Is Hellfire A Bible Teaching? (Gomorrah, preacher, beliefs, Jesus Christ)
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The teaching of hellfire is commonplace in Christendom and non-Christian religions. This teaching defames the Creator and portrays him as a sadist who tortures people in flames of fire for all eternity—as punishment for wrongdoing committed during the relatively brief human lifespan. The hellfire dogma was brought into Christianity by the Roman Catholics who copied it from pagan religions. (Pagans are those who do not worship the God of the Judeo-Christian Bible.)
The Bible makes it clear as to how God views the ritual burning of people. Jehovah ended up rejecting the ancient Israelites after they got involved with pagan worship, which included burning their children to death
"And they [the Israelites/sons of Judah] have built the high places of Topheth, which is in the valley of the son of Hinnom, in order to burn their sons and their daughters in the fire, a thing that I had not commanded and that HAD NOT COME UP INTO MY HEART."(Jeremiah 7:31)
"{58} And they kept offending him with their high places, and with their graven images they kept inciting him to jealousy. {59} God heard and got to be furious, and he condemned Israelvery much. {60} And he finallyforsook the tabernacle of Shiloh, the tent in which he resided among earthling men."
The scriptures indicate that hell is nothing more than mankind’s common grave. Proof of this is provided by a verse of scripture in the Bible, which no hellfire-believing Christian can explain away. I’m referring to the scripture that says Jesus Christ--the epitome of a perfect, sinless, and obedient man--died and went to hell.
"{21} In fact, to this course you were called, because even Christ suffered for you, leaving you a model for you to follow his steps closely. {22} He committed no sin, nor was deception found in his mouth." (1 Peter 2:21-22)
"He seeing this before spake of the resurrection of Christ, that HIS SOUL WAS NOT LEFT IN HELL, neither his flesh did see corruption." (Acts 2:31--King James Version)
NOTE #1: The Bible uses the word "fire" symbolically to indicate permanent death or permanent destruction.
NOTE #2: the words "Hell" and "Hades" and "Pit" are synonyms that mean THE GRAVE (of mankind).
NOTE #3: "High Places" as used in the scriptures that I quote in this thread refer to the worship of the false gods.
DEBATE QUESTIONS: 1. According to Jeremiah 7:31, did Jehovah command the ancient Israelites to burn anyone in the fire?
2. According to Jeremiah 7:31, did the burning of people come to God's heart?
3. According to Jeremiah 7:31 and Psalms 78:58-59, did the ancient Israelites offend God by getting involved with false worship in their "HIGH PLACES", which included burning people to death?
4. According to those who teach hellfire torment, hell is a place for people who are wicked and sinful. If Hellfire is for wicked people, why did Jesus spend three days in hell--considering that it says at 1 Peter 2:22 that he did not commit any sin?
5. Jesus obeyed Jehovah and died a slow and torturous death for mankind. Hadn't he suffered enough? He'd suffered terribly--because of being obedient to his Heavenly Father. So why was he being punished again with burning hellfire? What's the logic for punishing him all over again?
6. Recall that after Jesus' resurrection, he appeared and spoke to several of his faithful apostles on different occasions before he returned to heaven. Why is it that Jesus made no mention to any of his apostles--after his resurrection--that he went to hell where he burned for three days?
7. When people are being tortured in hellfire, wouldn't they have to KNOW or be conscious/aware of the fact that they are being burned? I mean to say, what's the point of punishing people in hell if they aren't even aware?
8. Those who believe in eternal torment say that the person's soul is being burned forever. What is the soul? Is it something separate from the person's body? Are animals souls also or is this only for humans?
When an individual says " the Bible " that individual is speaking like a parrot or a deceiver. There are over 400 (Christian, Catholic, Cult) Greek, Syrian, Latin, German, English, French, Spanish, etc., Bibles which do not match in content, volume or doctrine. Additionally, over 6 billion Bibles have been printed.
KJV Thou therefore which teachest another, teachest thou not thyself ?
God gave us logic and reasoning and if someone still hold unto Eternal Torment then they do so against sound logic and reasoning that God has given us. It really means that people are not applying that logic and reasoning to understand the Truth. Instead many are just accepting a brand of "TRUTH" from a trusted source.
Where else can one learn the truth other than God's word? From self?
Proverbs 3:5-7
"Trust in the Lord with all your heart, And lean not on your own understanding;
In all your ways acknowledge Him, And He shall directyour paths.
Do not be wise in your own eyes;..."
Logic and reasoning elevate themselves above God's word. God clearly tells us not to lean on our own understanding.
When an individual says " the Bible " that individual is speaking like a parrot or a deceiver. There are over 400 (Christian, Catholic, Cult) Greek, Syrian, Latin, German, English, French, Spanish, etc., Bibles which do not match in content, volume or doctrine. Additionally, over 6 billion Bibles have been printed.
Which specific doctrine of Christ or the apostles has been taken out of these translations or added to them that you believe has effected the overall grand scheme of redemption or how to live a good christian life?
Where else can one learn the truth other than God's word? From self?
Proverbs 3:5-7
"Trust in the Lord with all your heart, And lean not on your own understanding;
In all your ways acknowledge Him, And He shall directyour paths.
Do not be wise in your own eyes;..."
Logic and reasoning elevate themselves above God's word. God clearly tells us not to lean on our own understanding.
Katie
Correct, but I didn't say our understanding. I said to use our reasoning and logic that God gave us. That is not the same as saying our "understanding".
Correct, but I didn't say our understanding. I said to use our reasoning and logic that God gave us. That is not the same as saying our "understanding".
It still comes from self. When one depends on his/her own logic and reasoning to understand what it is that God would have them do to be saved and to live a good christian life, then that one is most definitely leaning on him/herself and not on God. The only place we can go to find what Jesus would have us do is to His written word.
It still comes from self. When one depends on his/her own logic and reasoning to understand what it is that God would have them do to be saved and to live a good christian life, then that one is most definitely leaning on him/herself and not on God. The only place we can go to find what Jesus would have us do is to His written word.
His written word is not God. You can go to God directly and then use your logic and reasoning to understand. Even if you were to go to the Bible, it would still be _your_ understanding. This says that when your understanding and God conflict go with God.
Correct, but I didn't say our understanding. I said to use our reasoning and logic that God gave us. That is not the same as saying our "understanding".
One will never hear nor understand the things of the Spirit with ones fleshy mindful reasoning or feelings.
God tells us "let us reason together" with Him (Is. 1:18). God is Spirit and the only way one can hear and understand spiritual things is if His spirit has been given to them. And we know that only believers have been given His Spirit.
15“If you love me, you will obey what I command. 16And I will ask the Father, and he will give you another Counselor to be with you forever— 17the Spirit of truth. The world cannot accept him, because it neither sees him nor knows him. But you know him, for he lives with you and will bec in you. (John 14)
Hades is not the grave. On the cross Jesus told the thief that he would be with Him in Paradise that very day. The grave is not Paradise. Before Jesus died and was resurrected, Paradise was one compartment of Hades where the righteous dead went (Luke 16:19-31). A different compartment of Hades is 'Torments' where the unsaved dead went and still go after death.
Since the death and resurrection of Jesus Christ, Paradise is now in the third heaven. (2 Cor 12:2-4).
The word soul is used in different ways in the Bible. In Matthew 10:28 it is used for the immaterial part of man which survives the death of the body.
Matthew 10:28 ''And do not fear those who kill the body, but are unable to kill the soul; but rather fear Him who can destroy both soul and body in geenna - Gehenna - the lake of fire (Rev 20:11-15).
'Destroy' is the Greek word apollumi which does not refer to cessation of existence, but to utter ruination and uselessness. That is the condition of the unbeliever in the lake of fire. Hades and the lake of fire are two different places. Hades is the temporary place of confinement for the unbeliever after death, and Gehenna or the lake of fire is the unbelievers permanent and eternal prison.
Likewise, in Gen 35:18 Rachel's soul is said to depart from her because she died. Physical death is the separtion of the soul from the body.
Gen 35:18 It came about as her soul [nephesh] was departing (for she died), that she named him Ben-oni; but his father called him Benjamin.
In 2 Peter 1:13-15, though the word for soul is not used, Peter speaks of his earthly dwelling which is his body, and departing from it, laying it aside.
2 Peter 1:13 'I consider it right, as long as I am in this earthly dwelling, to stir you up by way of reminder, 14] knowing that the laying aside of my earthly dwelling is imminent, as also our Lord Jesus Christ has made clear to me. 15] And I will also be diligent that at any time after my departure you will be able to call these things to mind.
The early church didn't preach hellfire, and Paul didn't discuss it in his letters.
What they DID discuss, is judgment. (And judgment was considered a good thing, whereby man learns righteousness. Not a bunch of finger-pointing.)
Also, the world "hellfire" has obtained a new meaning in modern Christianity that it didn't have 2,000 years ago.
It wasn't anything "new" and Jesus never used the word to try to scare people into believing the Gospel. (that's a modern-day tactic)
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