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So I work a lot with Facebook as an internet marketer (don't mind the profile insurance thing... I've yet to update it) so I am on Facebook all day. As myself, my company, and other companies we work with. I recently was up too late (that is not my only excuse) so I posted this on my personal status:
Quote:
Just saying.... I will willingly offer to go to hell for all those going to Hell. I make this public so that all can see that even though I don't have any religious affiliation...I am willing to go to hell for all hell-bound people. What are your thoughts? Is Hell real? If I take your place in hell, does that make me a God? Would God really let me take all Hell-bound's place? Wouldn't that be similar to Jesus' role?
You wouldn't believe the blow out! I have never been so popular (not a good thing by the way!) but the reaction from family and friends is that I am evil for not believing there is a hell. They actually called out the prayer squad... yes it is a group on Facebook! Anyway, I just thought I would post here to get thoughts from both sides.
Why is the thought of hell not existing so fearful?
Why is not okay for me to volunteer to take all the hell-bound onto myself?
Why is the idea that millions are tormented after death beneficial to them; I mean it's not like they get a do-over?
Why do I need the prayer squad simply for believing that hell is not something a loving god would ever do?
Also, not one of my friends or relatives provided any proof that the Bible even teaches of hell let alone Jesus teaching that doctrine!
Any thoughts or experiences to share?
Last edited by katjonjj; 05-15-2015 at 09:23 PM..
Reason: made clear I was posting as myself
Yes, I've experienced rejection from family and friends due to sharing my assurance that the doctrine of eternal torment is a lie. It's been about 15 years ago since I made it known that I reject that doctrine of demons. They don't really care anymore just so long as I don't talk about it.
It is MAINSTREAM and very POPULAR in America to believe in eternal torment. Doesn't it seem that if few find the narrow gate that leads to life then that would not be a mainstream doctrine? It is as American as apple pie though.
Yes, I've experienced rejection from family and friends due to sharing my assurance that the doctrine of eternal torment is a lie. It's been about 15 years ago since I made it known that I reject that doctrine of demons. They don't really care anymore just so long as I don't talk about it.
It is MAINSTREAM and very POPULAR in America to believe in eternal torment. Doesn't it seem that if few find the narrow gate that leads to life then that would not be a mainstream doctrine? It is as American as apple pie though.
Hello again HS.. Hope you and yours are well. My purpose was to cause doubt in that very mainstream but they seem so hellbent on it (pun intended)!
I had a backlash to be sure! One post said this:
Quote:
The concept is the same. Tell me Kat, you refute about everything anyone says. You must be greater than all the scholars alive because you know everything and everyone else knows nothing. Christianity has been around since the dawn of time. The same one that's preached today. You don't have some new corner on the market hon' and you aren't changing my beliefs. Only solidifying and cementing. If everything is a parable in the bible as you say, why oh why are they there. Answer it.
This was a response to mine that said the parable of Lazarus was a parable not reality... The concept is really not the same! I don't believe I am any smarter than the average Joe... Although I did get high scores on that Facebook IQ quiz... LOL
Does this person not study the Bible? The story of Lazarus was a parable and clearly so but then they apply the straw-man that I believe all the Bible is a parable? AND what about the New Covenant being a change that is featured in the NT? I mean... How does one even respond.
I really regret posting this on Facebook given such lengthy posts to write! I should have become a Literary Major instead!
My own mother argued with me about Lazarus and the Rich man. She said it was not a parable. She was always worried about whether she would make it to heaven. Her pastor taught and even preached at her funeral that she had a CHANCE of making it into heaven since she was faithful in church attendance and tried her best to live an upright life. There is a ton of ignorance in the world - that's all. I almost wonder if people enjoy ignorance because it allows them to be lazy about learning. Jesus got frustrated with people he was teaching who were slow to understand.
My own mother argued with me about Lazarus and the Rich man. She said it was not a parable. She was always worried about whether she would make it to heaven. Her pastor taught and even preached at her funeral that she had a CHANCE of making it into heaven since she was faithful in church attendance and tried her best to live an upright life. There is a ton of ignorance in the world - that's all. I almost wonder if people enjoy ignorance because it allows them to be lazy about learning. Jesus got frustrated with people he was teaching who were slow to understand.
oh Kat, I'm sure there was something good somewhere that came out of your action. I hope, anyway.
Yep, I got the same reaction from people I've tried to talk to. 'Who do you think you are?' is the most common. Why all those scholars preach and believe in "hell' so who are you to say it isn't real? Oh my. And now my sister is allowed to talk about her beliefs but I can't bring up mine. After thousands of years it is difficult to have to explain how hell to incorporated into the whole mess and unless someone at least is willing to give it some thought, it's rather useless to try to present the concept.
I'm just so grateful I no longer believe in it. So much easier not to go around thinking whatever I do or say is being written and will be held against me unless I do such and such and determine to do better as to the law. I know now that it is God who is still creating me and molding me and His love has never let me go for one second or anyone else. Jesus came to tell us that He is concerned about the victims of this world, the cast outs, those who are burdened. He reaches to our very core and shows us how it is love that will finally conquer the most stubborn heart and open up deaf ears and blind eyes. But when we have been told that this side of the grave is the ONLY 'CHANCE' and that He can do nothing else for us after that, well it's blasphemy to consider another option. sigh.
oh Kat, I'm sure there was something good somewhere that came out of your action. I hope, anyway.
Yep, I got the same reaction from people I've tried to talk to. 'Who do you think you are?' is the most common. Why all those scholars preach and believe in "hell' so who are you to say it isn't real? Oh my. And now my sister is allowed to talk about her beliefs but I can't bring up mine. After thousands of years it is difficult to have to explain how hell to incorporated into the whole mess and unless someone at least is willing to give it some thought, it's rather useless to try to present the concept.
I'm just so grateful I no longer believe in it. So much easier not to go around thinking whatever I do or say is being written and will be held against me unless I do such and such and determine to do better as to the law. I know now that it is God who is still creating me and molding me and His love has never let me go for one second or anyone else. Jesus came to tell us that He is concerned about the victims of this world, the cast outs, those who are burdened. He reaches to our very core and shows us how it is love that will finally conquer the most stubborn heart and open up deaf ears and blind eyes. But when we have been told that this side of the grave is the ONLY 'CHANCE' and that He can do nothing else for us after that, well it's blasphemy to consider another option. sigh.
God bless you Kat for your good intentions.
Thanks for the kind words. I also started the quest into not believing in this most horrid doctrine when I was actually trying to answer the question, "How can we be assured we are not going to hell?" I couldn't find the answer. Every denomination and religion was different. That's when I started my 2 year long journey.
So I work a lot with Facebook as an internet marketer (don't mind the profile insurance thing... I've yet to update it) so I am on Facebook all day. As myself, my company, and other companies we work with. I recently was up too late (that is not my only excuse) so I posted this on my personal status:
You wouldn't believe the blow out! I have never been so popular (not a good thing by the way!) but the reaction from family and friends is that I am evil for not believing there is a hell. They actually called out the prayer squad... yes it is a group on Facebook! Anyway, I just thought I would post here to get thoughts from both sides.
Why is the thought of hell not existing so fearful?
Why is not okay for me to volunteer to take all the hell-bound onto myself?
Why is the idea that millions are tormented after death beneficial to them; I mean it's not like they get a do-over?
Why do I need the prayer squad simply for believing that hell is not something a loving god would ever do?
Also, not one of my friends or relatives provided any proof that the Bible even teaches of hell let alone Jesus teaching that doctrine!
Any thoughts or experiences to share?
Unless a seed dies, it cannot bear fruit.
A seed will sit for decades, and when you finally spray water on that seed, it dies.
Then it bears fruit.
But if you don't receive the water for your seed, It will never die, your worm will never, ever die.
You have a barley seed and if you are not willing to go all the way to death, there will be no spring water for you, and if you don't harvest the barley seed, then you will never get to the wheat, and if you don't get to the wheat, you couldn't possibly have hopes in the third harvest or the rain of the fall.
The rain that we pray for in Tabernacles doesn't come falling out of the sky making people wet, it is a promise of a double portion of spirit, the rain of God that makes you immortal.
People imagine themselves in some horrid place surrounded by demons with rotting flesh where they have worms that never die, but the saying is meant to imply that there will be no rain on you, and if you don't receive the rain of the feast of Tabernacles, it will be hell to realize.
These saying and concepts of hell are not what people think they are, they are grounded in ancient Jewish tradition and Christians are reading a New Testament that has omitted much of the language used in explaining things.
The outer court is hell.
We don't have to wonder and guess about everything because of the fact that the temple design shows us the design of heaven and the outer court of gentiles is that outer court of darkness, it is the outer court of uncircumcision.
We are shown people walking into the kingdom of heaven and then being escorted out of that kingdom, and this means that people had salvation but only in the uncircumcised court because they did not seek the adoption.
People came into the kingdom of heaven and sought to enter and stay within the two sections of circumcision{Holy place/Holy of Holies} which are only for Israel, just as Shemini Atzereth is just for Israel and every gentile who has not become Israel is circumcised from the congregation on the eighth day of Tabernacles.
They are circumcised on the very day that Jesus was circumcised in his flesh, they are cut off with no rain, and they are sent weeping and gnashing their teeth into the outer court of darkness, but we are also shown that there is still salvation there, but their worm will never, ever die.
They will never enter the city and they will no longer hear the voice of the bridegroom or the bride.
They will seek death, one and all, but death will flee from them because the door has been closed and unless you seek death today, there is no time to seek death later.
A seed has to die, and a Passover lamb is nothing unless you also die with him to let him rule YOU.
I always thought Facebook was a kind of hell itself.
I dropped Facebook completely.
In of itself it seemed like a juvenile academy that was centered in Hell that I could never graduate from.
So liberating to be free of it for almost a year, now.
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