercy". To do these "things" one has to bring them into actuality, or out of mere possibility; in other words god does look at what people look at; especially the self observing the self, and he takes it into account, to see if you see what you are to do.
Do not forsake the assembling together; it is about going to church, or I guess he was a rattle brain as well.
Last edited by Miss Blue; 07-09-2011 at 05:02 PM..
"The Lord does not look at the things people look at", sounds good but then we get "to act justly and to love mercy". To do these "things" one has to bring them into actuality, or out of mere possibility; in other words god does look at what people look at; especially the self observing the self, and he takes it into account, to see if you see what you are to do.
Do not forsake the assembling together; it is about going to church, or I guess he was a rattle brain as well.
If you believe that God looks or cares at where you go to church and how much of the bible you know over what is in your heart,Moderator cut: orphaned
In the bible that you think you know, there were synagogues full of bible believing jews (he came to his own,and his own received him not).
,Saul of Tarsus was one of them,and He said this about all that he was outwardly .................What is more, I consider everything a loss compared to the surpassing greatness of knowing Christ Jesus my Lord, for whose sake I have lost all things. I consider them rubbish, that I may gain Christ Moderator cut: delete
God is all about changing the way we see him and the attitude of our hearts towards him,so it changes the way we see the world and our attitude towards the lost world.
ps God IS love
camps the Jesus freak
Last edited by Miss Blue; 07-09-2011 at 05:05 PM..
He comes to his own today and is not received, church or unchurch-not a "we" but an "I"
God is about changing the way we see him-in your heart, without bible you see him as an extension of your self or of your group. One needs information from somewhere; you obviously pull it out of your heart; or rather, since the heart don't think, out of your mind
How do you know god is love?
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