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True, Paul did not write James. I was making a point that "Grace Alone" and "Faith Alone" are not supported by the book of James. Yes, it was off-topic.
It depends on your context that your are referencing with Grace Alone and Faith Alone.
I suppose one might find the means to justify Paul's contradictory words? Surely he was not speaking for the God of LOVE, MERCY and JUSTICE..
Jesus ministered to the sinners, with no reluctance to engage adulterers, prostitutes, publicans, tax collectors, lepers, or any other “unclean” person (the whole need not a physician; a church is a hospital for sinners rather than a showcase for saints). This, of course, completely devastates the argument that god cannot be in the presence of sin by anyone who believes Jesus was god.
Paul contradicts Jesus in 1Cor 5:11: “But now I have written unto you not to keep company, if any man that is called a brother be a fornicator, or covetous, or an idolater, or a railer, or a drunkard, or an extortioner; with such an one no not to eat.”
Paul is not contradicting Jesus, but speaking about an entirely different case: he is talking about continuing in sin after having theoretically come to Christ. I'm sure you don't mean that we should do this? If not, what is our course of action? It is outlined for us in how to approach an erring brother.
But thank you for the example of how Paul can be misunderstood.
Paul is not contradicting Jesus, but speaking about an entirely different case: he is talking about continuing in sin after having theoretically come to Christ. I'm sure you don't mean that we should do this? If not, what is our course of action? It is outlined for us in how to approach an erring brother.
But thank you for the example of how Paul can be misunderstood.
But of course it would be. Because hanging out with sinners just ain't the same as hanging out with sinners..makes perfect sense to me.
How did I ever miss the difference.
Just like this --
Paul was very anti-woman. He ordered that they not be allowed to speak in the churches (1Cor 14:34-45) and that they stay home and take care of the kids (1Timothy 5:14), and that wives should be submissive to the mastery of their husbands (Ephesians 2:12; 5:22-24 and Colossians 3:18-19).
This, of course, is in direct opposition to Jesus, who elevated women — even women of lowly status such as prostitutes, Samaritans (woman by the well), and everyday women such as Mary and Martha — to a degree unprecedented for that time. Note that in Luke 10:38-42, Jesus even chastises Martha for accepting a traditional woman’s role, while he praises her sister Mary for choosing the “better part” of more active participation. This was obviously recognized by the women of that time, as Luke 8:2-3 lists the names of a number of prominent women of means who provided economic support for Jesus’ ministry.
Another situation where Paul was onto a totally different situation, right? Paul meant that just CERTAIN women should STHU and the rest of the women in the world are good to go?
But the writings of the Pharisees never became the bulk of the New Testament. Paul's did. If Paul was a heretic, why did that occur? Clearly, early Christianity did not see Paul as a heretic.
Why Do People Follow Paul?
1. It is the easy way. Jesus requires you to actually transform your character and put it into action. Paul says, “Just have faith and believe” and you get a free gift, without ever having to actually DO anything — something for nothing; the easy way out; the lazy man’s way to salvation; the free ride.
2. As has been noted previously, Paul was wealthy, educated, and had the rare status of being both a Jew and a Roman citizen, affording him both the means and papers with which to travel. He was able to travel widely, throughout the entire Roman empire, converting gullible victims by the thousands, giving him extraordinary power, and all of them had their interpretation of what Jesus taught coming by way of Paul’s version, so it gained traction early.
Paul is not contradicting Jesus, but speaking about an entirely different case: he is talking about continuing in sin after having theoretically come to Christ. I'm sure you don't mean that we should do this? If not, what is our course of action? It is outlined for us in how to approach an erring brother.
But thank you for the example of how Paul can be misunderstood.
But of course it would be. Because hanging out with sinners just ain't the same as hanging out with sinners..makes perfect sense to me.
How did I ever miss the difference.
Just like this --
Paul was very anti-woman. He ordered that they not be allowed to speak in the churches (1Cor 14:34-45) and that they stay home and take care of the kids (1Timothy 5:14), and that wives should be submissive to the mastery of their husbands (Ephesians 2:12; 5:22-24 and Colossians 3:18-19).
This, of course, is in direct opposition to Jesus, who elevated women — even women of lowly status such as prostitutes, Samaritans (woman by the well), and everyday women such as Mary and Martha — to a degree unprecedented for that time. Note that in Luke 10:38-42, Jesus even chastises Martha for accepting a traditional woman’s role, while he praises her sister Mary for choosing the “better part” of more active participation. This was obviously recognized by the women of that time, as Luke 8:2-3 lists the names of a number of prominent women of means who provided economic support for Jesus’ ministry.
Another situation where Paul was onto a totally different situation, right? Paul meant that just CERTAIN women should STHU and the rest of the women in the world are good to go?
On the bolded: I don't know. Under the circumstances I'd have to say that it's because you don't want to.
You are absolutely right about that passage on women attributed to Paul, and which not only contradicts Jesus, but things that Paul himself wrote. Given the influence of Neo-Platonist thought on the developing clergy in the early part of the second century, I'm very suspicious of that passage. Good catch.
1. It is the easy way. Jesus requires you to actually transform your character and put it into action. Paul says, “Just have faith and believe” and you get a free gift, without ever having to actually DO anything — something for nothing; the easy way out; the lazy man’s way to salvation; the free ride.
2. As has been noted previously, Paul was wealthy, educated, and had the rare status of being both a Jew and a Roman citizen, affording him both the means and papers with which to travel. He was able to travel widely, throughout the entire Roman empire, converting gullible victims by the thousands, giving him extraordinary power, and all of them had their interpretation of what Jesus taught coming by way of Paul’s version, so it gained traction early.
And yet Christianity made him a saint and canonized his writings into the New Testament. Why?
And yet Christianity made him a saint and canonized his writings into the New Testament. Why?
Because they do not believe in the son of man as He prescribed but believe on their own terms to their own destruction. It was much easier to follow Paul than Jesus because Jesus is hard for sinners to understand.
"No one can see the kingdom of God unless they are born from above."
And yet Christianity made him a saint and canonized his writings into the New Testament. Why?
Says a lot about christianity and its willingness (need?)for idols and gods.
For there is one God and one mediator between God and mankind, the man Christ Jesus,
even when Paul is given credit for getting it right, mere mortals still do not understand and seek to make men greater than they are so they have something to aspire to?
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