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Old 09-18-2012, 03:55 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tthttf View Post
No!
lol...NO! NO! WRONG!...lol...you still haven't addressed the scriptures that contradict your teaching.

Quote:
And you are leaving out verses in John 8 that show that these same people believed on Christ wanted to kill him. Just read a little farther down.
I didn't leave anything out. I suppose I could paste all 66 books, but I don't think that would help. You're simply assuming what's not in the text. Read it again, starting a few verses before:

Joh 8:28 Then said Jesus unto them, When ye have lifted up the Son of man, then shall ye know that I am he, and that I do nothing of myself; but as my Father hath taught me, I speak these things.
Joh 8:29 And he that sent me is with me: the Father hath not left me alone; for I do always those things that please him.

Joh 8:30 As he spake these words, many believed on him.
Joh 8:31 Then said Jesus to those Jews which believed on him, If ye continue in my word, then are ye my disciples indeed;
Joh 8:32 And ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.

Joh 8:33 They answered him, We be Abraham’s seed, and were never in bondage to any man: how sayest thou, Ye shall be made free?
Joh 8:34 Jesus answered them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Whosoever committeth sin is the servant of sin.

"Them" and "they", as opposed to "those", are representative of two different groups. The unbelievers ("them" and "they" who wanted to kill Jesus) are not the same as "those" who were believing on Him. Nor are "those" who believed representative of "them" and "they", who did not. That should be obvious to anyone reading the text. And I'm surprised you don't see that.

And, I think this is perhaps the problem. You're indoctrinated by the books of Armstrong, and you're left without the ability to read scripture without Armstrong's doctrines interpreting for you while you read.

Quote:
Like I said, you need to get back to the basics and quit playing around with the Greek.
And, like I said, you really need to ditch the garbage of Armstrongism. It's really not helping you out here. This is painfully obvious.

If I could recommend something to you: After taking out the garbage, invest in a good literal translation of the Bible (YLT or LITV come to mind), a good Greek/English and Hebrew/English interlinear with parsing helps, buy at least two comprehensive Greek/English and Hebrew/English lexicons that have concordances that list and identify each and every occurrence of each and every word found in the scriptures, buy two or three Greek and Hebrew grammar books, and then study them all, without Armstrong's ghost looking over your shoulder.

PS: I'm sill waiting for you to address Joh 3:36 and Joh 5:24.

Last edited by AlabamaStorm; 09-18-2012 at 04:18 PM.. Reason: typo
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Old 09-18-2012, 04:27 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AlabamaStorm View Post
lol...NO! NO! WRONG!...lol...you still haven't addressed the scriptures that contradict your teaching.

I didn't leave anything out. I suppose I could paste all 66 books, but I don't think that would help. You're simply assuming what's not in the text. Read it again, starting a few verses before:

Joh 8:28 Then said Jesus unto them, When ye have lifted up the Son of man, then shall ye know that I am he, and that I do nothing of myself; but as my Father hath taught me, I speak these things.
Joh 8:29 And he that sent me is with me: the Father hath not left me alone; for I do always those things that please him.

Joh 8:30 As he spake these words, many believed on him.
Joh 8:31 Then said Jesus to those Jews which believed on him, If ye continue in my word, then are ye my disciples indeed;
Joh 8:32 And ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.

Joh 8:33 They answered him, We be Abraham’s seed, and were never in bondage to any man: how sayest thou, Ye shall be made free?
Joh 8:34 Jesus answered them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Whosoever committeth sin is the servant of sin.

"Them" and "they", as opposed to "those", are representative of two different groups. The unbelievers ("them" and "they") are not the same as "those" who believed. Nor are "those" who believed representative of "them" and "they", who did not. That should be obvious to anyone reading the text. And I'm surprised you don't see that.

And, I think this is perhaps the problem. You're indoctrinated by the books of Armstrong, and you're left without the ability to read scripture without Armstrong's doctrines interpreting for you while you read.

And, like I said, you really need to ditch the garbage of Armstrongism. It's really not helping you out here. This is painfully obvious.

If I could recommend something to you: Invest in a good literal translation of the Bible (YLT or LITV come to mind), a good Greek/English interlinear with parsing helps, buy at least two comprehensive Greek/English lexicons with concordances that identifies each occurrence of each word, two or three Greek grammar books, and study them all.

PS: I'm sill waiting for you to address Joh 3:36 and Joh 5:24.
No!

This was the same group that believed on Him but they obviously were not called by God. (John 6:44, 65).

Where you are making your mistake is that you think the whole world is being called now and it is not.

God is only calling a tiny few now, the rest are blinded and will be given their chance later during the Great White Throne Judgment period.

You fail to keep God's Holy Days listed in Leviticus 23, therefore you are blind to this fact.

Mr. Armstrong taught that the Holy Sabbaths should be kept. That is why he could see this fact and you cannot.
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Old 09-18-2012, 05:08 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tthttf View Post
No!

This was the same group that believed on Him but they obviously were not called by God. (John 6:44, 65).
Yes! They were called!...lol...What you fail to realize is that "believing" on Jesus is synonymous with having been "given" to Jesus, being "drawn" to Jesus, and "coming" to Jesus. Look:

Joh 6:39 And this is the Father’s will which hath sent me, that of all which he hath given me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up again at the last day.
Joh 6:40 And this is the will of him that sent me, that every one which seeth the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life: and I will raise him up at the last day.

Joh 6:44 No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him: and I will raise him up at the last day.

Every believer (without exception) has been "given" to Christ as well as "drawn" to Christ. The above texts make that very clear.

And, likewise, not believing is synonymous with not coming; and by implication: believing is synonymous with coming to Jesus:

Joh 6:64 But there are some of you that believe not. For Jesus knew from the beginning who they were that believed not, and who should betray him.
Joh 6:65 And he said, Therefore said I unto you, that no man can come unto me, except it were given unto him of my Father.

Quote:
Where you are making your mistake is that you think the whole world is being called now and it is not.
Where have I said that?

Quote:
God is only calling a tiny few now, the rest are blinded and will be given their chance later during the Great White Throne Judgment period.
Simply more Armstrongism being displayed. There is nothing in scripture to support this.

Quote:
You fail to keep God's Holy Days listed in Leviticus 23, therefore you are blind to this fact.

Mr. Armstrong taught that the Holy Sabbaths should be kept. That is why he could see this fact and you cannot.
If what you say concerning Armstrong is factual, scripture describes him similar to Israel:

Rom 9:31 But Israel, which followed after the law of righteousness, hath not attained to the law of righteousness.
Rom 9:32 Wherefore? Because they sought it not by faith, but as it were by the works of the law. For they stumbled at that stumblingstone;

Rom 10:2 For I bear them record that they have a zeal of God, but not according to knowledge.
Rom 10:3 For they being ignorant of God’s righteousness, and going about to establish their own righteousness, have not submitted themselves unto the righteousness of God.
Rom 10:4 For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to every one that believeth.

PS: I'm still waiting for you to respond to Joh 3:36 and Joh 5:24
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Old 09-18-2012, 05:37 PM
 
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Default What will keep one from inheriting the Kingdom of Heaven?

Given that God WILL have ALL to be saved . . . I would say nothing.
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Old 09-18-2012, 06:31 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AlabamaStorm View Post
Yes! They were called!...lol...What you fail to realize is that "believing" on Jesus is synonymous with having been "given" to Jesus, being "drawn" to Jesus, and "coming" to Jesus. Look:

Joh 6:39 And this is the Father’s will which hath sent me, that of all which he hath given me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up again at the last day.
Joh 6:40 And this is the will of him that sent me, that every one which seeth the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life: and I will raise him up at the last day.

Joh 6:44 No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him: and I will raise him up at the last day.

Every believer (without exception) has been "given" to Christ as well as "drawn" to Christ. The above texts make that very clear.

And, likewise, not believing is synonymous with not coming; and by implication: believing is synonymous with coming to Jesus:

Joh 6:64 But there are some of you that believe not. For Jesus knew from the beginning who they were that believed not, and who should betray him.
Joh 6:65 And he said, Therefore said I unto you, that no man can come unto me, except it were given unto him of my Father.

Where have I said that?

Simply more Armstrongism being displayed. There is nothing in scripture to support this.

If what you say concerning Armstrong is factual, scripture describes him similar to Israel:

Rom 9:31 But Israel, which followed after the law of righteousness, hath not attained to the law of righteousness.
Rom 9:32 Wherefore? Because they sought it not by faith, but as it were by the works of the law. For they stumbled at that stumblingstone;

Rom 10:2 For I bear them record that they have a zeal of God, but not according to knowledge.
Rom 10:3 For they being ignorant of God’s righteousness, and going about to establish their own righteousness, have not submitted themselves unto the righteousness of God.
Rom 10:4 For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to every one that believeth.

PS: I'm still waiting for you to respond to Joh 3:36 and Joh 5:24
No! You are watering down the strait, narrow way of true Christianity. True Christianity is more than your password theology of just believing on Jesus Christ.

Joh 6:65 And he said, Therefore said I unto you, that no man can come unto me, except it were given unto him of my Father.
Joh 6:66
From that time many of his disciples went back, and walked no more with him.
Joh 6:67 Then said Jesus unto the twelve, Will ye also go away?
Joh 6:68 Then Simon Peter answered him, Lord, to whom shall we go? thou hast the words of eternal life.


The Twelve didn't think it was just believing on Christ as you would have people believe!

They were truly called and it was obviously from the Father and they stayed with Christ. And they apparently knew there was more to it than just a profession of a belief.

Plus!

Mat 7:21 "Not every one who says to me, 'Lord, Lord,' shall enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of my Father who is in heaven.

You have to obey God the Father and do his will to enter into the Kingdom of Heaven. You have to keep God's Commandments.

You teach against keeping God's Commandments!

You apparently teach all you have to do is believe on Christ to be saved. No works at all! James condemns that.

Jas 2:26 For as the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without works is dead also.

Now, believing on Christ is required to be saved. Don't misunderstand. But you have to not only believe on Christ you have to believe Christ. There is more that you must do to inherit eternal life. You must repent and obey God. Christ said specifically when asked what one needs to do to inherit eternal life and He answered to keep the Commandments of God.

His words are reinforced in Revelation 14.

Revelation 14:
12 Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus.

Mr. Armstrong taught correctly that believing on Christ is not enough, you have to believe what Christ said and do what He taught. Keeping God's Commandments is what Christ taught. He did not come to destroy the spiritual Law of God, but He came and magnified the Law and He pointed out the magnification of God's Commandments to illustrate this spiritual magnification.

So, to be a true Christian you have to have more than just a belief. You have to be led by God's Holy Spirit.

Romans 8:
14 For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, they are the sons of God.

You also have to be subject to the law of God.

Romans 8:
7 Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be.

And to actually inherit eternal life you must have God's Holy Spirit.

Romans 8:
11 But if the Spirit of him that raised up Jesus from the dead dwell in you, he that raised up Christ from the dead shall also quicken your mortal bodies by his Spirit that dwelleth in you.

Now, you can't have any of this if you do not believe on Christ, for sure, but you must have more than just a belief on Christ, you must believe Christ and do what He tells you to do and let Christ live His life in you through the Holy Spirit (Gal 2:20) and keep God's Commandments as Christ told us to do.
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Old 09-18-2012, 08:02 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tthttf View Post
No! You are watering down the strait, narrow way of true Christianity. True Christianity is more than your password theology of just believing on Jesus Christ.

Joh 6:65 And he said, Therefore said I unto you, that no man can come unto me, except it were given unto him of my Father.
Joh 6:66
From that time many of his disciples went back, and walked no more with him.
Joh 6:67 Then said Jesus unto the twelve, Will ye also go away?
Joh 6:68 Then Simon Peter answered him, Lord, to whom shall we go? thou hast the words of eternal life.


The Twelve didn't think it was just believing on Christ as you would have people believe!
The text does not say those who "believed" went back. Again, you're assuming something that is not in the text. The term "disciple", as stated in the text, does not imply that such a person was believing on Jesus.

Quote:
Plus!

Mat 7:21 "Not every one who says to me, 'Lord, Lord,' shall enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of my Father who is in heaven.

You have to obey God the Father and do his will to enter into the Kingdom of Heaven. You have to keep God's Commandments.
You teach against keeping God's Commandments!
Nonsense. What scripture tells us is that no one will be justified by keeping the law. And, doing the will of God is "seeing" (spiritually) the Son and "believing" on Him:

Joh 6:40 And this is the will of him that sent me, that every one which seeth the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life: and I will raise him up at the last day.

Quote:
You apparently teach all you have to do is believe on Christ to be saved. No works at all! James condemns that.
I don't believe that believers "do", or did, anything in-order to have their sins forgiven, or to be justified before God, or to be reconciled to God. Absolutely nothing. The natural man (prior to regeneration) is completely passive therein concerning spiritual things. Those who are believing (those born of the Spirit), have simply received what Christ already accomplished for them. What Christ accomplished on the cross is not dependent on man, my friend. That which Christ has accomplished objectively is received subjectively by those who believe. And, even the subjective act of receiving, through faith, is also accomplished by the Grace of God.

Eph 2:8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:

Quote:
Jas 2:26 For as the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without works is dead also.
You've failed to understand the context of what, and to whom, James is speaking. Here it is:

Jas 2:18 Yea, a man may say, Thou hast faith, and I have works: shew me thy faith without thy works, and I will shew thee my faith by my works.

James is speaking of his (I, me, my) works as being the evidence of faith before other men (thou, thy, thee), not God. God sees the heart. Man, who cannot see the heart, needs to see works as evidence.

The rest of your post is simply the re-hashing of old posts. I could spend all day refuting your doctrines...however, it's proving more futile to do so...the Gospel is simply hidden from you, like it was from Armstrong.

You still have not addressed Joh 3:36, 5:24 as well as 6:47. Those texts refute your doctrine that there was "no eternal life" prior to Pentecost.

As a matter of fact, you still have not addressed the text of Luk 17:21, other than quoting the RSV translation to your shame.
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Old 09-19-2012, 07:02 AM
 
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Quote:
The text does not say those who "believed" went back. Again, you're assuming something that is not in the text. The term "disciple", as stated in the text, does not imply that such a person was believing on Jesus.
In John 8, those Jews who believed on Him and wanted to kill him were NOT His disciples. So, there were some of those disciples who went back and walked no more with Him who believed on Him as well for sure.

And Christ WAS addressing those "who believed on him", if you read the John 8 carefully. You are just putting your private interpretation on the verses to make it say what it does not.

John 8:31 Then said Jesus to those Jews which believed on him, If ye continue in my word, then are ye my disciples indeed;
32 And ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.
33 They [the ones whom Christ addressed in verses 31-32] answered him, We be Abraham's seed, and were never in bondage to any man: how sayest thou, Ye shall be made free?

You are the one who is adding extra words to say the word "They" in verse 33 does not mean the group that believed on Him. You are the one who is assuming something that is not in the Scripture.

Now, you have discredited Mr. Armstrong in past posts. Listen to this radio broadcast on John 8 and let Mr. Armstrong explain to you that you are the one who is teaching error.

Click here: John 8

Quote:
Nonsense. What scripture tells us is that no one will be justified by keeping the law. And, doing the will of God is "seeing" (spiritually) the Son and "believing" on Him:

Joh 6:40 And this is the will of him that sent me, that every one which seeth the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life: and I will raise him up at the last day.
Your words are the nonsense. You are skimming over what Christ actually said and focusing on the fact you must believe on Him and stopping there and coming to the wrong conclusion.

John 8:
31 ...If ye continue in my word, then are ye my disciples indeed;
32 And ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.
51 Verily, verily, I say unto you, If a man keep my saying, he shall never see death.

Now, we see that you must obey what Christ said and continue in doing what He said. As Mr. Armstrong pointed out, Christ only spoke what God the Father told Him to speak.

John 7:
16 Jesus answered them, and said, My doctrine is not mine, but his that sent me.
17 If any man will do his will, he shall know of the doctrine, whether it be of God, or whether I speak of myself.

So, if you are to continue in Christ's Word, you will be doing the will of God the Father because the only way to know the Truth to know the doctrine as John 7:17 is to do the will of God the Father.

How do you do the will of God the Father to have eternal life? You keep His Commandments!

Matthew 19:
17 And he said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God: but if thou wilt enter into life, keep the commandments.

When someone commands you to do something, that is that person's will to have you perform a commandment given to you. Just believing on Christ is not enough. A person can want to kill Christ and believe on Him at the same time as John 8 points out.

Quote:
I don't believe that believers "do", or did, anything in-order to have their sins forgiven, or to be justified before God, or to be reconciled to God. Absolutely nothing. The natural man (prior to regeneration) is completely passive therein concerning spiritual things. Those who are believing (those born of the Spirit), have simply received what Christ already accomplished for them. What Christ accomplished on the cross is not dependent on man, my friend. That which Christ has accomplished objectively is received subjectively by those who believe. And, even the subjective act of receiving, through faith, is also accomplished by the Grace of God.

Eph 2:8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
No! A person must be predestinated to be called by God in this early spring harvest (Pentecost). You are confusing the fall harvest (Feast of Tabernacles) with this small spring harvest because you do not the will of God the Father and keep the annual Holy Days which pictures this clearly if you have the right ministers to teach you (and if you are truly called).

Ephesians 1:
10 That in the dispensation of the fulness of times he might gather together in one all things in Christ, both which are in heaven, and which are on earth; even in him:
11 In whom also we have obtained an inheritance, being predestinated according to the purpose of him who worketh all things after the counsel of his own will:
12 That we should be to the praise of his glory, who first trusted in Christ.

Those called are predestinated to be called. The world in general is not being called now. Christ spoke in parables to hide the meaning from the world in general and only spoke plainly to those whom God had drawn to Him.

Your password theology is not right! You can't just profess that you believe on Christ. You must keep the Commandments of God as Christ said. The only way you can keep the Commandments of God is to receive God's Holy Spirit. The only way you can have eternal life is by the Holy Spirit as Romans 8:11 points out.

Quote:
You've failed to understand the context of what, and to whom, James is speaking. Here it is:

Jas 2:18 Yea, a man may say, Thou hast faith, and I have works: shew me thy faith without thy works, and I will shew thee my faith by my works.

James is speaking of his (I, me, my) works as being the evidence of faith before other men (thou, thy, thee), not God. God sees the heart. Man, who cannot see the heart, needs to see works as evidence.
When Christ was keeping the Sabbath, He was accused of breaking the Sabbath for the manner in which He kept it. He healed on the Sabbath and was accused of breaking the Sabbath and yet we all know He did not sin or else He would not have lived a sinless life to have paid the penalty for our sins.

Today keeping the Sabbath is different. We Sabbath-keepers have been persecuted by this church of the Beast (in Rome) for keeping the Sabbath. Many early Christian Sabbath-keepers were put to death. It takes faith to keep the Sabbath today in this present evil world who does not acknowledge the true God in general.

Faith is required and can be demonstrated by resting and keeping the Seventh Day Sabbath. James was correct you must have works and not a dead faith with no works involved. You preach an empty profession of just believing on Christ when Christ said you must continue in His word. If you do not keep the Sabbath and breaking the Ten Commandments then you are not continuing in Christ's Word, for Christ was the Word, the actual Spokesman who gave the Ten Commandments at Mount Sinai.

Quote:
The rest of your post is simply the re-hashing of old posts. I could spend all day refuting your doctrines...however, it's proving more futile to do so...the Gospel is simply hidden from you, like it was from Armstrong.
No, the Gospel of the Kingdom of God is hidden from you. On a previous thread you seem perplexed when I pointed out the difference between the Gospel of the Kingdom of God and your false gospel only preaching about the Person of Christ. You are the one who does not believe the true Gospel of the Kingdom of God which you must do to be saved (not just believing on Christ but continuing in His word).

Quote:
You still have not addressed Joh 3:36, 5:24 as well as 6:47. Those texts refute your doctrine that there was "no eternal life" prior to Pentecost.
Eternal life was not open to ancient Israel as I explained previously. But God's Holy Spirit was given to the prophets and others God used in performing the special jobs they had to do.

As far as the scriptures you have quoted, I have addressed them indirectly in my responses to you.

Quote:
As a matter of fact, you still have not addressed the text of Luk 17:21, other than quoting the RSV translation to your shame.
The Kingdom of God was NOT in those Pharisees' hearts.

Since you won't believe my words or Mr. Armstrong's I will give you one of Mr. Armstrong's student's explanation of Luke 17:21. I would post his explanations out here but I must use a link to do it properly according to forum rules:

Click here: What Is the Kingdom of God?

Like I keep saying, you need to study the Bible and learn the basics and quit playing with the Greek.

You are coming to the wrong conclusions and are encouraging others to sin against God by disobeying God and breaking His Commandments. You will be called least in the Kingdom by those who will be in the Kingdom (you won't be in the Kingdom yourself) unless you repent.

Christ kept His Father's Commandments and so are we to follow Christ's example and do the same.

May you repent!
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Old 09-19-2012, 11:00 AM
 
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Originally Posted by tthttf View Post
In John 8, those Jews who believed on Him and wanted to kill him were NOT His disciples. So, there were some of those disciples who went back and walked no more with Him who believed on Him as well for sure.
Your interpretation of John 8 is very bizarre and clearly refuted by scripture. A simply read of the narrative makes that abundantly clear, my friend.

Nor does the text say that those who "believed on Him" wanted to kill him, as you suppose. Your "for sure" argument is simply untenable with the actual text and you're simply seeing Armstrong's doctrines where none exist.

Those who believed on Jesus had eternal life. The text does not say that those believing on Jesus wanted to kill Him. The two concepts and ideas you're presenting (believing on Jesus and wanting to kill Him at the same time) are not only bizarre but completely contradictory in light of the rest of scripture:

Joh 6:47 Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that believeth on me hath everlasting life.

1Jn 3:15 Whosoever hateth his brother is a murderer: and ye know that no murderer hath eternal life abiding in him.

Quote:
And Christ WAS addressing those "who believed on him", if you read the John 8 carefully. You are just putting your private interpretation on the verses to make it say what it does not.

John 8:31 Then said Jesus to those Jews which believed on him, If ye continue in my word, then are ye my disciples indeed;
32 And ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.
33 They [the ones whom Christ addressed in verses 31-32] answered him, We be Abraham's seed, and were never in bondage to any man: how sayest thou, Ye shall be made free?

You are the one who is adding extra words to say the word "They" in verse 33 does not mean the group that believed on Him. You are the one who is assuming something that is not in the Scripture.
I've added words?!?...I've high lited (in pink) what you added to the text...lol. I've also not put any "private" interpretation on anything, my friend.

The text of Joh 8:33 to v.59 is clearly a dialog between Jesus and those who did not believe. If you simply read the text, Jesus even calls them unbelievers:

Joh 8:45 And because I tell you the truth, ye believe me not.

...as opposed to those whom John tells us (by inspiration) believed on Him (v.30 and v.31).

Are you really serious when you say that those who believed on Jesus wanted to kill him? That is an incredibly bizarre statement to make. Do you really not see the difference between those who believed on Jesus, and those who did not? This discussion is becoming rather humorous...

Also, you've yet to adequately address Joh 3:36, Joh 5:24 and Joh 6:47.

These texts specifically state that he who believes on Jesus hath eternal life. The Greek word being translated as "hath" in those texts is εχει: The word is used in the Greek present tense, indicative mood. And, there is simply no way to dismiss this, my friend. Those who believe on Jesus have eternal life. These texts are the proverbial nail in Armstrong's coffin and refute much of what Armstrong believed and taught. This is why I keep repeating them.

So far, you've said that these texts apply only to ancient "prophets" and those who had a "special job" to do. However, the texts do not say what you've concluded. Nor have you supplied any scripture whatsoever that will support such an erroneous position.

If you're unable to see what those texts specifically say, namely, that: those who believe on Jesus have eternal life, then discussing the rest of your Armstrong doctrines becomes rather fruitless.

If you haven't guessed already, I'm not going to let you proceed beyond this point...
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Old 09-19-2012, 11:46 AM
 
419 posts, read 432,412 times
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Originally Posted by SAAN View Post
After reading through many of these different forum topics, ive seen many postings saying that if you dont follow each and every one the 10 commandments, you will go to hell etc(Mainly sabbath breaking). Ive listed just about all the verses i could find on who will not inherent the kingdom of heaven. Now can someone please show me where not keeping a 7th day Saturday sabbath & the 7 Holy feast days keeps one out of the kingdom, since its has been stated many times that breaking this command will spell out our doom.

----------------------------------------------------------------
The Ten Commandments (Exodus 20:2-17 NKJV)
1 “I am the Lord your God, who brought you out of the land of Egypt, out of the house of bondage. You shall have no other gods before Me.

2 “You shall not make for yourself a carved image, or any likeness of anything that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth; you shall not bow down to them nor serve them. For I, the Lord your God, am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers on the children to the third and fourth generations of those who hate Me, but showing mercy to thousands, to those who love Me and keep My Commandments.

3 “You shall not take the name of the Lord your God in vain, for the Lord will not hold him guiltless who takes His name in vain.

4 “Remember the Sabbath day, to keep it holy. Six days you shall labor and do all your work, but the seventh day is the Sabbath of the Lord your God. In it you shall do no work: you, nor your son, nor your daughter, nor your male servant, nor your female servant, nor your cattle, nor your stranger who is within your gates. For in six days the Lord made the heavens and the earth, the sea, and all that is in them, and rested the seventh day. Therefore the Lord blessed the Sabbath day and hallowed it.

5 “Honor your father and your mother, that your days may be long upon the land which the Lord your God is giving you.

6 “You shall not murder.

7 “You shall not commit adultery.

8 “You shall not steal.

9 “You shall not bear false witness against your neighbor.

10 “You shall not covet your neighbor's house; you shall not covet your neighbor's wife, nor his male servant, nor his female servant, nor his ox, nor his donkey, nor anything that is your neighbor's.”
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Galatians 5:19-21
New King James Version (NKJV)
19 Now the works of the flesh are evident, which are: adultery,[a] fornication, uncleanness, lewdness, 20 idolatry, sorcery, hatred, contentions, jealousies, outbursts of wrath, selfish ambitions, dissensions, heresies, 21 envy, murders,[b] drunkenness, revelries, and the like; of which I tell you beforehand, just as I also told you in time past, that those who practice such things will not inherit the kingdom of God.


1 Corinthians 6:9-10
9 Do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived. Neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor homosexuals,[a] nor sodomites, 10 nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners will inherit the kingdom of God.


Ephesians 5:5
5 For this you know,[a] that no fornicator, unclean person, nor covetous man, who is an idolater, has any inheritance in the kingdom of Christ and God.


Colossians 3:5-9
5 Therefore put to death your members which are on the earth: fornication, uncleanness, passion, evil desire, and covetousness, which is idolatry. 6 Because of these things the wrath of God is coming upon the sons of disobedience, 7 in which you yourselves once walked when you lived in them.
8 But now you yourselves are to put off all these: anger, wrath, malice, blasphemy, filthy language out of your mouth. 9 Do not lie to one another, since you have put off the old man with his deeds,


Revelation 20:15
15 And anyone not found written in the Book of Life was cast into the lake of fire.


Revelation 21:8
8 But the cowardly, unbelieving,[a] abominable, murderers, sexually immoral, sorcerers, idolaters, and all liars shall have their part in the lake which burns with fire and brimstone, which is the second death.”





-It is very clear by these verses that there is more one can do outside the 10 commandments that will also cause them not to go to heaven, but going to church on a Sunday, or not resting all day Saturday is not listed anywhere.
What will keep you from inheriting heaven? Unbelief. that's it. If you don't trust in Christ for the forgiveness of your sins you're subject to damnation based on what you've done.
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Old 09-19-2012, 12:19 PM
 
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Originally Posted by RuralMissionary View Post
What will keep you from inheriting heaven? Unbelief. that's it. If you don't trust in Christ for the forgiveness of your sins you're subject to damnation based on what you've done.

I agree, but many on here claim if you dont observe a Saturday 7th day sabbath, your doomed. And I have asked to show a verse in which Jesus or the apostles specifically said if you dont observe the sabbath, that will go to hell for not keeping a 7th day sabbath and no one has been able to list a verse yet without taking a verse somewhere and flipping it out of context to fit there point. Every verse I listed shows what one must practice to spell there doom, but many still cling to the sabbath for there justification.
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