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So clearly the Bible seems to be in error, if one adheres to a literal interpretation. However, if one accepts that passages such as the one in Joshua were intended not as factual accounts but as fictional stories with moral messages, then the issue of errors and contradictions becomes rather moot.
Two separate issues.
Even today we say the Sun rises. That is a common idiom then and now. No one with any brains takes every word or phrase as literal, when context shows it is an idiom, allegory, symbolic, etc.
Now Joshua, like the previous common expression, was told from his perspective and .... the Bible gives no details. That does not mean something miraculous did not happen, as raising the dead is pretty contrary to science, but for God it would be easy. Did God cause the Universe, the Sun or the earth, etc to act differently or was the light reflected so as to stay bright or something else, is not told, so all we can do is speculate. The lesson is that God can and will help his people in certain circumstances, in anyway He wishes. He has the power and right. To judge Him based on limited knowledge of the details is simply foolish.
Even today we say the Sun rises. That is a common idiom then and now. No one with any brains takes every word or phrase as literal, when context shows it is an idiom, allegory, symbolic, etc.
Now Joshua, like the previous common expression, was told from his perspective and .... the Bible gives no details. That does not mean something miraculous did not happen, as raising the dead is pretty contrary to science, but for God it would be easy. Did God cause the Universe, the Sun or the earth, etc to act differently or was the light reflected so as to stay bright or something else, is not told, so all we can do is speculate. The lesson is that God can and will help his people in certain circumstances, in anyway He wishes. He has the power and right. To judge Him based on limited knowledge of the details is simply foolish.
The men that wrote the bible were extremely inspired. However, the fact that they were inspired does not mean they got it right.
If God had written a book it would be flawless and this thread would never happen.
The one that got Galileo in trouble in the first place. The verse in Joshua that states the Sun stopped moving across the sky.
So the sun stood still, and the moon stopped, till the nation avenged itself on its enemies, as it is written in the Book of Jashar. The sun stopped in the middle of the sky and delayed going down about a full day. There has never been a day like it before or since…”
—Joshua 10:13-14
This appears to be an error as follows:
- The Sun does not move across the sky; rather, the Earth rotates
- Granted that he may have been describing the appearance of the Sun's motion, and not being aware of the order of the Universe, then for the Sun to appear to stop moving the Earth would have had to stop rotating, which clearly did not occur, due to the cataclysmic consequences that would have followed.
So clearly the Bible seems to be in error, if one adheres to a literal interpretation. However, if one accepts that passages such as the one in Joshua were intended not as factual accounts but as fictional stories with moral messages, then the issue of errors and contradictions becomes rather moot.
The translation of Joshua 10:13 you cite is so perverted it is no wonder you are lost.
And the sun stood still, and the moon stayed, until the people had avenged themselves upon their enemies. Is not this written in the book of Jasher? So the sun stood still in the midst of heaven, and hasted not to go down about a whole day.
Have you read the book of Jasher? Do you even know who Jasher is?
So what do you think causes the earth to rotate, the sun gravitational pull of the electromagnetic field generated by the rotating sun? What did the earth do before the sun emitted light?
The one that got Galileo in trouble in the first place. The verse in Joshua that states the Sun stopped moving across the sky.
So the sun stood still, and the moon stopped, till the nation avenged itself on its enemies, as it is written in the Book of Jashar. The sun stopped in the middle of the sky and delayed going down about a full day. There has never been a day like it before or since…â€
—Joshua 10:13-14
This appears to be an error as follows:
- The Sun does not move across the sky; rather, the Earth rotates
- Granted that he may have been describing the appearance of the Sun's motion, and not being aware of the order of the Universe, then for the Sun to appear to stop moving the Earth would have had to stop rotating, which clearly did not occur, due to the cataclysmic consequences that would have followed.
So clearly the Bible seems to be in error, if one adheres to a literal interpretation. However, if one accepts that passages such as the one in Joshua were intended not as factual accounts but as fictional stories with moral messages, then the issue of errors and contradictions becomes rather moot.
"with God all things are possible" .... Jesus.
It's really going to be interesting to say the least when fault finders of the bible are confronted and are forced to admit that they in fact are the ones who are in error.
The lesson is that God can and will help his people in certain circumstances, in anyway He wishes.
Yes, that may be the lesson. The lesson of the fable of the ant and the grasshopper is that it is wiser to save for tomorrow, rather than just live for today. You don't have to believe in talking insects in order to understand the lesson.
It's really going to be interesting to say the least when fault finders of the bible are confronted and are forced to admit that they in fact are the ones who are in error.
Perhaps. But I am not finding fault with the Bible. I am finding fault with people who are so narrow minded they can't see the true nature of the Bible.
Joshua 10:12-14 Then spake Joshua to the LORD in the day when the LORD delivered up the Amorites before the children of Israel, and he said in the sight of Israel, Sun, stand thou still upon Gibeon; and thou, Moon, in the valley of Ajalon. And the sun stood still, and the moon stayed, until the people had avenged themselves upon their enemies. Is not this written in the book of Jasher? So the sun stood still in the midst of heaven, and hasted not to go down about a whole day. And there was no day like that before it or after it, that the LORD hearkened unto the voice of a man: for the LORD fought for Israel.
Great passage and it does bring up a puzzling question. It said the sun stood still and didn't go down for about a day. Well if the sun didn't move and the moon didn't move how would they have known that a day has passed? I know the passage says "about a whole day" but, that would be hard to figure in the heat of a battle. It probably took a long time to even realize the sun and moon weren't moving across the sky.
The most probable answer I can see is that God revealed to them what he was doing and their own bodies as well the scope of what they accomplished demonstrated to them that it truly occurred.
The bible saying that the sun and moon stood still suggests to me that God stopped time. It is by the sun and the moon time is measured. I realize the earth rotates and also revolves but the sun and the moon are the objects used to measure time by. Time is part of God's creation and is a gift to man:
Genesis 1:14 And God said, Let there be lights in the firmament of the heaven to divide the day from the night; and let them be for signs, and for seasons, and for days, and years:
God being eternal is not constrained by time. How easy would it be for the one who spoke the worlds into existence to suspend time to allow his chosen nation to finish an important battle?
The one that got Galileo in trouble in the first place. The verse in Joshua that states the Sun stopped moving across the sky.
So the sun stood still, and the moon stopped, till the nation avenged itself on its enemies, as it is written in the Book of Jashar. The sun stopped in the middle of the sky and delayed going down about a full day. There has never been a day like it before or since…”
—Joshua 10:13-14
This appears to be an error as follows:
- The Sun does not move across the sky; rather, the Earth rotates
- Granted that he may have been describing the appearance of the Sun's motion, and not being aware of the order of the Universe, then for the Sun to appear to stop moving the Earth would have had to stop rotating, which clearly did not occur, due to the cataclysmic consequences that would have followed.
So clearly the Bible seems to be in error, if one adheres to a literal interpretation. However, if one accepts that passages such as the one in Joshua were intended not as factual accounts but as fictional stories with moral messages, then the issue of errors and contradictions becomes rather moot.
The bolded part above is what is most interesting. If there is a plenary attitude toward scripture, why would inspired scripture appeal to a book we don't have? Was the book of Jashar inspired? If so, why did God let us lose it? If not, why does inspired scripture need to appeal to authority of uninspired scripture. There is a book called Jashar which is an eighteenth century forgery. The original has never been found.
I'm sure there will be plenty of "answers," but the fact is we don't know. That verse just doesn't fit into a "God-breathed" verse. On the other hand, if scripture is seen as written by men INSPIRED TO WRITE about God, then we have their appeal to other written authority to support their faith in God--and that makes more sense. It is also a use of COMMON SENSE which is every bit a gift of God as anything else.
If the book of Jasher isn't enough, I'm fairly certain there are other scripture verses that appeal to written authority for which we have no record. I researched it at one time, but would have to go back over it again.
Needless to say there aren't SOME contradictions in the Bible, there are many. The books were written by various authors (some writing different parts of the self-same book) and reflected different faith approaches and understanding of events of their time.
The writing of those authors is no different than the writing of Billy Graham or any other modern author who uses written words to convey their own understanding of God. And if that writing helps someone to approach their own spiritual life with more intensity, dedication and faithfulness, then it is every bit as inspired as anything recorded in the Bible.
Quote:
If every good and perfect gift comes from the Father of lights, then all true and edifying writings, whether in Scripture or not, must be in some sense inspired.
C.S. Lewis
The kind of truth we seek today was, in my opinion, not even envisaged by the ancients that wrote scripture.
Last edited by Wardendresden; 11-13-2014 at 12:08 AM..
Books mentioned as source for divinely inspired scripture
2 Samuel 1:18(Also he bade them teach the children of Judah the use of the bow: behold, it is written in the book of Jasher.)
The Manner of the Kingdom / Book of Statutes 1 Samuel 10:25Then Samuel told the people the manner of the kingdom, and wrote it in a book, and laid it up before the Lord. And Samuel sent all the people away, every man to his house.
Book of Samuel the Seer 1 Chronicles 29:29 Now the acts of David the king, first and last, behold, they are written in the book of Samuel the seer, and in the book of Nathan the prophet, and in the book of Gad the seer,
Nathan the Prophet I Chronicles 29:29Now the acts of David the king, first and last, behold, they are written in the book of Samuel the seer, and in the book of Nathan the prophet, and in the book of Gad the seer, 2 Chronicles 9:29Now the rest of the acts of Solomon, first and last, are they not written in the book of Nathan the prophet, and in the prophecy of Ahijah the Shilonite, and in the visions of Iddo the seer against Jeroboam the son of Nebat?[
Acts of Solomon 1 Kings 11:41 And the rest of the acts of Solomon, and all that he did, and his wisdom, are they not written in the book of the acts of Solomon?
Shemaiah the Prophet 2 Chronicles 12:15Now the acts of Rehoboam, first and last, are they not written in the book of Shemaiah the prophet, and of Iddo the seer concerning genealogies? And there were wars between Rehoboam and Jeroboam continually.[
Prophecy of Abijah 2 Chronicles 9:29 Now the rest of the acts of Solomon, first and last, are they not written in the book of Nathan the prophet, and in the prophecy of Ahijah the Shilonite, and in the visions of Iddo the seer against Jeroboam the son of Nebat?
Story of Prophet Iddo 2 Chronicles 13:22 And the rest of the acts of Abijah, and his ways, and his sayings, are written in the story of the prophet Iddo.
Visions of Iddo the Seer 2 Chronicles 9:29 Now the rest of the acts of Solomon, first and last, are they not written in the book of Nathan the prophet, and in the prophecy of Ahijah the Shilonite, and in the visions of Iddo the seer against Jeroboam the son of Nebat?
Iddo Genealogies
2 Chronicles 12:15 Now the acts of Rehoboam, first and last, are they not written in the book of Shemaiah the prophet, and of Iddo the seer concerning genealogies? And there were wars between Rehoboam and Jeroboam continually.
Book of Jehu 2 Chronicles 20:34Now the rest of the acts of Jehoshaphat, first and last, behold, they are written in the book of Jehu the son of Hanani, who is mentioned in the book of the kings of Israel.
And, of course, Jude 14 quotes Enoch's prophesy apparently from the Book of Enoch. Why would men inspired by God press authority onto works which apparently haven't been found?
Last edited by Wardendresden; 11-13-2014 at 12:20 AM..
Reason: Formatting
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Books mentioned as source for divinely inspired scripture
