Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
One of the most logical things I've read online, in a long time. Understand that I am a rapidly deconverting Christian... so I'm not totally against Christianity. However, I do want to see what Christians have to say about this post.
- - - - - -
Christians usually liken God to a doting parent who’s concerned for the eternal welfare of his children. Okay, let’s pursue that idea in detail.
Responsible parents assess their children’s capabilities and focus on creating a safe play environment. Unsafe items are placed well out of reach or locked away to eliminate the temptation altogether. They actively monitor their children’s activities and intervene before things get out of control. And during extended absences, guardianship is entrusted to caregivers with like-minded goals and values.
Loving parents provide guidance, teach self-discipline, offer encouragement, acknowledge honest efforts, praise achievements, and most importantly, model the behaviors they want their children to adopt. They have reasonable expectations, set appropriate rules and guidelines, communicate them clearly, and apply them with fairness and consistency. Physical punishment is eschewed in favor of disciplinary measures that re-enforce an understanding of the connection between actions and consequences.
So with that in mind, how does God stack up as a parent?
Well, based on the Genesis narrative, he comes across as the type of father who tosses his kids a pack of cigarettes, warns them not to smoke and sends in a smooth-talking tobacco lobbyist to test their resolve.
In other words: If God were a human parent, we’d be calling Child Protective Services.
First of all, Satan made himself into a Satan and a Devil.
Either God knew in advance of creating Lucifer that he would eventually become Satan, or God didn't know that. If He didn't know, He is not all-knowing nor all-seeing... which violates quite a few Bible verses. If He did know, then He intended for sin to be in the picture.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Matthew 4:4
Adam and Eve were married adults when they broke God's law.
Either God COULD have created mankind to be untemptable by sin, or He couldn't have. If he couldn't have, he is not all-powerful... again violating many Bible verses. If He could have, then obviously he chose not to... again meaning that sin was part of the original plan.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Matthew 4:4
The tree of knowledge was just one fruit tree out of how many fruit trees on earth ?________
Nobody can know this as no mention is made anywhere about how many trees there were in total.
God laid down some pretty clear rules to follow. We have free will to choose to follow or to be disobedient. I don't know about you but I've been dragged to the woodshed in the past. A good Father loves and forgives but disciplines as well.
I don't believe that God, our Father, intended that this experience that we have in life, to be a safe one. There are many things that we develop, learn, and come to appreciate and realize through this experience. God intentionally brought all things into existence knowing full well what would happen. If someone creates an invention and that invention goes haywire, who is still responsible? But I believe that God has a purpose for all that has happened. He dug the pit that Adam and Eve fell into and this has affected the whole creation but I believe that He. He will also resolve the tension that is in the creation that was caused when Adam sinned.
Romans 8 tells us that God subjected the creation to futility. And He has a plan to deliver all of creation from its slavery to corruption.
Romans 8
14 For all who are being led by the Spirit of God, these are sons of God. 15 For you have not received a spirit of slavery leading to fear again, but you have received a spirit of adoption as sons by which we cry out, “Abba! Father!” 16 The Spirit Himself testifies with our spirit that we are children of God, 17 and if children, heirs also, heirs of God and fellow heirs with Christ, if indeed we suffer with Him so that we may also be glorified with Him.
18 For I consider that the sufferings of this present time are not worthy to be compared with the glory that is to be revealed to us. 19 For the anxious longing of the creation waits eagerly for the revealing of the sons of God. 20 For the creationwas subjected to futility, not willingly, but because of Him who subjected it,in *hope 21 that the creation itself also will be set free from its slavery to corruption into the freedom of the glory of the children of God. 22 For we know that the whole creation groans and suffers the pains of childbirth together until now. 23 And not only this, but also we ourselves, having the first fruits of the Spirit, even we ourselves groan within ourselves, waiting eagerly for our adoption as sons, the redemption of our body.
*hope=elpis= expectation
Notes on Romans 8
In looking at the way God imputed Adam's sin to his descendants, and the divine law which prohibits such behavior, we do not hesitate to call God's action a "temporary injustice, which is the direct cause of the "Tension" in the history of creation. (We were brought into sin and death through the sin of Adam) Tension is the result of injustice or disharmony while it is yet unresolved. It has many applications...When an individual wrongs another, tension is in the air until restitution is made. Tension always demands a resolution. In music there are certain chords which contain conflicting or discordant notes. These chords set up an emotional tension until the chord is resolved. This is a very common musical technique, used to play upon the emotions of the listener and draws him into the music by forcing him to psychologically demand harmony. Discord torments the mind of the musician, in order to maximize the feeling of relief when the harmonious chord is struck. It is much like the cliff-hangers in books of TV programs. All are temporary tensions designed to make the listeners demand a resolution.
God, too, has employed this technique in the music of the spheres and in the book of history. Imputing death and corruption to mankind and to creation in general has produced a judicial tension that demands resolution. Paul says that God will certainly not leave creation hanging. The disharmony and injustice that cause the tension will be MORE THAN COMPENSATED when the final chord of history is struck.
Even the best of parents can't keep their children from suffering some of the time. You want to be wrapped in bubble wrap? We also have free will, if we didn't people would be complaining about not having it and always doing what they are told to do.
God does love us, He gave us the Ten Commandants and if we follow them we will have a near to normal, happy life.
You don't like Christianity so I guess you don't like Christ who teaches us to do unto others as we would have others do unto us. To love our neighbor as well as our enemies, to pray for them. You must not like that either.
When we get saved we should understand the fear of God which is like when we lived at home like children we followed our fathers rules In His home , so now saved we follow our Father Gods rule in His home with the temple of Holy Spirit on our lives ........................ And Father God who we pray to with the identity of Jesus Christ will protect us by His lead in the spirit which we should develop , We develop a lead in the spirit by listening to God and obeying what He leads us with discernment by Jesus Holy Spirit we can be lead by the right Spirit ..................See We need to develop faith with our mouths speaking Gods Words which He promised and the Words which He tells us to say for to receive ......................One way Father God brings us His protection and defense is by the authority of the believers which has power to remove the dark spirit which can bring harm to our lives , which is also a redemption of Christ which remove the dark spirit and repentant sin is gone, like one way to start is to`` plead the Blood of Jesus`` in our homes and business , which is the Word of God
Either God knew in advance of creating Lucifer that he would eventually become Satan, or God didn't know that. If He didn't know, He is not all-knowing nor all-seeing... which violates quite a few Bible verses. If He did know, then He intended for sin to be in the picture.
Either God COULD have created mankind to be untemptable by sin, or He couldn't have. If he couldn't have, he is not all-powerful... again violating many Bible verses. If He could have, then obviously he chose not to... again meaning that sin was part of the original plan.
Nobody can know this as no mention is made anywhere about how many trees there were in total.
Where do you get the idea that Lucifer was an Angel?...Where do you get the idea that he became HaSatan?...Jews do not believe in original sin, man was created with the capacity to do good or do evil, the choice is up to the individual...So, in reference to HaSatan, it is a metaphor for the inclinations of the dark side of the flesh...To serve HaSatan is to serve the flesh...
Not all Christians believe the story is literal history.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
