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Old 05-31-2011, 08:58 AM
 
672 posts, read 579,505 times
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Romans 9:


13As it is written, Jacob have I loved, but Esau have I hated.

How can it be sincerely taught that scripture teaches that God loves all men without exception, when it specifically says of Esau, God Hated ?

And I got news for you, He did not only hate Esau, but all the workers of iniquity. ps 5:


5The foolish shall not stand in thy sight: thou hatest all workers of iniquity.

And they that work iniquity shall soon hear these words Matt 7:


23And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.

Yes, these and those in ps 5 5 are the very same !
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Old 05-31-2011, 09:19 AM
 
5,925 posts, read 6,071,422 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by savedbysovereigngrace View Post
Romans 9:


13As it is written, Jacob have I loved, but Esau have I hated.

How can it be sincerely taught that scripture teaches that God loves all men without exception, when it specifically says of Esau, God Hated ?

And I got news for you, He did not only hate Esau, but all the workers of iniquity. ps 5:


5The foolish shall not stand in thy sight: thou hatest all workers of iniquity.

And they that work iniquity shall soon hear these words Matt 7:


23And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.

Yes, these and those in ps 5 5 are the very same !

To answer the question in your thread title, yes. To answer your question in your post, the context of scriptural study that I have found is concerning the contrast between who God created us to be and the nature within us that needs to be destroyed so that who we are intended to be can come to pass. I then gathered the picture that God loves absolutely everyone and it is the bad within us that he hates.
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Old 05-31-2011, 09:23 AM
 
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Moderator cut: edit

Anyway, as Phaze said, YES, God does love all men.

Here is the proof:
1 Tim 2:3 This is good, and pleases God our Savior, 4 who wants all people to be saved and to come to a knowledge of the truth.
John 3:16 For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life.
1 John 2:2 He is the atoning sacrifice for our sins, and not only for ours but also for the sins of the whole world.
John 15:13 Greater love has no one than this: to lay down one's life for one's friends.


Putting it together: God sacrificed his son for the whole world because He loved the world (all people). He did this not just for us but everyone. There is no greater act than to sacrifice your self for others, and Jesus did this for everyone. Therefore Jesus sacrifice on the cross was the greatest act of love possible FOR ALL PEOPLE.

Last edited by june 7th; 06-07-2011 at 07:52 AM..
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Old 05-31-2011, 01:36 PM
 
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The purpose and adequacy of Christ’s atoning love is limited to the elect of God (Jer. 31:3; John 17:23; Rom. 9:13).

Jer 31:

3The LORD hath appeared of old unto me, saying, Yea, I have loved thee with an everlasting love: therefore with lovingkindness have I drawn thee.

Premised on the everlasting covenant Heb 13:20

Jn 17:23

23I in them, and thou in me, that they may be made perfect in one; and that the world may know that thou hast sent me, and hast loved them, as thou hast loved me.

Its pure carelessness to suppose God Loved all mankind as He did Jesus Christ .

Rom 9:13

13As it is written, Jacob have I loved, but Esau have I hated.

God did not Love Esau, was he not part of mankind ?
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Old 05-31-2011, 01:59 PM
 
5,925 posts, read 6,071,422 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by savedbysovereigngrace View Post
Rom 9:13

13As it is written, Jacob have I loved, but Esau have I hated.

God did not Love Esau, was he not part of mankind ?

If you are going to ask questions, you may as well address the answers you get, otherwise why bother with the pretense that your interested in them?

I have addressed that verse, your preaching is contingent that the bible must be taken literally at the points that support your doctrine. A metaphorical outlook of the contrast between the nature of Joseph and the nature of esau can be seen in every human being and contradicts the idea that God does not love each and every human being.
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Old 05-31-2011, 02:09 PM
 
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If you are interested, here is a study on the topic of "God hating":

Merciful Truth : Does God Hate You, Sinner?

Excerpt:
Have you paused to consider that when you read about God's "hatred" of sinners, and you attribute your personal, human emotional psychology to God's words, you are lowering God to your level? You are making your thoughts God's thoughts, and your ways, His ways. You are attributing your feelings, which proceed from your human heart - which the Bible says is "deceitful above all things, and desperately wicked" (Jer 17:9) - to a God who is not flesh, but Spirit.

...
Within these scriptures we begin to see clues about what God really means by "hating Esau." Obviously God is using "linguistic hyperbole" to illustrate His choice before either son had been born, before either had done good or evil. Hi choice was not based on that criteria. God made a choice, and by action, He loved Jacob (by choosing him) and hated Esau (by not choosing him). This verse has nothing to do with lustful human hatred from a deeply wicked heart.

...
Gen 25:34
Then Jacob gave Esau bread and pottage of lentils; and he did eat and drink, and rose up, and went his way: thus Esau despised his birthright.


Esau hated his birthright. Or, did he? If Esau despised his birthright, he had a funny way of showing it when he went to his father. Esau said, "My brother deserves the name Jacob, because he has already cheated me twice. The first time he cheated me out of my rights as the first-born son, and now he has cheated me out of my blessing." Then Esau asked his father, "Don't you still have any blessing left for me?" (Gen 27:36)

Does that sound like a man who emotionally hated his own birthright? If Esau emotionally despised his birthright, he sure has a strange way of showing that by grieving for it and sorely wanting it. The fact is, Esau did hate his birthright...in the sense that he chose Jacob's stew over it. It had nothing to do with emotion.
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Old 06-01-2011, 11:56 AM
 
2,432 posts, read 2,812,380 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by savedbysovereigngrace
Does God love all men without exception?
God is LOVE, so, "Does Love affect all men without exception?"
It depends on how open one's heart and mind are.
It also depends on how you define love.
I define love as having the choice & choosing what is best over what feels good temporarily.
(The OP scripture involves a good lesson about this with Jacob, Esau & the soup.)

I see God like a "laissez fair" or "love & logic" parent... God loves us enough to give us the gift of choice, along with intellect & intuition. When a writer states that God hates somebody... it's because that writer does. Yet, when we search our souls, we realize in hating others, we hate ourselves.

God (or the divinity within us all) does not hate Esau - how could God hate anything God created & is part of? He only hates iniquitous behavior, yet even God created the necessary possibility of evil, so we can appreciate it's opposite & so we can progress through faith & love.

Last edited by SuperSoul; 06-01-2011 at 12:09 PM..
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Old 06-01-2011, 12:19 PM
 
Location: Indianapolis
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SuperSoul View Post
God is LOVE, so, "Does Love affect all men without exception?"
It depends on how open the recipient's heart is.
It also depends on how you define love.
I define love as having the choice & choosing what is best over what feels good temporarily.
(The OP scripture involves a good lesson about this with Jacob, Esau & the soup.)

I see God like a "laissez fair" or "love & logic" parent... God loves us enough to give us the gift of choice, along with intellect & intuition. When a writer states that God hates somebody... it's because that writer does. Yet, when we search our souls, we realize in hating others, we hate ourselves.

God (or the divinity within us all) does not hate Esau - how could God hate anything God created & is part of? He only hates iniquitous behavior, yet even God created the necessary possibility of evil, so we can appreciate it's opposite & so we can progress through faith & love.
I agree. Although I know that God doesn't "hate" in the sense that we hate but any negative behavior is not perfection so those who hate, need to work on that attribute. God doesn't need any work because He is love so He doesn't hate anything. He loves us, even the parts that we dislike, the iniquitous behavior.
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Old 06-01-2011, 12:27 PM
 
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Originally Posted by Reverend1111 View Post
I agree. Although I know that God doesn't "hate" in the sense that we hate but any negative behavior is not perfection so those who hate, need to work on that attribute. God doesn't need any work because He is love so He doesn't hate anything. He loves us, even the parts that we dislike, the iniquitous behavior.
That's a good point, Reverend. God created everything - whether deemed good or bad. God is really a paradox... suffers by seeing suffering, yet maintains cheerfulness & motivated unconditional love.

What I was trying to explain is...I see God as love (higher goodness & spirituality)... so when we engage in iniquitous behavior, we don't feel love or God.
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Old 06-01-2011, 12:28 PM
 
672 posts, read 579,505 times
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super:

Quote:
God is LOVE
Thats not the question ! God is Holy too. God was Love when He hated Esau Rom 9:13

13As it is written, Jacob have I loved, but Esau have I hated.

God's Love cannot be separated from in Christ Rom 8:39

39Nor height, nor depth, nor any other creature, shall be able to separate us from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord.

If one has not been Chosen in Christ, God does not Love them..
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