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Old 09-07-2012, 05:50 PM
 
2,526 posts, read 2,919,141 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tthttf View Post
No, you are forgetting Acts 5:32. God only gives His holy Spirit to those who obey Him...
Actually, if you look more closely at the text, those who were obeying (present tense) had already been given (past tense) the Holy Spirit.

Here is that text:

Act 5:32 and we are His witnesses of these sayings, and the Holy Spirit also, whom God gave (Greek εδωκεν, aorist tense, indicative mood) to those obeying (Greek πειθαρχουσιν, present tense) him.'

Those who had been given the Holy Spirit, were obeying. They were believing the Gospel.
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Old 09-07-2012, 07:03 PM
 
2,541 posts, read 2,523,207 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AlabamaStorm View Post
Actually, if you look more closely at the text, those who were obeying (present tense) had already been given (past tense) the Holy Spirit.

Here is that text:

Act 5:32 and we are His witnesses of these sayings, and the Holy Spirit also, whom God gave (Greek εδωκεν, aorist tense, indicative mood) to those obeying (Greek πειθαρχουσιν, present tense) him.'

Those who had been given the Holy Spirit, were obeying. They were believing the Gospel.
Very good read and all so true!
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Old 09-08-2012, 07:06 PM
 
951 posts, read 1,045,355 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AlabamaStorm View Post
Actually, if you look more closely at the text, those who were obeying (present tense) had already been given (past tense) the Holy Spirit.

Here is that text:

Act 5:32 and we are His witnesses of these sayings, and the Holy Spirit also, whom God gave (Greek εδωκεν, aorist tense, indicative mood) to those obeying (Greek πειθαρχουσιν, present tense) him.'

Those who had been given the Holy Spirit, were obeying. They were believing the Gospel.
If you believe the Gospel, you will also be keeping the Holy Days and other special days of God.

PASSOVER
DAYS OF UNLEAVENED BREAD
PENTECOST
FEAST OF TRUMPETS
DAY OF ATONEMENT
FEAST OF TABERNACLES
LAST GREAT DAY

The Days of Unleavened picture our part in God's Master Plan of salvation. We must put sin, pictured by leaven, out of our lives. For seven days we go through this lesson every year.

The very next Holy Day to come in sequence after the Days of Unleavened Bread is Pentecost which pictures the giving of God's Holy Spirit and the New Testament Church.

If you are striving to put sin out of your life which was pictured by the Days of Unleavened Bread, you will be keeping God's Commandments, Statutes, Judgments and obeying God.

Act 5:32 [RSV]
And we are witnesses to these things, and so is the Holy Spirit whom God has given to those who obey him."

He gives His Holy Spirit to those who obey Him. It does not matter about the tense of the verbs.

And if you quit obeying God, you will lose the Holy Spirit. Remember the lesson of King Saul. He disobeyed God and God's Holy Spirit left him and evil spirit came on him instead.

So, you do not have God's Holy Spirit since you do not obey God but rather have followed a false christ who claims he did away with the Ten Commandments and/or fulfilled your obedience for you in the past. You have turned the grace of God into disobedience against Him.

Which brings to mind Jude 4:

Jude
4 For there are certain men crept in unawares, who were before of old ordained to this condemnation, ungodly men, turning the grace of our God into lasciviousness, and denying the only Lord God, and our Lord Jesus Christ.

Repent!
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Old 09-08-2012, 07:16 PM
 
Location: CentralAlabama
173 posts, read 134,090 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tthttf View Post
If you believe the Gospel, you will also be keeping the Holy Days and other special days of God.

PASSOVER
DAYS OF UNLEAVENED BREAD
PENTECOST
FEAST OF TRUMPETS
DAY OF ATONEMENT
FEAST OF TABERNACLES
LAST GREAT DAY

The Days of Unleavened picture our part in God's Master Plan of salvation. We must put sin, pictured by leaven, out of our lives. For seven days we go through this lesson every year.

The very next Holy Day to come in sequence after the Days of Unleavened Bread is Pentecost which pictures the giving of God's Holy Spirit and the New Testament Church.

If you are striving to put sin out of your life which was pictured by the Days of Unleavened Bread, you will be keeping God's Commandments, Statutes, Judgments and obeying God.

Act 5:32 [RSV]
And we are witnesses to these things, and so is the Holy Spirit whom God has given to those who obey him."

He gives His Holy Spirit to those who obey Him. It does not matter about the tense of the verbs.

And if you quit obeying God, you will lose the Holy Spirit. Remember the lesson of King Saul. He disobeyed God and God's Holy Spirit left him and evil spirit came on him instead.

So, you do not have God's Holy Spirit since you do not obey God but rather have followed a false christ who claims he did away with the Ten Commandments and/or fulfilled your obedience for you in the past. You have turned the grace of God into disobedience against Him.

Which brings to mind Jude 4:

Jude
4 For there are certain men crept in unawares, who were before of old ordained to this condemnation, ungodly men, turning the grace of our God into lasciviousness, and denying the only Lord God, and our Lord Jesus Christ.

Repent!
It's odd that you quoted that verse at the end that is describing those who were trying to teach that the Gentiles had to obey the law.

Gal 5:4 You who are trying to be justified by law have been alienated from Christ; you have fallen away from grace.

I do not want to be alienated from Christ or fall from grace. Why do you?
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Old 09-08-2012, 07:18 PM
 
951 posts, read 1,045,355 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike555 View Post
No Tthttf. You have not. You just cannot get it through your legalistic head that the Church is not under the requirement to keep the Sabbath day which was commanded exclusively of Israel. And I have told you over and over that obedience is expected of the believer, but that that obedience is a part of the spiritual life after salvation and is not a requirement FOR salvation. And it just keeps going over your head.

As do many, you pick and choose the Scriptures you want to believe and ignore and reject the Scriptures which refute you.

But I am done with you since it is impossible to get through to someone who flat out refuses to listen. If you choose to attempt to earn your salvation though your own efforts then you reject what Christ has already accomplished on the cross and you remain under condemnation. If you die without having ever in your life simply trusted completely in the finished work of Christ, then having never been saved in the first place, you will go to hell forever. And the consequences of your rejection of grace is on your head.
No! You are deliberately disobeying God and calling it grace! Grace only covers sins that you have repented of. If you deliberately break God's Commandments that is willful sin and grace does not cover that. Jude points this out.

Jude [KJV]
4 For there are certain men crept in unawares, who were before of old ordained to this condemnation, ungodly men, turning the grace of our God into lasciviousness, and denying the only Lord God, and our Lord Jesus Christ.

Jude [ERV]
4 Some people have secretly entered your group. These people have already been judged guilty for what they are doing. Long ago the prophets wrote about them. They are against God. They have used the grace of our God in the wrong way--to do sinful things. They refuse to follow Jesus Christ, our only Master and Lord.

Romans 8 [KJV]
7 Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be.

Romans 8 [ERV]
[color=#483d8b]7 Why is this true? Because anyone whose thinking is controlled by their sinful self is against God. They refuse to obey God's law. And really they are not able to obey it.


Moderator cut: deleted

Last edited by june 7th; 09-08-2012 at 07:29 PM..
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Old 09-08-2012, 07:27 PM
 
951 posts, read 1,045,355 times
Reputation: 77
Quote:
Originally Posted by WK4J View Post
It's odd that you quoted that verse at the end that is describing those who were trying to teach that the Gentiles had to obey the law.

Gal 5:4 You who are trying to be justified by law have been alienated from Christ; you have fallen away from grace.

I do not want to be alienated from Christ or fall from grace. Why do you?
Not the Spiritual Law which Paul says is spiritual and holy and the Commandment just and good (Romans 7).

You are confusing the ceremonial works of the law with the Holy Spiritual Law of God.

Paul:
1 Cor 7:19 Circumcision is nothing, and uncircumcision is nothing, but the keeping of the commandments of God.
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Old 09-09-2012, 01:59 AM
 
2,526 posts, read 2,919,141 times
Reputation: 336
Quote:
Originally Posted by tthttf View Post
If you believe the Gospel, you will also be keeping the Holy Days and other special days of God.

PASSOVER
DAYS OF UNLEAVENED BREAD
PENTECOST
FEAST OF TRUMPETS
DAY OF ATONEMENT
FEAST OF TABERNACLES
LAST GREAT DAY
Receiving the Gospel has nothing to do with keeping holy days.

Quote:
The Days of Unleavened picture our part in God's Master Plan of salvation. We must put sin, pictured by leaven, out of our lives. For seven days we go through this lesson every year.
Again, this has nothing to do with receiving the Gospel.

Quote:
The very next Holy Day to come in sequence after the Days of Unleavened Bread is Pentecost which pictures the giving of God's Holy Spirit and the New Testament Church.
This also has nothing to do with receiving the Gospel.

Quote:
If you are striving to put sin out of your life which was pictured by the Days of Unleavened Bread, you will be keeping God's Commandments, Statutes, Judgments and obeying God.
This too has nothing to do with receiving the Gospel.

Quote:
Act 5:32 [RSV]
And we are witnesses to these things, and so is the Holy Spirit whom God has given to those who obey him."

He gives His Holy Spirit to those who obey Him. It does not matter about the tense of the verbs.
The verb tenses do matter, and this scripture contradicts your theology. Those who are in the flesh (without the Spirit) are not obeying God. Nor can they do anything to please God:

Rom 8:8 So then they that are in the flesh cannot please God.

Spiritual life begins in the Spirit. It is then, in the Spirit, that we have power to obey, that is: to believe the Gospel.

Gal 3:3 Are ye so foolish? having begun in the Spirit, are ye now made perfect by the flesh?

Rom 10:16 But they have not all obeyed the gospel. For Esaias saith, Lord, who hath believed our report?

Quote:
And if you quit obeying God, you will lose the Holy Spirit. Remember the lesson of King Saul. He disobeyed God and God's Holy Spirit left him and evil spirit came on him instead.
Saul was never sealed with the Spirit. Those who believe the Gospel are:

Eph 1:13 In whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise,

Quote:
So, you do not have God's Holy Spirit since you do not obey God but rather have followed a false christ who claims he did away with the Ten Commandments and/or fulfilled your obedience for you in the past. You have turned the grace of God into disobedience against Him.
I don't doubt you feel like this. Those under law have no subjective knowledge of grace.

However, being under grace, I know Jesus' righteousness is imputed to me. All of it. Jesus' good works and keeping the commandments are accredited to my account. Jesus fulfilled the entire law for me. My sins were imputed to Him and His righteousness was imputed to me.

Jesus also died for my sins, and justified me personally, on the cross. And I believe what scripture tells me, here:

Rom 4:5 But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness.

Look my friend: Jesus justifies the ungodly. And, believing this I know I'm imputed with His righteousness. There is nothing the law can add to this righteousness.

Quote:
Which brings to mind Jude 4:

Jude
4 For there are certain men crept in unawares, who were before of old ordained to this condemnation, ungodly men, turning the grace of our God into lasciviousness, and denying the only Lord God, and our Lord Jesus Christ.

Repent!
I'm glad you brought up Jude 4. This verse is speaking directly to you my friend. Not only are you relying on the law to justify you before God, you're also denying Christ, the One who is (present tense) justifying you.

The very thing you're trying to accomplish is being spoken of by Jude: Turning the Grace of God into your own works based righteousness, rather than trusting in Christ's righteousness. You're denying Christ by doing so.

Here, read more of what scripture tells us concerning this:

Rom 3:20 Therefore by the deeds of the law there shall no flesh be justified in his sight: for by the law is the knowledge of sin.
Rom 3:21 But now the righteousness of God without the law is manifested, being witnessed by the law and the prophets;
Rom 3:22 Even the righteousness of God which is by faith of Jesus Christ unto all and upon all them that believe: for there is no difference:

Like Israel, you're simply ignorant of the faith:

Rom 10:3 For they being ignorant of God’s righteousness, and going about to establish their own righteousness, have not submitted themselves unto the righteousness of God.
Rom 10:4 For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to every one that believeth.

Don't you see this tthtf? When you read the scriptures, you're very much like Israel. You're trying to establish your own righteousness through the law.

When you, as well as Israel, hear the Gospel, it does not come to you in power or with much assurance. And for good reason. You're both under the law, not grace.

Here is how those, under grace, receive the Gospel:

1Th 1:5 For our gospel came not unto you in word only, but also in power, and in the Holy Ghost, and in much assurance; as ye know what manner of men we were among you for your sake.

Do you see that? The Gospel comes to those who believe in power, in the Holy Ghost and with much assurance.

Here is that Gospel:

1Co 15:1 MOREOVER, brethren, I declare unto you the gospel which I preached unto you, which also ye have received, and wherein ye stand;
1Co 15:2 By which also ye are saved, if ye keep in memory what I preached unto you, unless ye have believed in vain.
1Co 15:3 For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures;
1Co 15:4 And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures:

That is the Good News my friend, believe it . Those who do are imputed with Christ's righteousness.
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Old 09-09-2012, 02:13 AM
 
Location: Florida
5,261 posts, read 7,619,864 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SAAN View Post
After reading through many of these different forum topics, ive seen many postings saying that if you dont follow each and every one the 10 commandments, you will go to hell etc(Mainly sabbath breaking). Ive listed just about all the verses i could find on who will not inherent the kingdom of heaven. Now can someone please show me where not keeping a 7th day Saturday sabbath & the 7 Holy feast days keeps one out of the kingdom, since its has been stated many times that breaking this command will spell out our doom.

----------------------------------------------------------------
The Ten Commandments (Exodus 20:2-17 NKJV)
1 “I am the Lord your God, who brought you out of the land of Egypt, out of the house of bondage. You shall have no other gods before Me.

2 “You shall not make for yourself a carved image, or any likeness of anything that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth; you shall not bow down to them nor serve them. For I, the Lord your God, am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers on the children to the third and fourth generations of those who hate Me, but showing mercy to thousands, to those who love Me and keep My Commandments.

3 “You shall not take the name of the Lord your God in vain, for the Lord will not hold him guiltless who takes His name in vain.

4 “Remember the Sabbath day, to keep it holy. Six days you shall labor and do all your work, but the seventh day is the Sabbath of the Lord your God. In it you shall do no work: you, nor your son, nor your daughter, nor your male servant, nor your female servant, nor your cattle, nor your stranger who is within your gates. For in six days the Lord made the heavens and the earth, the sea, and all that is in them, and rested the seventh day. Therefore the Lord blessed the Sabbath day and hallowed it.

5 “Honor your father and your mother, that your days may be long upon the land which the Lord your God is giving you.

6 “You shall not murder.

7 “You shall not commit adultery.

8 “You shall not steal.

9 “You shall not bear false witness against your neighbor.

10 “You shall not covet your neighbor's house; you shall not covet your neighbor's wife, nor his male servant, nor his female servant, nor his ox, nor his donkey, nor anything that is your neighbor's.”
-----------------------------------------------------

Galatians 5:19-21
New King James Version (NKJV)
19 Now the works of the flesh are evident, which are: adultery,[a] fornication, uncleanness, lewdness, 20 idolatry, sorcery, hatred, contentions, jealousies, outbursts of wrath, selfish ambitions, dissensions, heresies, 21 envy, murders,[b] drunkenness, revelries, and the like; of which I tell you beforehand, just as I also told you in time past, that those who practice such things will not inherit the kingdom of God.


1 Corinthians 6:9-10
9 Do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived. Neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor homosexuals,[a] nor sodomites, 10 nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners will inherit the kingdom of God.


Ephesians 5:5
5 For this you know,[a] that no fornicator, unclean person, nor covetous man, who is an idolater, has any inheritance in the kingdom of Christ and God.


Colossians 3:5-9
5 Therefore put to death your members which are on the earth: fornication, uncleanness, passion, evil desire, and covetousness, which is idolatry. 6 Because of these things the wrath of God is coming upon the sons of disobedience, 7 in which you yourselves once walked when you lived in them.
8 But now you yourselves are to put off all these: anger, wrath, malice, blasphemy, filthy language out of your mouth. 9 Do not lie to one another, since you have put off the old man with his deeds,


Revelation 20:15
15 And anyone not found written in the Book of Life was cast into the lake of fire.


Revelation 21:8
8 But the cowardly, unbelieving,[a] abominable, murderers, sexually immoral, sorcerers, idolaters, and all liars shall have their part in the lake which burns with fire and brimstone, which is the second death.”





-It is very clear by these verses that there is more one can do outside the 10 commandments that will also cause them not to go to heaven, but going to church on a Sunday, or not resting all day Saturday is not listed anywhere.
Absolutely there is more one can do outside the Ten Commandments that can and will cause them not to go to heaven...and sure...going to a building to gather on Sunday...or any other day or night of the week to fellowship and sing praises together to God is definately not one of them...our forefathers of the Bible and all those that followed gathered together to do the same...but they never forsook keeping the Sabbath...the seventh day (Saturday) Sabbath...The Fourth Commandment.

It is when one forsakes in honoring the fourth commandment that one now tinkers with the death of his/her very soul...for sin IS the transgression of the law of God...the Ten Commandments...and this is well documented throughout the entire Holy Bible. All one needs is to have the ability to read His truth in the Light of Truth...but the only way one will obtain this ability is to believe in the word of God. Unbelief...or disobedience (one in the same) prohibits one from "seeing" and then responding by "doing" this truth when they read it...over and over and over again.
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Old 09-09-2012, 03:13 AM
 
381 posts, read 794,856 times
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as a practical matter you are onced saved always saved. the gifts of God, faith and salvation , are irrevocable....

and trying to apply God's justice (which was satisfied in Christ) on a forum like this makes you a judge and you make yourself into a God...

no one on here is qualified to make value judgments about who on here gets in or doesn't ..this is so carnal and pious..
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Old 09-09-2012, 03:19 AM
 
381 posts, read 794,856 times
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I can hear Jesus now " many will say to me Lord Lord, we were on city data, prophesying in your name, saying who would get into heaven and who would not, how not keeping one of your commandments would mean no eternal life...

and He will say, "depart from me, I never knew you"
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