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Repentance refers to changing your mind about Christ. Not about changing your mind about sin. Christ paid the penalty for our sins on the cross. For that reason anyone who simply trusts in Christ Jesus for eternal life is given eternal life. But I already stated this in post #6.
Sin committed by the believer can result in divine discipline in time and loss of eternal rewards, but it never results in loss of eternal life.
Inheriting the kingdom of God is not the same as inhabiting the kingdom of God. While every believer will be in the kingdom, not every believer will have the same rewards, blessings, and rulership responsibilities in the kingdom. The believer cannot lose his eternal salvation by committing sins which Jesus already died and paid the penalty for. If God had intended to condemn you for your personal sins then Jesus never would have been sent to die for your sins in your place as your substitute.
Wouldn't you agree that inhabiting the kingdom (rewards, blessings, and rulership responsibilities) is dependent upon inheriting the kingdom. IOW, doesn't a person first have to get into heaven before getting rewards, blessings, etc.?
Paul says wrongdoers will not inherit the kingdom of heaven, meaning they are not going to enter into heaven. Christians do sin, and some on a continuous basis. Unless they stop sinning and they continue to walk in darkness, they are not going to get into heaven.
1 Cor. 6:9
"Or do you not know that wrongdoers will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived: Neither the sexually immoral nor idolaters nor adulterers nor men who have sex with men."
Unless they stop sinning and confess their sins, the blood of Jesus does not forgive. They must walk in the light. The blood of Jesus is not a license to sin.
1John 1
6*If we say that we have fellowship with him, and walk in darkness, we lie, and do not the truth:
7*But if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship one with another, and the blood of Jesus Christ his Son cleanseth us from all sin.
8*If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.
9*If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.
10*If we say that we have not sinned, we make him a liar, and his word is not in us.
Why did Jesus tell the young man that in order to obtain (not earn) eternal life, he must obey the commandments, if it were not so? Please explain. When the young man said he'd kept the commandments, and asked what he was still lacking to obtain (not earn) eternal life, why did Jesus tell him that he was to sell his posessions and give to the poor? Why did Jesus tell the young man he needed to do these things to obtain (not earn) eternal life if it were not so?
Salvation is NOT "earned" by keeping the commandments. I agree with you there. Earned is your word, not mine. Jesus didn't use it either, so I don't know why you are. The question the young man posed used the word "obtain." He was asking what he needed to do to obtain salvation. He didn't ask how he could "earn" it.
I look forward to your explanation.
I already explained why back in post #21.
And if you needed to do anything for eternal life other than simply trust in the finished work of Christ on the cross that would mean that you have to earn it. But you don't have to, and can't do anything to earn or obtain eternal life. You can only accept the offer of eternal life by trusting in Christ Jesus for it. It's a gift. It's free.
Revelation 22:17 The Spirit and the bride say, "Come." And let the one who hears say, "Come." And let the one who is thirsty come; let the one who wishes take the water of life without cost.
As Jesus told the Samaritan woman, all she needed to do was ask for the free gift of eternal life.
John 4:10 Jesus answered and said to her, "If you knew the gift of God, and who it is who says to you, 'Give Me a drink,' you would have asked Him, and He would have given you living water." . . . 14] but whoever drinks of the water that I will give him shall never thirst; but the water that I will give him will become in him a well of water springing up to eternal life."
If you had to keep the commandments to obtain eternal life then commandment keeping would be the cost for eternal life. But the water of life, eternal life is free. There is no cost to us because Jesus already paid the price. He picked up the tab.
Katie, if you are depending on keeping the commandments to obtain eternal life then you have not trusted in Christ and His finished redemptive work on the cross on your behalf and you remain under condemnation. Eternal life is offered by God only as a free gift. You cannot work for it, or obtain it by keeping the commandments, or by anything that you can do on a meritorious basis. I hope that you will think about this, and I invite you to listen to the salvation series I've posted on this thread. The choice is yours.
Then get to the nearest morgue and start raising the dead. Jesus was talking to His apostles who had the authority to do the same miracles that He did. You do not. But if you think you can raise the dead, then by all means, give it a try.
The works are the words of God as Jesus explained.
"Whoever is of the truth hears my voice."
"My sheep hear my voice"
"Your light must shine before men so they will see your good works and glorify your heavenly Father."
"Anyone who acts in truth (the word of God) comes to the light so his deeds are revealed as works of God."
For anyone reading this thread, if you had to do anything for which you could take credit in order to obtain eternal life, including keeping the commandments, then that becomes works. It becomes effort on your part. But eternal salvation is a free gift freely given. Salvation is by grace through faith in Christ Jesus. Faith is non-meritorious. It is the object of faith that has the merit. And Jesus Christ is the object of faith for eternal life.
Grace is antithetical to works. It is in opposition to works. Look at the following two passages.
Eph. 2:8 For by grace you have been saved through faith; and that not of yourselves, it is the gift of God; 9] not as a result of works, so that no one may boast.
Romans 11:6 But if it is by grace, it is no longer on the basis of works, otherwise grace is no longer grace.
Works have their proper place in the Christian life. But grace absolutely forbids works as a way of obtaining eternal life. And commandment keeping, making an effort to keep the commandments in order to be saved is works. Unfortunately, many people will never understand this or accept it and will continue to attempt to work for their salvation. Their efforts are futile.
I invite anyone who will, to listen to this salvation series.
Salvation-010
Position in Christ, Reconciliation. November 26, 2002
Salvation-011
Eternal Security. December 04, 2002
Salvation-012
What is Faith? Ephesians 2:1-9. December 12, 2009
Salvation-013
Does Saving Faith Produce Works? James 2:14. December 18, 2002
Salvation-014
Does Saving Faith Necessarily Produce Works? James 2:14-26. January 08, 2003
Salvation-015
Role of Works in Salvation. Jam 2: 18-26. January 22, 2003
Salvation-016
Parable of the Soil. January 29, 2003
Salvation-017
Redemption and Forgiveness Special: January 25, 2009
And with that, I think I've spent enough time on this particular thread. Again, many of you are simply never going to listen and will reject grace and attempt to somehow be worthy of obtaining eternal life by something that you do. What a tragedy.
For anyone reading this thread, if you had to do anything for which you could take credit in order to obtain eternal life, including keeping the commandments, then that becomes works. It becomes effort on your part. But eternal salvation is a free gift freely given. Salvation is by grace through faith in Christ Jesus. Faith is non-meritorious. It is the object of faith that has the merit. And Jesus Christ is the object of faith for eternal life.
<snip>
You are correct for the wrong magical reasons . . . but still correct. We have NOTHING to do with our salvation . . . and that means absolutely NOTHING. Christ did that for us. We ARE responsible for our sanctification under Christ's love for us all and that requires that we actively love God and each other every day and repent when we don't. It still has NOTHING to do with our salvation, though.
You are correct for the wrong magical reasons . . . but still correct. We have NOTHING to do with our salvation . . . and that means absolutely NOTHING. Christ did that for us. We ARE responsible for our sanctification under Christ's love for us all and that requires that we actively love God and each other every day and repent when we don't. It still has NOTHING to do with our salvation, though.
I figured you would pop up after I said I was through on this thread.
In opposition to the legalists who claim that you must work for your salvation and therefore pervert the grace of God, people like you pervert grace from the opposite side by claiming that everyone is already saved. But no one has eternal life until they receive Christ as Savior.
Acts 16:30 and after he brought them out, he said, "Sirs, what must I do to be saved?" 31] They said, "Believe in the Lord Jesus, and you will be saved, you and your household."
John 3:16 "For God so loved the world, that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him shall not perish, but have eternal life.
These and many more verses put the lie to your claim that everyone is already saved.
You are correct for the wrong magical reasons . . . but still correct. We have NOTHING to do with our salvation . . . and that means absolutely NOTHING. Christ did that for us. We ARE responsible for our sanctification under Christ's love for us all and that requires that we actively love God and each other every day and repent when we don't. It still has NOTHING to do with our salvation, though.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike555
In opposition to the legalists who claim that you must work for your salvation and therefore pervert the grace of God, people like you pervert grace from the opposite side by claiming that everyone is already saved. But no one has eternal life until they receive Christ as Savior.
Acts 16:30 and after he brought them out, he said, "Sirs, what must I do to be saved?" 31] They said, "Believe in the Lord Jesus, and you will be saved, you and your household." John 3:16 "For God so loved the world, that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him shall not perish, but have eternal life.
These and many more verses put the lie to your claim that everyone is already saved.
You continue to make the same error in thinking that the "believe IN" refers to some intellectual acceptance. It is properly translated as "believe ON/INTO" and has nothing to do with intellectual acceptance. It is an inner conviction and following of the guidance of the Comforter to the truth God has "written in our hearts" in love of God and each other. THAT is how we obtain the cover of Christ's perfection (Grace) for our imperfections.
And if you needed to do anything for eternal life other than simply trust in the finished work of Christ on the cross that would mean that you have to earn it. But you don't have to, and can't do anything to earn or obtain eternal life. You can only accept the offer of eternal life by trusting in Christ Jesus for it. It's a gift. It's free.
Revelation 22:17 The Spirit and the bride say, "Come." And let the one who hears say, "Come." And let the one who is thirsty come; let the one who wishes take the water of life without cost.
As Jesus told the Samaritan woman, all she needed to do was ask for the free gift of eternal life.
John 4:10 Jesus answered and said to her, "If you knew the gift of God, and who it is who says to you, 'Give Me a drink,' you would have asked Him, and He would have given you living water." . . . 14] but whoever drinks of the water that I will give him shall never thirst; but the water that I will give him will become in him a well of water springing up to eternal life."
If you had to keep the commandments to obtain eternal life then commandment keeping would be the cost for eternal life. But the water of life, eternal life is free. There is no cost to us because Jesus already paid the price. He picked up the tab.
Katie, if you are depending on keeping the commandments to obtain eternal life then you have not trusted in Christ and His finished redemptive work on the cross on your behalf and you remain under condemnation. Eternal life is offered by God only as a free gift. You cannot work for it, or obtain it by keeping the commandments, or by anything that you can do on a meritorious basis. I hope that you will think about this, and I invite you to listen to the salvation series I've posted on this thread. The choice is yours.
I understand your position Mike. I've read it often, but it doesn't answer my questions to you. I'll ask again. Hopefully, you will be patient, and bear with me here.
Why, if He didn't mean it, did Jesus tell the rich young ruler to keep the commandments if he wanted to obtain eternal life? Why, after the man said he'd kept the commandments, did Jesus tell him he had to sell his posessions and give to the poor if he wanted to obtain eternal life, if it wasn't necessary.
I look forward to your answer.
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