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Old 01-24-2015, 12:56 PM
 
Location: kansas city
678 posts, read 654,536 times
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Ive had questions but never questioned
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Old 01-24-2015, 01:03 PM
 
Location: Iowa, USA
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What is the difference between having questions and questioning? If you're questions aren't questioning, they're probably not very good questions.

I assume you're saying have you ever questioned the existence, as in, was Jesus a real person and did he do what it says he did in the Bible? And again, you say you've had questions? Well, what kind of questions. Unless your questions were generic, like, how tall was Jesus, you're probably lying about never questioning.

And I'm not judging either. It's important to ask questions. If the questions can't be answered, then that should raise a red flag. So if you were to ask your priest/pastor/minister a question, and they become defensive, you should be wary of trusting him/her.
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Old 01-24-2015, 01:19 PM
 
19,943 posts, read 15,946,582 times
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Of course. To question is to be human.
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Old 01-24-2015, 04:26 PM
 
12,919 posts, read 15,516,288 times
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You HAVE to question it if you take the faith seriously.

Paul said that he had a vision of Jesus Christ. Yet, he also said that his appearance was the SAME as the appearance made to the apostles years before that.

Either:
1. The Jesus Christ written about by Paul and by the gospel writers represented a spiritual aspect shared by Paul, the apostles, and the followers in the same way. Up to the present day and throughout the last 2000 years. Or maybe even longer (by many centuries and across cultures) if you count the experiences reflected by the ancient prophets. And the figure in the stories was based on a real historical teacher who had been crucified.
OR
2. The miraculous stories and resurrections were literal history.

Which is more likely?
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Old 01-24-2015, 04:48 PM
 
7,381 posts, read 7,358,784 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vizio View Post
Of course. To question is to be human.
But to ignore real answers because it conflicts with what you were raised to believe takes religion.
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Old 01-24-2015, 05:42 PM
 
Location: US Wilderness
1,233 posts, read 1,032,752 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by OzzyRules View Post
You HAVE to question it if you take the faith seriously.

Paul said that he had a vision of Jesus Christ. Yet, he also said that his appearance was the SAME as the appearance made to the apostles years before that.

Either:
1. The Jesus Christ written about by Paul and by the gospel writers represented a spiritual aspect shared by Paul, the apostles, and the followers in the same way. Up to the present day and throughout the last 2000 years. Or maybe even longer (by many centuries and across cultures) if you count the experiences reflected by the ancient prophets. And the figure in the stories was based on a real historical teacher who had been crucified.
OR
2. The miraculous stories and resurrections were literal history.

Which is more likely?
Please tell us where Paul says that the appearance of Jesus "was the SAME as the appearance made to the apostles years before that". In 1 Corinthians 15, Paul distinguishes the way Jesus appeared to him from how Jesus appeared to others.

Quote:
1 Corinthians 15
3 For what I received I passed on to you as of first importance: that Christ died for our sins according to the Scriptures, 4 that he was buried, that he was raised on the third day according to the Scriptures, 5 and that he appeared to Cephas, and then to the Twelve. 6 After that, he appeared to more than five hundred of the brothers and sisters at the same time, most of whom are still living, though some have fallen asleep. 7 Then he appeared to James, then to all the apostles, 8 and last of all he appeared to me also, as to one abnormally born.
Died, buried, raised ... Paul is clearly talking about a physical resurrection. Especially the part about "the third day". If one's spirit survives physical death, it would be immediate, not on the third day.

The phrase 'abnormally born' refers to a miscarriage or abortion. Paul is separating himself from the others he referred to. He is saying that he is not in the same league as those who saw a physically risen Jesus. There is nothing here to indicate that all those others only had a vision of a spiritual Jesus. In any case, Paul certainly did not interview all those people so he would not have cause to say they saw a spiritual Jesus, especially since his language strongly suggests a physical Jesus.

A few sentences later, Paul emphasizes the importance of Jesus having been raised from the dead, this being the promise of a future general resurrection. His readers would certainly infer a physical resurrection in the future. Spirit survival would not wait until the end of days to happen.

Quote:
1 Corinthians 15
12 But if it is preached that Christ has been raised from the dead, how can some of you say that there is no resurrection of the dead? 13 If there is no resurrection of the dead, then not even Christ has been raised. 14 And if Christ has not been raised, our preaching is useless and so is your faith. 15 More than that, we are then found to be false witnesses about God, for we have testified about God that he raised Christ from the dead. But he did not raise him if in fact the dead are not raised. 16 For if the dead are not raised, then Christ has not been raised either. 17 And if Christ has not been raised, your faith is futile; you are still in your sins. 18 Then those also who have fallen asleep in Christ are lost. 19 If only for this life we have hope in Christ, we are of all people most to be pitied.

20 But Christ has indeed been raised from the dead, the firstfruits of those who have fallen asleep. 21 For since death came through a man, the resurrection of the dead comes also through a man.
There is a third option other than the two you mentioned. A real historic Jesus was executed and his body was stolen to support a story - told by strangers at the empty tomb - that Jesus had risen from the dead. This would fit neatly with the resurrection stories told in Daniel and Ezekiel, both of which would later be referenced heavily in Revelation. Note that all four Gospels have similar empty tomb stories. The resurrection event would be the a great opportunity for story telling yet no one takes advantage of it. It is in the post-resurrection stories that imagination runs wild, yielding four very different tales.

Paul does a terrific job of tying it all together, turning the death of the messiah figure from inexplicable tragedy to a scripture based victory and neatly solidifying the implied Daniel based end of days and judgment themes into an imminent expectation. But a physical resurrection prior to judgment is a must just as Daniel 12 says.

The thinking of the times was a physically resurrected Jesus not a spirit one.
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Old 01-24-2015, 05:50 PM
 
Location: Ontario, Canada
31,378 posts, read 18,010,018 times
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I decided a while ago it doesn't really matter if Jesus actually existed or not. (At least to me.)

The concept of him is what a lot of people cling to, not necessarily the reality.
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Old 01-24-2015, 06:02 PM
 
28,433 posts, read 9,802,341 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tht1guy View Post
Ive had questions but never questioned
yes and no,

there is no need to question if a guy was running around teaching or he is a composite character from that time. The Romans didn't like it so they killed him is not even needed to question. The rising part. well, never questioned it past the quick crosscheck. It didn't happen as literally taught.
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Old 01-24-2015, 06:03 PM
 
Location: Texas and Arkansas
1,341 posts, read 1,420,018 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tht1guy View Post
Ive had questions but never questioned
I questioned it some when I believed in evolution.
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Old 01-24-2015, 06:43 PM
 
Location: Way down younder.....
322 posts, read 219,838 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tht1guy View Post
Ive had questions but never questioned
I believe questioning his purpose and message is common. I don't think you could take a look at the evidence and question the fact of his existance on earth some 2000 years ago.
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