Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
Christian religions believe John 1:1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
Quote:
Reformation Study Bible
The term “Word” (Greek logos) designates God the Son with respect to His deity; “Jesus” and “Christ” refer to His incarnation and saving work. During the first three centuries, doctrines of the Person of Christ focused intensely on His position as the Logos. In Greek philosophy, the Logos was “reason” or “logic” as an abstract force that brought order and harmony to the universe. But in John’s writings such qualities of the Logos are gathered in the Person of Christ. In Neo-Platonic philosophy and the Gnostic heresy (second and third centuries a.d.), the Logos was seen as one of many intermediate powers between God and the world. Such notions are far removed from the simplicity of John’s Gospel.
In this verse the Word is expressly affirmed to be God. The Word existed already “in the beginning” (a clear reference to the opening words of the Bible), which is a way of denoting the eternity that is unique to God. John states clearly, “the Word was God.” Some have observed that the word translated “God” here has no definite article, and argued on this basis that it means “a god” rather than “God.” This is a misunderstanding; the article is omitted because of the word order in the Greek sentence (the predicate “God” has been placed first for emphasis). The New Testament never endorses the idea of “a god,” an expression that implies polytheism and is in sharp conflict with the consistent monotheism of the Bible. In the New Testament, the Greek word for “God” occurs often without the definite article, depending on the requirements of Greek grammar.
That “the Word was with God,” indicates a distinction of Persons within the unity of the Godhead. Father, Son, and Holy Spirit are not successive forms of appearance of one Person, but are eternal Persons present from “the beginning” (v. 2). “With” suggests a relationship of close personal intimacy.
Some do not believe The Holy Scriptures are sufficient.
Quote:
The Catholic Approach to Scripture - Catholic CultureBut this is nothing like the original Christian understanding of Scripture, as held to this day by the Catholic Church. First, the Catholic understands that God, in attempting to communicate his infinite mysteries to finite human persons, had little choice but to introduce a significant element of difficulty into His inspired word. Many of the Fathers argued also that this difficulty serves to protect us from pride in the interpretation of Scripture, lest we think we can easily and perfectly expound all the mysteries of God. Although the Catholic knows that he can read Scripture for personal encouragement and inspiration, he also knows that he must be humble, studious and cautious about asserting the ultimate meaning of the texts. This process of public interpretation is ultimately governed by Church authority, which alone can determine not only what each book teaches, but even which books are inspired in the first place. Now the Bible also contains forms of literature with which we are not at all familiar today, but which were quite common in various parts of the ancient world. For example, there is the apocalyptic form, as in the Books of Daniel and Revelation, in which truths beyond human reason are conveyed in astonishing visions and devastating images. Before we close, it is important to recognize two things about RCIA programs and books on the Faith that we might read when we are still in the early stages of learning. First, any given author or RCIA teacher can make a mistake. We’re all learning as we go, and that extends throughout our entire lives. Second, any given teacher or program could even have an unfortunate bias, sometimes to the point of heresy. In the period of upheaval in the Church following the 1960’s, many RCIA programs picked up a secular modernist slant, reflecting a cultural crisis of Faith which still afflicts a significant portion of our “Catholic intelligentsia”.
Some do believe The Holy Scriptures are sufficient.
Quote:
Sacred TextsThe Bible, consisting of 66 "books" (or major units), is scripture for Protestant churches. The canon of the Protestant Bible is not quite the same as the Roman Catholic Bible. There were several books that Roman Catholics included in the Old Testament that Luther, Zwingli, and Calvin felt did not have canonical authority, and had been added in error by the Catholic Church. These are mostly late Jewish texts (considered by Protestants to be "inter-testamental"). The reformers used instead a list of Hebrew texts that ancient rabbis considered canonical. Books considered canonical by Catholics but not Protestants are gathered in the Apocrypha.Second, there was no human work that could save you, or move God to save you. Your only hope for salvation was the free gift of God's grace, a principle called sola gratia. The promise of this grace is given in scripture. This grace is accessed only through faith, thus the Protestant principle of justification by faith alone, called sola fide.Luther argued that correct interpretation of scripture rests not with the Church but "in the heart of the pious believer," who is, of course, a member of the Church. Despite later, more radical, applications of this argument, Luther taught that scriptural interpretation was not a matter for isolated individuals, but for individuals within the Christian community
Must The Bible explicitly teach on something for it to be? The trinity is not explicitly taught but logic deduces it from Scripture. Sola Scriptura is not explicitly taught but logic deduces it from Scripture.
The Bible was once easy for church officials to keep away from the common man. Today, we have God's Word and numerous respected commentaries and study aids at our fingertips 24/7. The Holy Spirit guides the truly saved when reading The Scriptures and sheds light on its verses meaning.
Revelation 22:18 For I testify unto every man that heareth the words of the prophecy of this book, If any man shall add unto these things, God shall add unto him the plagues that are written in this book: 19 And if any man shall take away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away his part out of the book of life, and out of the holy city, and from the things which are written in this book.
2 Timothy 3:16a All Scripture is given by inspiration of God
God's Word is only 'too difficult to understand' - for those who attempt to grasp God's truths from a worldly mindset. God clearly reveals Himself to 'born again' believers who seek Him and submit themselves to His Word of Truth:
1 Cor 2:12-16 -- 12 What we have received is not the spirit of the world, but the Spirit who is from God, so that we may understand what God has freely given us. 13 This is what we speak, not in words taught us by human wisdom but in words taught by the Spirit, explaining spiritual realities with Spirit-taught words.
14 The person without the Spirit does not accept the things that come from the Spirit of God but considers them foolishness, and cannot understand them because they are discerned only through the Spirit. 15 The person with the Spirit makes judgments about all things, but such a person is not subject to merely human judgments, 16 for,
“Who has known the mind of the Lord so as to instruct him?” But we have the mind of Christ.
Sola Scriptura is not explicitly taught but logic deduces it from Scripture.
Ummmmm, not in the least bit true. Logic deduces that scripture is one of the tools used by the Spirit to guide those truly interested in determining God's will.
The Holy Scriptures CAN be hard to understand, just like Shakesphere can be hard to understand. But if one is searching the scriptures, God knows their heart, and their intent. He will reveal what he wants them to know. And what once seemed difficult, will become easier.
John 21
25 And there are also many other things that Jesus did, which if they were written one by one, I suppose that even the world itself could not contain the books that would be written. Amen.
Not everything is written.
Luke 24
45 And He opened their understanding, that they might comprehend the Scriptures.
The action of the Holy Ghost is required for proper understanding of the scriptures.
Matthew 16
16 Simon Peter answered and said, “You are the Christ, the Son of the living God.” 17 Jesus answered and said to him, “Blessed are you, Simon Bar-Jonah, for flesh and blood has not revealed this to you, but My Father who is in heaven. 18 And I also say to you that you are Peter, and on this rock I will build My church, and the gates of Hades shall not prevail against it. 19 And I will give you the keys of the kingdom of heaven, and whatever you bind on earth will be bound in heaven, and whatever you loose on earth will be loosed in heaven.”
God established a church and gave power to it.
Then, we are told many times to keep unity. For example:
1 Corinthians 1
10 Now I plead with you, brethren, by the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that you all speak the same thing, and that there be no divisions among you, but that you be perfectly joined together in the same mind and in the same judgment.
Unfortunately, subjectivism entered christianity and many people started interpreting scripture by their own. Now we have 40000 different denominations, and counting, each with different views, different truth. Truth can only be one, and God left us the means to keep it.
Catholic Church has been far from perfect in everything human, but it keeps the truth because it is God who guarantees that. That means holding a certain interpretation of the Scriptures (the doctrine), the tradition of millennia and, mainly, the supporting action of God. It also administers certain sacraments to help people, that work regardless the holiness of the priests involved because the power comes from God through the dignity of the consecrated priest, not the man.
Finally, we can consider these words and think about the role of the Catholic Church, even with all the [human] mistakes:
Matthew 23
1 Then Jesus spoke to the multitudes and to His disciples, 2 saying: “The scribes and the Pharisees sit in Moses’ seat. 3 Therefore whatever they tell you to observe, that observe and do, but do not do according to their works; for they say, and do not do."
Even if the Church had been at times as corrupt as the scribes and pharisees (and it is not the case), it has been established by God to keep the Word for us all, with the promise that "the gates of Hell shall not prevail" over it.
Sorry for any mistakes, English is not my mother tongue.
Finally, we can consider these words and think about the role of the Catholic Church, even with all the [human] mistakes:
Matthew 23
1 Then Jesus spoke to the multitudes and to His disciples, 2 saying: “The scribes and the Pharisees sit in Moses’ seat. 3 Therefore whatever they tell you to observe, that observe and do, but do not do according to their works; for they say, and do not do."
Even if the Church had been at times as corrupt as the scribes and pharisees (and it is not the case), it has been established by God to keep the Word for us all, with the promise that "the gates of Hell shall not prevail" over it.
Two errors in your presentation: Peter was manifestly not "the rock" on which Jesus said He would build His church, and the reference to the scribes and pharisees who have "sat down" (i.e. seated themselves or usurped authority) is primarily to the point that that authority had civil as well as religious consequences and note that Jesus was not happy with how they handled religious matters as indicated in His ministry) so that "fighting city hall" is NOT recommended. Fortunately very few churches have the capability to direct civil authority anymore.
... Jesus said from Matthew 18: 3-5....Very truly I say to you , Except you be converted , and become a little children , you will not enter into the kingdom of heaven ..Who so ever will humble themselves as this little child , the same is greatest in the kingdom of heaven ....And who so will receive one such little child in my name , receives me ``........... See believers do not have to be scholars of the bible to understand the true meaning , mostly they need to convert to Lord Jesus , repent of sin and receive His righteous Spirit , read the Bible , and in the studies of God Word Jesus Spirit will remind you of the Word of God that you heard and will even lead you in His Spirit , which is a bonus ....
Two errors in your presentation: Peter was manifestly not "the rock" on which Jesus said He would build His church, and the reference to the scribes and pharisees who have "sat down" (i.e. seated themselves or usurped authority) is primarily to the point that that authority had civil as well as religious consequences and note that Jesus was not happy with how they handled religious matters as indicated in His ministry) so that "fighting city hall" is NOT recommended. Fortunately very few churches have the capability to direct civil authority anymore.
Peter comes from latin Petrus, that is, rock, and it was the "nickname" Jesus gave him. Saint Paul calls him "Cephas", that also means rock in aramaic. To me the scriptures are crystal clear here, even if the meaning is a bit lost in many translations (the connection of "peter" and "rock"). I think that what was so particular about Peter was the action of the Holy Spirit in him to recognise Jesus as the Christ. I understand he was chosen by the Father, by the Holy Ghost and by the Son, it is not about Simon Peter the man, the flesh and blood.
Regarding the Pharisees, I know it is not the best comparison, but I was interested in showing how Jesus acknowledged their role as established by Moses with the authority of God. Catholic Church has been established by God himself for all the baptised, like Moses is for the circumcised.
... Jesus said from Matthew 18: 3-5....Very truly I say to you , Except you be converted , and become a little children , you will not enter into the kingdom of heaven ..Who so ever will humble themselves as this little child , the same is greatest in the kingdom of heaven ....And who so will receive one such little child in my name , receives me ``........... See believers do not have to be scholars of the bible to understand the true meaning , mostly they need to convert to Lord Jesus , repent of sin and receive His righteous Spirit , read the Bible , and in the studies of God Word Jesus Spirit will remind you of the Word of God that you heard and will even lead you in His Spirit , which is a bonus ....
What means to be converted, and to become a little children? Words have meaning, and it is important to understand the Bible as a whole, not to take the parts we like, out of context, and discard others. I agree no one needs to be an scholar, just to understand the meaning and follow the path. To do so, either be an scholar and pray for the grace, or listen to scholars who have the grace: the Catholic Church teaches the catechism as a simple, distilled Truth for everyone, taken from the deep study of the Scriptures under the guidance of the Holy Spirit.
It is important to not fall into subjectivism, because that is idolatry (e.g. false identification of God and God's will for us). It is subjectivism what has broken us into 40000 different understandings of what the Word is. It has been a tree that has given bad fruits.
And yet, I have hope in the mercy of God, because I believe most of us are well meaning, even if a little (or a lot) misdirected.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
