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Old 05-18-2013, 08:30 AM
Status: "02/11/21: I am fully vaccinated. Yay!!!!!" (set 28 days ago)
 
Location: Salt Lake City
24,241 posts, read 24,749,748 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hljc View Post
The hardest part of all this is that Jesus said He is to reject people who believe in a different ideas of God from entering Heaven after their passing from this world
Seriously? Where did He say that? Could you provide a chapter and verse for that statement?
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Old 05-18-2013, 09:05 AM
 
Location: Oregon
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The Jewish people obviously had the Bible long before Christians. They insisted on the oneness of God and of course didn't have a second or third God in any Trinity.

After Jesus' death, his followers remained very orthodox monotheistic Temple worshipping Jews. They regarded Jesus as a "missiah" but not divine himself.

In the 80's (AD) this thinking began to change and the Christians claimed Jesus too was divine. (They were excluded from the Jewish synagogues as apostates (or 'minim") about 85 AD.

The idea of having a two in one God and later a three in one God developed in the second and third centuries. Of course, there were objections among Christians themselves. The development of Arianism followed (belief that Jesus was not an eternal god), and dispite the Councils of Nicea and Constantiople, this widespread belief really continued into the 8th century.

Several religions still adnere to Arianism today. I think (please correct me if I'm wrong) Jehovah Witnesses follow Arian beliefs even today. (Of course the Jews steadfastedly remained monotheistic as have some other religions).
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Old 05-18-2013, 09:31 AM
 
Location: The western periphery of Terra Australis
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I think modalism is probably the closest to the truth.
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Old 05-18-2013, 09:56 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jerwade View Post
A version of the Tower of Babylon!
Impressive.
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Old 05-18-2013, 09:58 AM
 
19,943 posts, read 14,850,643 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe90 View Post
Polytheist clearly. The whole three in one argument, is just a bit of denial ie - we're "different" because we're mono.
Christianity is monotheist, though. Christianity has NEVER taught more than 1 God. You need to properly understand the concept of the Trinity to understand it.
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Old 05-18-2013, 10:12 AM
 
Location: Arizona
25,631 posts, read 11,835,112 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vizio View Post
You need to properly understand the concept of the Trinity.
It's been explained on here more times than I can count, to be honest.
There are not 3 Gods...there is only one.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jerwade View Post
A version of the Tower of Babylon!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vizio View Post
Impressive.
Many are easily influenced and susceptible to the false teachings of a "three-fold" personality called a Trinity.

God is Holy.
God is Spirit.

"The Father and I are One in Spirit."
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Old 05-18-2013, 11:21 AM
 
Location: arizona ... most of the time
11,826 posts, read 10,842,285 times
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The three characteristics of God is that he is
  1. Omniscient
  2. Omnipresent
  3. Omnipotent
and each of these are attributed to the three persons: (notice the OT references)

God the Father................................... God the Son ...................... God the Holy Spirit
Omniscient (Psalm 139:1-4) ...... Omniscient (John 16:30)......... Omniscient (1 Corinthians 2:10-11)
Omnipresent (Jer. 23:23) ......... Omnipresent (Matt 28:20) ...... Omnipresent (Psalm 139: 7-10)
Omnipotent (Psalm 139:13-18).. Omnipotent (John 1:3) .......... Omnipotent (Job 33:4)


Another aspect is that God refers to himself in the singular and yet plural at the same time... which is beyond the human comprehension.

ONE GOD (SINGULAR)
Deuteronomy 4:35 You were shown these things so that you mightknow that the LORD is God; besides him there is no other.

Also found in:
1Kings 8:16 ... Isaiah 44:8 ... Isaiah 45:5,6,14,18 ... Isaiah 45:22 ... Isaiah 46:9 ... Joel 2:27 ... Mark 12:32 ... Acts 4:12


ONE GOD, yet refers to himself in the plural

Genesis 1:26 "Let us make man in our own image"
Genesis 3:22 "The man has now become like one of us, knowing good and evil."
Genesis 11:7 "Let us go down and confuse their language."
Isaiah 6:8 "Whom shall I send? And who will go for us?"


Isaiah's prophecy of Jesus speaks to him as God and also to the Triune God :
Wonderful Counselor (H.S.)
Everlasting Father (Father)
Prince of Peace (Son..Jesus)
For to us a child is born, to us a son is given, and the government will be on his shoulders.
And he will be called Wonderful Counselor, Mighty God, Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace.

Of the increase of his government andpeace there will be no end. He will reign on David’s throne and over his kingdom, establishing and upholding it with justice and righteousness from thattime on and forever.

The zeal of the LORD Almighty will accomplish this.

Last edited by twin.spin; 05-18-2013 at 11:26 AM.. Reason: spacing
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Old 05-18-2013, 12:39 PM
 
Location: Top of the South, NZ
18,538 posts, read 16,012,386 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vizio View Post
Christianity is monotheist, though. Christianity has NEVER taught more than 1 God. You need to properly understand the concept of the Trinity to understand it.
The Trinity is just a way of having your cake and eating it ie - we'll have different gods but call it something else.

It's an argument I'll never win (though I tried a lot in my younger days) because the nature of religion is that once people believe and accept, it can say whatever it wants. The only rules are the religion's rules and nothing ever has to be shown or proved.
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Old 05-19-2013, 03:16 AM
 
35,769 posts, read 18,974,736 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe90 View Post
The Trinity is just a way of having your cake and eating it ie - we'll have different gods but call it something else.

It's an argument I'll never win (though I tried a lot in my younger days) because the nature of religion is that once people believe and accept, it can say whatever it wants. The only rules are the religion's rules and nothing ever has to be shown or proved.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe90 View Post
Polytheist clearly. The whole three in one argument, is just a bit of denial ie - we're "different" because we're mono.
Look at it this way.

I worked at Busch Gardens long in the past - and nearby was a large Budweiser facility. August Busch II was the CEO at the time. Every so often, his son AB III would come to the area with all of the pomp and circumstance. He was treated as if he owned the company. Did he? No. AB II was in charge. When AB III visited, it was clearly treated as though AB II was there.

There was one owner - not two. The same relational principle applies to God.
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Old 05-19-2013, 11:48 AM
 
Location: Top of the South, NZ
18,538 posts, read 16,012,386 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DRob4JC View Post
Look at it this way.

I worked at Busch Gardens long in the past - and nearby was a large Budweiser facility. August Busch II was the CEO at the time. Every so often, his son AB III would come to the area with all of the pomp and circumstance. He was treated as if he owned the company. Did he? No. AB II was in charge. When AB III visited, it was clearly treated as though AB II was there.

There was one owner - not two. The same relational principle applies to God.
So is ABII and ABIII one person then, or two?
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