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I have no doubt they have powerful experiences. And I have no doubt many of them are unlike experiences they have had before. So not sure what your point is. I certainly do not see what it has to do with your false claim that was essentially "we do not understand gravity therefore god"
I have no doubt they have powerful experiences. And I have no doubt many of them are unlike experiences they have had before. So not sure what your point is. I certainly do not see what it has to do with your false claim that was essentially "we do not understand gravity therefore god"
It isn't a false a claim. The fact that Einstein fits a description to an effect, you say, doesn't explain the cause. What does explain the cause is that there is something bigger than it. Everything we humans do in the scientific world is based on cause and effect and there's no possible extension to philosophical issues...
Since you're so sure of what you 'only know', do you use the words love and hope in your everyday vernacular?
That's why people who want to be healed, get healed, when they 'do something' in expectation that aligns with what they know to be true. Space for a demand is created.
I challenge you to perform a bit of an experiment to test your assertion.
1. Take the closest book, hold it 2 feet above the floor and let go of it. You will see that it falls to the floor every time. And, you will be able to predict that this will happen during each subsequent test.
2. The next time you have an ailment or injury, pray to your God for an immediate healing while avoiding use of medical science. I predict that you will not be healed immediately and will require either medical treatment or time to help you overcome what has stricken you.
I'm sure you understand that gravity is predictable, a requirement within the scientific process, while the God claim is not, suggesting that he/she/it doesn't exist. If you say that your evidence for a God is purely based on faith, though I disagree with the reliability of faith, I will be more willing to understand your viewpoint. But, to suggest that this is science that scientists are selfishly ignoring just doesn't hold water.
Millions have visited Lourdes with hopes of being healed, and millions have been disappointed. They've taken the "leap of faith" by spending their time and money to visit a foreign land to have God relieve them of their ailments, but have come away with the scientifically expected result, at a much higher rate than the rate of supposed divine healings. So, your claim of "people who want to be healed, get healed" is proven false on a daily basis, with emotional and financial damage being incurred as frequently.
That the totality of life is riven with meaning, none of which can be proven or explained, but still is. Sounds like a miracle to me, pointing to a higher reason than mere mortals could ever grasp.
Not if you are merely inventing the "meaning". I see no reason to think there is any "meaning" to life other than the subjective one each of us bring to it ourselves.
Wow an actual reply to one of my posts. You forget yourself.
Unfortunately, you fail again to address my points specifically and instead resort to pretending I did not do what I actually DID do. It was your making the generalizations. And I torpedoed them entirely. You generalize that scientists have some bias or agenda or fear of their peers, so they refuse to speak out or defend NDE explanations that please you.
The reality however is that were there ANY substantiation for the NDE explanations you favor, there are few scientists alive who would not be clambering to write them up and submit those papers. So keep your generalizations and sweeping hollow remarks out of it. They are misrepresentations of the reality of how science, and scientists, operate.
I might be more apt to take your responses seriously if you removed the superiority game act. This is a discussion, not a game of battleship. I find it rather childish that you feel the need to use terms like "torpedo".
The only thing you are doing here is continuing your act of disagreeing with everything I say. You continue with the generalization by saying a substantiation is required without even defining each what qualifies as "substantiating".
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nozzferrahhtoo
I just did. You ignored it. But I am happy to repeat it. The competence of a scientist or doctor is called into question when they espouse entirely unsubstantiated nonsense. If a doctor did THAT then his competence would be called into questions and rightly so.
So I presented a real life documented example, and what did you do? You dismissed it immediately without a SHRED of supporting evidence. That's what atheists do. The reality is they would never consider supernatural evidence because their biased nature will always see it as unsubstantiated nonsense. It doesn't matter if it is documented or there are witnesses. The only time I see an atheist willing to yield is when they experience it themselves. Guess what happens? The atheist community immediate discredits the person who was once like them. This happened with Dr. Eden Alexander.
The only thing your generalization done here was prove my point!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nozzferrahhtoo
What evidence? Present it? You have made an MO on this forum of talking about how much evidence is out there without actually presenting a shred of it anywhere. Perhaps today is the day you will cough some up.
And atheists like you have a MO of demanding evidence then immediately rejecting it. Then returning to the claim that no evidence was ever presented. I posted a link about Lourdes. Why doesn't that qualify as evidence? Just because you say so? I posted a live video of a woman having her spine regrown and the response was so what, I need to see an amputee healed! You can't present evidence to people who are not willing to believe.
Not if you are merely inventing the "meaning". I see no reason to think there is any "meaning" to life other than the subjective one each of us bring to it ourselves.
Well, that’s the predicament. I haven’t merely inventedanything, ...but that I could, or might would be pretty impressive and is a philosophical idea on its own.
God the creator lives inme. I know it, and it’s a miracle.
Any supernatural experience that does not include a revelation that Jesus is Saviour and Lord and that He died for your sins and you need to accept Him and His death at Calvary and His Blood to cleanse you from all of your sins, reject that dream/vision/experience.
Any supernatural experience that does not include a revelation that Jesus is Saviour and Lord and that He died for your sins and you need to accept Him and His death at Calvary and His Blood to cleanse you from all of your sins, reject that dream/vision/experience.
Because you say so?
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