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There is no need for your hostile and combative tone. Whether or not you can accept what the Bible says about any particular subject is an issue you must deal with. The Bible plainly reveals that the penalty for sin is death, and that the ultimate result for those who do not accept God's solution is eternal separation from God. The purpose of the original post was to present the pertinent Scripture which shows that.
But I have no intention of entering into endless argumentation with the same people on this forum who as you say, 'blatantly reject,' not what I say, but what the Bible says. You know what the Bible says, and you will have to deal with it. I will however answer legitimate questions.
The bible (which in your mind, means God) says so because you say it says so and you will not consider any questions that shed light on the fact that what you say doesn't make a whole lot of sense. I completely understand, Mike. It's called a dodge.
Pity. Because I've been asking that question of fundamentalists for a VERY long time and not one has ever answered my question.
(When I began asking it innocents were starving to death in Bangladesh. So nothing has changed in 40 years. I'll keep on asking.)
Balderdash.
Your question has been answered multiple of times but you don't like it ... which is nobody's fault but your own.
Romans 6:23 .... is your answer
Hebrews 11:6 ... is your answer
Romans 1:20 .... is your answer
Exodus 20:5 .... is your answer
Deuteronomy 5:9 .... is your answer
The solution isn't to whine \ complain and then blame your imaginary boggy man the "fundamentalists". There is a reason why Jesus said:
Matthew 9:38Ask the Lord of the harvest, therefore, to send out workers into his harvest field.”
Luke 10:2He told them, “The harvest is plentiful, but the workers are few. Ask the Lord of the harvest, therefore, to send out workers into his harvest field.
and that reason is because:
Romans 6:23 .... is THE TRUTH ............ COMPRENDE ?
Hebrews 11:6 ... is THE TRUTH ............ COMPRENDE ?
Romans 1:20 .... is THE TRUTH ............ COMPRENDE ?
Exodus 20:5 .... is THE TRUTH ............ COMPRENDE ?
Deuteronomy 5:9 .... is THE TRUTH ............ COMPRENDE ?
What did God say when you asked Him? No one here is a god, no one speaks for God, unless you’re a prophet and ain't none here I tell ya. Therefore all answers are opinions, your Bible reads the same as mine. What does it teach you? If you believe in a benevolent loving deity, must that deity reveal everything to everyone because it’s “fair” in your eyes?
Lots of questions… so seek to understand.
Hi Dave, do you believe God gets what He desires?
If so, do you believe the scriptures say God desires to save everyone?
Do you believe it says that God gets no pleasure in the death of anyone?
Do you believe God can fail to Persuade?
Do you believe God can fail at all?
Do you believe that if God starts a work that He will finish it and the end result will be as He intended it from the start? (such as starting us off with the breath of life)
Do you believe God needs our permission to save us?
What happens to the 5 year old Syrian child who is in a refugee camp and dies from dehydration and diarrhea? Does he get cast into this lake of fire?
(That's happening right now. Today. Are all those non-Christian kids who are suffering and dying through no fault of their own going to your lake of fire?)
It is not 'my' lake of fire.
God has, by means of general or natural revelation through His creation, made His existence known to man (Romans 1:18-20). When in the course of human development a person becomes aware as a result of that natural revelation that God exists, he becomes responsible to God for what he does with that awareness.
It can be deduced based on the fact that God is perfectly just and fair, and cannot be unjust or unfair to any person, that if any person dies without being able to come to that awareness, whether he be a young child, or a person regardless of age who because of lack of mental capacity cannot come to such an awareness, he is automatically saved because of Christ's work on the cross. Now, when through general or natural revelation, a person has become aware that God exists he will either desire to find out something about God, or he will be indifferent regarding God. If a person desires to know God, then God will make sure that that person receives the specific revelation of Jesus Christ through the gospel message, at which point that person must respond to the gospel through faith in Christ if he is to be eternally saved.
Because God is omniscience and has always known all the facts, He is able to steer and direct the events of human history so that at any given point of time in history the gospel can get to wherever positive volition exists.
Last edited by Michael Way; 12-06-2013 at 10:11 AM..
So it's okay for you guys to say you speak for God when you insist that God will torment non-Christians for eternity. But when someone asks you a specific question regarding how that works exactly, suddenly you can't speak for God anymore?
Not all, kinda judgmental. Listen... I get it why you feel the way you do but we ain't all from Westboro Baptist Church. I/we are not prophets but we can prophesize…. meaning we can repeat what we’ve learned or how scripture speaks to us. We are all fallable, everyone of us, but we do believe the scriptures are God breathed. Ya see, non believers as such are accusers by nature, they feel victimized by Christians. Accusers don’t want answers they want justice and apologies.. and for believers to make a “mistake” so they can say GOTCHA! Me… I’m OK with that ‘cause if your challenging me on my beliefs I can tell you why I believe, but I can not speak to the complete understanding of God. If anyone says so, they’re lying.
So if you really want an answer, wouldn't you need to study (Bible), contemplate (prayer) and then ask in context? You don't have to be a believer to read the Bible and pray... sometimes motion produces emotion.
If you want to know why people die, and I know for sure we've been dying since the beginning of time, I can tell you what I believe. If you want to know how to live I know someone who can give you a guarantee.
God has, by means of general or natural revelation through His creation, made His existence known to man (Romans 1:18-20). When in the course of human development a person becomes aware as a result of that natural revelation that God exists, he becomes responsible to God for what he does with that awareness.
It can be deduced based on the fact that God is perfectly just and fair, and cannot be unjust or unfair to any person, that if any person dies without being able to come to that awareness, whether he be a young child, or a person regardless of age who because of lack of mental capacity cannot come to such an awareness, he is automatically saved because of Christ's work on the cross. Now, when through general or natural revelation, a person has become aware that God exists he will either desire to find out something about God, or he will be indifferent regarding God. If a person desires to know God, then God will make sure that that person receives the specific revelation of Jesus Christ through the gospel message, at which point that person must respond to the gospel through faith in Christ if he is to be eternally saved.
Because God is omniscience and has always known all the facts, He is able to steer and direct the events of human history so that at any given point of time in history the gospel can get to wherever positive volition exists.
Now see, it wasn't such a terrible thing to explain how your position makes sense in your own mind, was it?
Mike, how did you come to the conclusion that some people are exceptions to what you believe are the rules about how not to end up in eternal torment? You rely completely on the bible for your beliefs, correct? Are there passages that you believe support your conclusion?
The sad truth is, most of Christendom would walk away from everything that pertains to life and godliness and live how they wanted to, if it was made known to them that eternal hell does not exist.
Why not live how we want to?,is what the heart of Christendom asks if all are saved. Not understanding what they are saying. Why would you want to live how you want to, do you not realize that the majority of folk that don't believe have a better attitude to life than that?. Does it really take a belief in the existence of eternal hell to keep you in line?, if that is the case, you've heard another gospel. The gospel of the scriptures is not only good news, but one of life and peace and joy in the Holy Ghost and supplied in abundance.
Not all, kinda judgmental. Listen... I get it why you feel the way you do but we ain't all from Westboro Baptist Church. I/we are not prophets but we can prophesize…. meaning we can repeat what we’ve learned or how scripture speaks to us. We are all fallable, everyone of us, but we do believe the scriptures are God breathed. Ya see, non believers as such are accusers by nature, they feel victimized by Christians. Accusers don’t want answers they want justice and apologies.. and for believers to make a “mistake” so they can say GOTCHA! Me… I’m OK with that ‘cause if your challenging me on my beliefs I can tell you why I believe, but I can not speak to the complete understanding of God. If anyone says so, they’re lying.
So if you really want an answer, wouldn't you need to study (Bible), contemplate (prayer) and then ask in context? You don't have to be a believer to read the Bible and pray... sometimes motion produces emotion.
If you want to know why people die, and I know for sure we've been dying since the beginning of time, I can tell you what I believe. If you want to know how to live I know someone who can give you a guarantee.
Dave, I studied and contemplated just as you have. Even when I was a "100% bible-believing Christian" I came to different conclusions than you have about the subject of this thread. If you can admit that you don't know everything, then why can't you also admit that what you think you do know might not be the truth? And when you can't reasonably explain why you believe as you do, that could very well be a clue that what you're saying has a flaw somewhere worth checking into. If you think that's me looking to get a "gotcha" moment, you're wrong.
Now, something in your response that I found odd... You said that "accusers don't want answers they want justice..." And this is a problem, why?
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