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Old 03-13-2008, 02:05 PM
 
2,984 posts, read 3,346,253 times
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Quote:
The basic problem is that all of humanity is guilty in the eyes of God.


The basic problem is that by the disobedience of one man, the mass of mankind/ the polus "were made sinners." As a result, of course, we are born into this realm, with the nature of sin. We sin because this is in the very fabric of what we are: the D.N.A. of our natures.

"For as by one man's disobedience the mass of mankind were made sinners, so by the obedience of one shall the mass of mankind be made righteous.

But make no mistake, my friend, as surely as the mass of mankind have been made sinners, the mass of mankind shall be made righteous. Not just accounted righteous, made righteous.

Christ Triumphant

http://www.tlchrist.info/tallin.htm

Quote:
Every human form Adam to the end of the world as we know it deserves to be eternally damed.
God is eternally daming no one! Nor is He eternally damning the world for whom He has given His life. He loveth the world, has always loved the world, and will continue to love the world. Do you know that our Lord Jesus Christ is the same yesterday, today and forever? Well, He is!

But, since you are so keen on damning (daming) every human being because they deserve it, please consider the words of the apostle James. "Be not many teachers my brothers, for you can be certain that we ourselves shall be damned with greater damnation."

"I will accept no explanation of any way of God that involves what I should scorn as false and unfair in a man. If it is said, 'It may be right of God to do something that it would not be right of man to do,' I answer, 'Yes, because more is required of God--not less.' God can have no duty that is not both just and merciful. More and higher justice and righteousness is required of Him by Himself, the Truth--greater nobleness, more penetrating sympathy, and nothing but what, if an honest man understood it, he would say was right. -George MacDonald-"

"Are our broadest hopes broad enough? Shall there be a nook or abyss, in all the universe of God, finally unlightened by the Cross? Shall there be a sin, or sorrow, or pain unhealed? Is the very universe, is creation in all its extent, a field wide enough for the Son of God" -Christ Triumphant-

Last edited by Birdy_56; 03-13-2008 at 02:23 PM..

 
Old 03-13-2008, 02:18 PM
 
2,984 posts, read 3,346,253 times
Reputation: 465
Alpha: calling Alpha, come in Alpha. I cannot get Lover of N. Carolina to answer what "under the earth" means. You are on her list of help-lines. How about a stab at it. The A.T.& T. operators are standing by.

It is quite evident from the words of St. Peter that the Lord Jesus Christ preached to the "disobedient" dead from the days of Noah. And it is also clear, from the church fathers, and the scope of zao, that the preaching had dramatic outcome.

The facts are these....

1. Every knee, of every being in the heavens, and the earth, and the underworld, bows ultimately to, and in, the Lord Jesus Christ, and to the great glory of the Father. Every knee bows ultimately in worship, and praise, and celebration, and thankfulness.

2. Every tongue, of every being, in every dimension of the celestial, the terrestial, and the underworld, ultimately confesses in willing worship, praise, and celebration, and in union with the Name of all names, and to the great glory and satisfaction of the Father.

3. Kampto always means worship, & homologeo and exomologeo means willing worship, praise, and celebration. It is not by rote or perfunctory genuflections that every being bows and confesses before the King of all kings!


YouTube - "Agnus Dei" - Worthy is the Lamb

Can you, or will you, Alpha, show us what "under the earth" means in the revelation of St. Paul in Philippians chapter 2? Is the following koine Greek correct?

"Under the earth" = katacqovnioß=

Subterreanean

Those who dwell in the world below

Departed souls (the dead)

Let us sing together again......

The steadfast love of the Lord never ceases,

His mercies never come to an end,

They are new every morning,

New every morning,

Great is Thy faithfulness, oh Lord,

Great is Thy faithfulness.
 
Old 03-13-2008, 02:20 PM
 
2,984 posts, read 3,346,253 times
Reputation: 465

YouTube - "Agnus Dei" - Worthy is the Lamb

Well, our heavenly Father, while we wait for I.L.N.C. to respond, or the finest moderator in the universe, our own Alpha; we will just sit here and worship you for your great and mighty gift in the Son of God!
 
Old 03-13-2008, 04:29 PM
 
7,784 posts, read 14,885,583 times
Reputation: 3478
I'm out of town and getting ready to step out for some dinner.

I don't mind responding to your question.

Is it "What does under the earth mean?"

If so, then it means 'under the earth'.

Are you suggesting it means hell?

Are you suggesting the OT teaches us about hell?

I'd like to read up on that, please post your OT scripture references on Hell and I'll review when I return from dinner.

Also, if you happened to stumble upon that scripture that teaches about a second opportunity to be exposed to the gospel after death, I'd be eager to read that too.

If you have any questions about the words of this post, please ask them rather than trying to interpret it for yourself. You've taken so many of my words (and God's) out of context I want to make sure you understand this post completely.
 
Old 03-13-2008, 06:09 PM
 
2,984 posts, read 3,346,253 times
Reputation: 465
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alpha8207 View Post
I'm out of town and getting ready to step out for some dinner.

I don't mind responding to your question.

Is it "What does under the earth mean?"

If so, then it means 'under the earth'.
And what does under the earth mean as per Phil. 2:10,11?

The Lord declares that every knee bows, and every tongue confesses in worship, and confess in celebration, praise, and thanksgiving ,in each of the following dimensions: the celestial, the terrestial, and the subterrean. Is the subterrean the realm of death? Will those who rise to confess and worship given a second "opportunity"? We now know, both you and I, that chance is reserved for the gambing parlours of this realm, not our Father's Realm.

Quote:
Are you suggesting it means hell?
Absolutely not.

Quote:
Are you suggesting the OT teaches us about hell?
Not in reference to this question. But yes, the Old Covenant most assuredly teaches us about hell. The Hebrew from which this comes is sh@'owl and has been translated by the K.J.V. translators as grave, pit, and hell from the same root word.

Quote:
I'd like to read up on that, please post your OT scripture references on Hell and I'll review when I return from dinner.
Would you like all the passages of the Old Covenant, including the 29 passages that have been translated pit or grave?

Hell= sh@'owl=

HERE

Pit=

HERE

Grave=

HERE

Quote:
Also, if you happened to stumble upon that scripture that teaches about a second opportunity to be exposed to the gospel after death, I'd be eager to read that too.
Again: the meaning of opportunity & chance has been adequately presented. Our Father's Kingdom does not rest in chance. But again, let's define what chance & opportunity means.

Opportunity=

HERE

Chance=

HERE

Quote:
If you have any questions about the words of this post, please ask them rather than trying to interpret it for yourself. You've taken so many of my words (and God's) out of context I want to make sure you understand this post completely.
I am old and slow; comprehension is like the rest me, falling apart, but I will attempt to take every "opportunity" to raise myself to new heights.

I appreciate you coming to the assistance of I.L.N.C. Now go and enjoy your dinner.
 
Old 03-13-2008, 06:16 PM
 
23 posts, read 109,757 times
Reputation: 20
i Thought,in The Interum,with The Agreement Set Forth By City Data,as A User Of This Website,that There Is Not To Be Anything Constituting Slander,personal Threat,perjurous,advertisements Copyrighted,etc. Etc. And What Am I Reading Here Pray-tell.......AND BRAINWASHING KJ CHAPTER 1,000,000 VERSUS 1 THRU INFINITY
 
Old 03-13-2008, 06:26 PM
 
2,984 posts, read 3,346,253 times
Reputation: 465
Hi there Alpha: In the following passages of Scripture, King James Translators have taken sh@owl, and instead of translating it as hell, have opted for grave.

As Teddy Ruxpin PhD (The talking bear) would say..."something is not quite right."

The Hebrew word Sh@'owl is not translated as hell in 29 Scriptures, instead opting for grave. Some of them are....

Gen. 37:15

"And all his sons and all his daughters rose up to comfort him; but he refused to be comforted; and he said, For I will go down into the grave (sh@'owl) unto my son mourning. Thus his father wept for him."

To be consistent, it should read...

And all his sons and all his daughters rose up to comfort him: but he refused to be comforted; and he said, For I will go down into hell unto my son mourning. Thus his father wept for him.

Gen. 42:38

"And he said, My son shall not go down with you; for his brother is dead, and he is left alone: if mischief befall him by the way in which ye go, then shall ye bring my gray hairs with sorrow to the grave/ (sh@'owl).

To be consistent, it should read....

And he said, My son shall not go down with you; for his brother is dead, and he is left alone: if mischief befall him by the way in which ye go, then shall ye bring my gray hairs with sorrow to hell.

1 Samuel 2:6

"The Lord killeth, and maketh alive: he bringeth down to the grave, and bringeth up again."

It should read....

The Lord killeth, and maketh alive: he bringeth down to hell, and bringeth up again.

Job 14:13

"O that thou wouldest hide me in the grave, that thou wouldest keep me secret, until thy wrath be past, that thou wouldst appoint me a set time, and remember me."

It should read....

O that thou wouldest hide me in hell, that thou wouldest keep me secret, until thy wrath be past, that thou wouldst appoint me a set time, and remember me.

Hosea 13:14

"I will ransom them from the power of the grave (sh@'owl); I will redeem them from death: O death, I will be thy plagues; O grave (sh@'owl) I will be thy destruction; repentance shall be hid from mine eyes."

This passage should read....

I will ransom them from the power of hell; I will redeem them from death.' O death, I will be thy plagues; O hell I will be thy destruction; repentance shall be hid from mine eyes.

Psalm 88:3

"For my soul is full of troubles: and my life draweth unto the grave (sh@'owl)."

This passage should be.....

For my soul is full of troubles: and my life draweth unto hell.

Psalm 30:3

"Oh Lord, thou hast brought up my soul from the grave (sh@['owl): thou hast kept me alive, that I should not go down into the pit."

This passage should be.....

Oh Lord, thou hast brought up my soul from hell: thou hast kept me alive, that I should not go down into the pit.

The K.J.V. translates 1 Cor. 15:55....

"O death, where is thy sting: O grave, where is thy victory."

To be consistent it should read....

O death, where is thy sting: O hell, where is thy victory.

Grave= a/&dhß= hades
 
Old 03-13-2008, 06:33 PM
 
23 posts, read 109,757 times
Reputation: 20
Speak For Your-self And Stop Using The Bible As A Crutch....if You Are A True Christian...you! Do Not Judge,only God Does...amen Mama
 
Old 03-13-2008, 07:05 PM
 
7,784 posts, read 14,885,583 times
Reputation: 3478
You are a riot birdy.

You will take all these words and use them to prove Hell where convenient and then, at the end of the day, you'll say hell doesn't really mean hell.

Hell means a reform school God has set up.

Gotta love that selective interpretation!
 
Old 03-13-2008, 07:16 PM
 
13,640 posts, read 24,505,098 times
Reputation: 18602
I could never understand people who believe the bible is the inspired word of God, then proceed to rip it to shreds with changing the meanings, reading between the lines and endless quotes by biblical "scholars" to prove something that is so obviously not there....I believe in letting your belief show in your actions, your words and your deeds, not in how well you "mis"understand the teachings of Christ..
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