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Location: In Thy presence is fulness of joy... Psa 16:11
299 posts, read 265,255 times
Reputation: 381
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The Waldenses (the church that refused to be corrupted by Augustine & Constantine) carried about hand-written copies of the Scriptures. These were from the original texts; not the corrupted texts of the Vaticanus, Sinaticus, etc. These were they which were preserved and written down by William Tyndale, and then the KJV scholars.
The miraculous preservation of the Bible via the KJV is no surprise to anyone who believes that God's Word is for ever sure.
Consider these testimonies:
Well, I started the first video and when he started out giving straw man choices for authority I turned it off. When people start with a bad assumption, you get bad theology.
Location: In Thy presence is fulness of joy... Psa 16:11
299 posts, read 265,255 times
Reputation: 381
How sad for you who think it is funny to mock the Scriptures and people who believe them! It is a fearful thing to think you are above God's Word. May the Lord have mercy on you and open your eyes to His truth.
The only way I can truly reflect Jesus Christ is if I have hidden His Word in my heart, cling to His truth in life, word an deed, and stand by it--even when other people try to explain it away, jeer at me, or otherwise cause confusion about the true issues. Those kinds of people are considered "false teachers/prophets" in the words of Jesus and His apostles.
Of them Jesus warned His followers, "Beware of false prophets, which come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves." (Matt 7:15)
One of His apostles later wrote similar warnings: "But there were false prophets also among the people, even as there shall be false teachers among you, who privily shall bring in damnable heresies, even denying the Lord that bought them, and bring upon themselves swift destruction. And many shall follow their pernicious ways; by reason of whom the way of truth shall be evil spoken of. And through covetousness shall they with feigned words make merchandise of you: whose judgment now of a long time lingereth not, and their damnation slumbereth not...Having eyes full of adultery, and that cannot cease from sin; beguiling unstable souls: an heart they have exercised with covetous practices; cursed children: Which have forsaken the right way, and are gone astray, following the way of Balaam the son of Bosor, who loved the wages of righteousness; But was rebuked for his iniquity: the dumb ass speaking with man's voice forbad the madness of the prophet. These are wells without water, clouds that are carried with a tempest; to whom the mist of darkness is reserved for ever. For when they speak great swelling words of vanity, they allure through the lusts of the flesh, through much wantonness, those that were clean escaped from them who live in error. While they promise them liberty, they themselves are the servants of corruption: for of whom a man is overcome, of the same is he brought in bondage. For if after they have escaped the pollutions of the world through the knowledge of the Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ, they are again entangled therein, and overcome, the latter end is worse with them than the beginning. For it had been better for them not to have known the way of righteousness, than, after they have known it, to turn from the holy commandment delivered unto them.But it is happened unto them according to the true proverb, The dog is turned to his own vomit again; and the sow that was washed to her wallowing in the mire." (2 Peter 2)
How sad for you who think it is funny to mock the Scriptures and people who believe them! It is a fearful thing to think you are above God's Word. May the Lord have mercy on you and open your eyes to His truth.
The only way I can truly reflect Jesus Christ is if I have hidden His Word in my heart, cling to His truth in life, word an deed, and stand by it--even when other people try to explain it away, jeer at me, or otherwise cause confusion about the true issues. Those kinds of people are considered "false teachers/prophets" in the words of Jesus and His apostles.
Of them Jesus warned His followers, "Beware of false prophets, which come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves." (Matt 7:15)
One of His apostles later wrote similar warnings: "But there were false prophets also among the people, even as there shall be false teachers among you, who privily shall bring in damnable heresies, even denying the Lord that bought them, and bring upon themselves swift destruction. And many shall follow their pernicious ways; by reason of whom the way of truth shall be evil spoken of. And through covetousness shall they with feigned words make merchandise of you: whose judgment now of a long time lingereth not, and their damnation slumbereth not...Having eyes full of adultery, and that cannot cease from sin; beguiling unstable souls: an heart they have exercised with covetous practices; cursed children: Which have forsaken the right way, and are gone astray, following the way of Balaam the son of Bosor, who loved the wages of righteousness; But was rebuked for his iniquity: the dumb ass speaking with man's voice forbad the madness of the prophet. These are wells without water, clouds that are carried with a tempest; to whom the mist of darkness is reserved for ever. For when they speak great swelling words of vanity, they allure through the lusts of the flesh, through much wantonness, those that were clean escaped from them who live in error. While they promise them liberty, they themselves are the servants of corruption: for of whom a man is overcome, of the same is he brought in bondage. For if after they have escaped the pollutions of the world through the knowledge of the Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ, they are again entangled therein, and overcome, the latter end is worse with them than the beginning. For it had been better for them not to have known the way of righteousness, than, after they have known it, to turn from the holy commandment delivered unto them.But it is happened unto them according to the true proverb, The dog is turned to his own vomit again; and the sow that was washed to her wallowing in the mire." (2 Peter 2)
God Himself didn't hold that much authority to His own written word. If you carefully read Jeremiah, you will find that He commanded Jeremiah to write a scroll which a pagan king promptly burned up when it was presented to him. Then God told Jeremiah to write a second scroll and ADD more wording (did He not get it correct the first time?). When Jeremiah completed the second scroll God told him to drop it into the ocean. There was no command in the existing Jeremiah to write a third scroll, but obviously Jeremiah did because our English bibles contain it. Except it is quite different from the copy of Jeremiah found with the Dead Sea Scrolls. There was information cut out of the Jeremiah in our English bibles (from the Septuagint translation). And the information cut out was about some prophecies that didn't come about. Apparently a redactor noticed those things had not occurred so he just cut them out of the translation we now have. Or maybe there were four scrolls.
Deifying scripture is a sin. It takes away from the picture we have of the REAL evidence that God wants to display to men---His Son, Jesus. Scripture that doesn't match up with the picture that Jesus gives us of how God wants us to live should be taken for the mistakes of men--which it is. And there are those in both Old and New Testaments.
The KJV remains one of the worst English translations in existence, primarily because it was taken from later edited versions of earlier manuscripts.
It still amazes me that people who want to know God listen to Sunday School lessons rather than do a critical, in depth study of the Bible and recognize that what we have in English suffers from some serious translation difficulties, and in some cases doesn't represent the oldest manuscripts that have now been discovered. What those people have done is entangle themselves in pharisaical readings of scripture with no understanding of the Spirit of God.
The Bible is a compilation of writings about the faith of people at different times and places, living under different circumstances, and it was written to the existing communities of faith. Even the New Testament writers sometimes reached incorrect conclusions because they didn't have the oldest manuscripts of recorded Old Testament scripture. And plenary theologians jump through all sorts of hoops to "explain" the mistakes so that they don't appear to be mistakes. Then they give their own explanation the weight they give to scripture.
Jesus summed up all the existing scripture with two commandments.
Love the Lord your God with all your heart and mind,
and love your neighbor as yourself.
We keep the first Great Commandment by following the Second. Everything in the Bible that can't fit into that second Great Commandment should be looked at with a jaundiced eye. It simply isn't fitting into the example that God gave us in Jesus.
Location: In Thy presence is fulness of joy... Psa 16:11
299 posts, read 265,255 times
Reputation: 381
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wardendresden
God Himself didn't hold that much authority to His own written word...
We keep the first Great Commandment by following the Second. Everything in the Bible that can't fit into that second Great Commandment should be looked at with a jaundiced eye. It simply isn't fitting into the example that God gave us in Jesus.
We can't know how to love God or our neighbors, we cannot know how to live as Jesus did and does...unless we believe He has given us a clear, reliable, authoritative, inerrant Word to direct us. Going by feeling, going by our own definitions, going by what we think is Jesus gets a person further and further into "The Twilight Zone." That is why there are so many false religions today.
Your mystical definitions of things line up very well with the popular New Age message of Emergent Churchianity, but they do not line up with the Jesus of the Bible. You will continue to be deceived until you trust the words which the Spirit of Jesus Christ inspired men to write down; and those words were kept--safe, secure and sure--and their message was faithfully translated into English in the KJV.
God Himself didn't hold that much authority to His own written word. If you carefully read Jeremiah, you will find that He commanded Jeremiah to write a scroll which a pagan king promptly burned up when it was presented to him. Then God told Jeremiah to write a second scroll and ADD more wording (did He not get it correct the first time?). When Jeremiah completed the second scroll God told him to drop it into the ocean. There was no command in the existing Jeremiah to write a third scroll, but obviously Jeremiah did because our English bibles contain it. Except it is quite different from the copy of Jeremiah found with the Dead Sea Scrolls. There was information cut out of the Jeremiah in our English bibles (from the Septuagint translation). And the information cut out was about some prophecies that didn't come about. Apparently a redactor noticed those things had not occurred so he just cut them out of the translation we now have. Or maybe there were four scrolls.
Deifying scripture is a sin. It takes away from the picture we have of the REAL evidence that God wants to display to men---His Son, Jesus. Scripture that doesn't match up with the picture that Jesus gives us of how God wants us to live should be taken for the mistakes of men--which it is. And there are those in both Old and New Testaments.
The KJV remains one of the worst English translations in existence, primarily because it was taken from later edited versions of earlier manuscripts.
It still amazes me that people who want to know God listen to Sunday School lessons rather than do a critical, in depth study of the Bible and recognize that what we have in English suffers from some serious translation difficulties, and in some cases doesn't represent the oldest manuscripts that have now been discovered. What those people have done is entangle themselves in pharisaical readings of scripture with no understanding of the Spirit of God.
The Bible is a compilation of writings about the faith of people at different times and places, living under different circumstances, and it was written to the existing communities of faith. Even the New Testament writers sometimes reached incorrect conclusions because they didn't have the oldest manuscripts of recorded Old Testament scripture. And plenary theologians jump through all sorts of hoops to "explain" the mistakes so that they don't appear to be mistakes. Then they give their own explanation the weight they give to scripture.
Jesus summed up all the existing scripture with two commandments.
Love the Lord your God with all your heart and mind,
and love your neighbor as yourself.
We keep the first Great Commandment by following the Second. Everything in the Bible that can't fit into that second Great Commandment should be looked at with a jaundiced eye. It simply isn't fitting into the example that God gave us in Jesus.
Looks like NTF didn't listen to your well though out reply...
Looks like NTF didn't listen to your well though out reply...
People who wish to use their book to control others will never listen to threats to their perception of the supremacy of that book. I generally find that those who deny the authority of the Spirit that Jesus promised in that book have never encountered it. They talk about wild ideas being presented if we don't use their "authority" just as if the basic idea of knowing "by their fruits" were not perfectly reasonable. That the most perfect articulation of that Spirit in"the Golden Rule" would keep them from imposing their concepts on other people seems to me to be their worst nightmare.
The weaker one's faith, the more one leans on the bible.
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