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RainMusics' post rambled too much. I suspect because emotions were involved that are difficult to express in words. I read a lot of frustration and near-tears disappointment. Yes or no?
Doctrine in the church is a mess. There is too little said about points that have deep meaning and too much emphasis on things that don't matter. Bottom line is that the modern emphasis is on putting butts in seats. If happy talk and a big song and dance musical production will do it - its done. It's about the money. That's it and that's all.
The church today is indistinguishable from a secular corporation.
I abandoned the church because I got tired of leaving a service filled with anger and discontent. It's a total waste of time and I have better things to do.
Then I found someplace else. Some thing else.
I found a Messianic Jewish synagogue in my community and checked it out. The language and the traditions are totally Jewish, but their doctrines are firm and ancient. There is meaning and spiritual satisfaction that was missing from the secularized church. Best of all they accept and believe that Yeshuah (Jesus) is their messiah (ha mashiah) and that one cannot have peace (shalom) with God unless one is born again. Other than this one point, it's all Jewish all the time. It is not Christian it is not a church.
The beauty of Judaism is that you can adopt as much or as little of it as suits your taste. I still eat ham and cheese and if I want to cook matzo ball soup* I do that too. If I learn a little Hebrew that's cool too. Being a gentile has its advantages. Being a member of a Messianic Jewish congregation has spiritual benefits too. What's not to like?
Best of all - when I leave a temple service I'm glad I went.
and that's me, hollering shalom from the choir loft...
* matzo ball soup is chicken soup with matzo crackers formed into balls. It's like little dumplings when you cook it in soup.
Absolutely to all points. And re the Messianic synagogue, you'll learn more actually seeing Christ in all things in there by seeing what is done on what days in a year, than in a church of any kind, for a decade (likely several decades). And it's been there for thousands of years, exactly the same, for all to see, compliments of the Jewish people who expertly preserved it all. Peace
No one is saved or should have an expectation of heaven by church attendance or a denomination. Without exception everyone in heaven will be known personally by Jesus Christ and will have faith in the gospel given to Paul by the risen Lord. Sitting in a building for an hour on Sunday listening to a false message does nothing for you, so you must seek out the truth and it is mighty hard to find today...........the truth is the bible is inerrant, Jesus is deity, and you are saved by what HE has already done at the cross and we need His grace and mercy to be assured of heaven....
I read your post and tried to understand what point you wanted to make, but I could not figure out the gist of what you were trying to say.
I don't go to church because I don't agree with all the various points of doctrine in the churches. I also don't care for the set up of "clergy" facing "audience".
I could probably hang out with a small group if they were similar to me in their perspective about God. That's about as close as I would be able to get to "going to church" anymore.
Greeting
yes a problem I have
When is the second coming of Jesus the Christ.
The world was Created in six days, what is a day to Christ, but a moment were there is no time.
A day represents a thousand years.
Eph 1:19-23 According to the working of His mighty power
Eph 1: 20 which He worked in Christ when He raised Him from the dead and seated Him at His right hand in the heavenly places,
Eph 1: 21 far above all principality and power and might and dominion, and every name that is named, not only in this age but also in that which is to come.
Eph 1: 22 And He put all things under His feet, and gave Him to be head over all things to the church,
Eph 1: 23 which is His body, the fullness of Him who fills all in all.
The time of judgment from the beginning, rulers set up many empires, but falling in time in history, great civilization and had prophets and prophesied about the future, Our government knows need to know about Christ as well with us.
Jesus tells us ever time he sends prophets we ignore or assassinate his character.
Here we read in Matt 23:37 "O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, the one who kills the prophets and stones those who are sent to her!
We ignore or assassinate his character.
Here he gives us a warning.
2 Peter 3:4-9 For since the fathers fell asleep, all things continue as they were from the beginning of creation."
2 Peter 3: 5 For this they willfully forget: that by the word of God the heavens were of old, and the earth standing out of water and in the water,
2 Peter 3: 6 by which the world that then existed perished, being flooded with water.
The Church fathers fell asleep, and did take care of God’s business.
He said in Matt 24:2 Assuredly, I say to you, not one stone shall be left here upon another, that shall not be thrown down."
Now because the Church did not continue in the same teaching in the warning.
The Church fathers fell asleep.
In order of Melchizedek, king of Salem, priest of the Most High God
Heb 5:12-14 For though by this time you ought to be teachers, you need someone to teach you again the first principles of the oracles of God; and you have come to need milk and not solid food.
Heb 5: 13 For everyone who partakes only of milk is unskilled in the word of righteousness, for he is a babe.
Heb 5: 14 But solid food belongs to those who are of full age, that is, those who by reason of use have their senses exercised to discern both good and evil.
2 Peter 3:4-9 For since the fathers fell asleep, all things continue as they were from the beginning of creation."
salty
See because the Church fathers fell asleep, they lost their “salt!
Matt 5:13 "You are the salt of the earth; but if the salt loses its flavor, how shall it be seasoned?
Now became unskilled in the word but solid food belongs to those who are of full age
by this time you ought to be teachers. And you have come to need milk and not solid food.
This is what is happen in our local Church, and on top of all this now you have fault prophet.
Gen 6:3 And the LORD said, My spirit shall not always strive with man,
it repented the LORD that he had made man on the earth, and it grieved him at his heart
Man-made Tradition The Church fathers fell asleep and not renewing their faith.
In the time season they fell asleep.
And Satan sold the sowed seeds of righteous man, the Pharisees and scribes of this age
The scribes and Pharisees become more vocal in their opposition to Jesus.
The breach between true spirituality and man-made tradition widens considerably.
Mark 7:5 Then the Pharisees and scribes asked him, Why walk not thy disciples according to the tradition of the elders, but eat bread with unwashed hands?
Matt 15:3 Why do ye also transgress the commandment of God by your tradition?
1 Peter 1:18 knowing that you were not redeemed with corruptible things, like silver or gold, from your aimless conduct received by tradition from your fathers,
This means the local church tradition.
There are so many mysteries being revealed at this time and there is a reason.
The Word Tradition, 172 occurrences in 133 articles
Jesus will not touch Earth yet. The first coming was his birth as we know, the second appearing will be the gathering, and this will be for those who are resurrected in the new birth. The second come to Earth is the day of atonement, this call, the return for the final days f or judgment! “Yom Kippurâ€
Six days the create the world and seventh day rests, the meaning is six thousand years to create the world, in the last seven thousand years Christ reign’s A thousand years of Christ.
2 Peter 3: 8 But, beloved, do not forget this one thing, that with the Lord one day is as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day.
We are or coming to the Six thousand period within the next few years or a few days.
The last harvests and then the judgment.
1 Peter 4:17 For the time is come that judgment must begin at the house of God: and if it first begin at us, what shall the end be of them that obey not the gospel of God?
2 Peter 3: 7 But the heavens and the earth which are now preserved by the same word, are reserved for fire until the day of judgment and perdition of ungodly men.
today
2 Peter 3: 9 The Lord is not slack concerning His promise
Heb 12:29 For our God is a consuming fire.
In my testimony it is more of my testimony of Salvaition.
Salvaition from all that been dome.
From those days, from my birth to adulthood.
Salvaition was my journey.
Then came the visions, not dreams.
I will share this vision I had.
In a vision He I say He, meeting the Holy Spirit, showed me three long tubes, made of glass, height unknown.
Each one had a small clock above it.
The first tube was complete.
The second was almost to the top.
The third was not complete, yet seen.
The Holy Spirit said, the problems of today meaning the sins of the world, will be buried by the sands of time!
The clock represent time, the second was almost to the top, the end of Grace. We are or coming to the Six thousand period within the next few years or days.
For some reason I can see. I am afraid.
Psalms 108:2 Awake, lute and harp! I will awaken the dawn.
What is lost time pass, and what lift is education of what we are learning of the Bible.
Psalms 83: 1-2 Do not keep silent, O God! Do not hold Your peace, And do not be still, O God!
God the Father will not be silent
Psalms 83: 2 For behold, Your enemies make a tumult; And those who hate You have lifted up their head.
Man loved this world!
Isaiah 51: 17-23 Awake, awake! Stand up, O Jerusalem, You who have drunk at the hand of the Lord The cup of His fury; You have drunk the dregs of the cup of trembling, And drained it out.
Today Israel is the Church and will begin to feel the fury of Christ.
I have being Awakening
Isaiah 51: 18 There is no one to guide her Among all the sons she has brought forth; Nor is there any who takes her by the hand Among all the sons she has brought up.
Isaiah 51: 19 These two things have come to you; Who will be sorry for you?-- Desolation and destruction, famine and sword-- By whom will I comfort you?
Isaiah 51: 20 Your sons have fainted, They lie at the head of all the streets, Like an antelope in a net; They are full of the fury of the Lord, The rebuke of your God.
Isaiah 51: 21 Therefore please hear this, you afflicted, And drunk but not with wine.
Isaiah 51: 22 Thus says your Lord, The Lord and your God, Who pleads the cause of His people: "See, I have taken out of your hand The cup of trembling, The dregs of the cup of My fury; You shall no longer drink it.
Isaiah 51: 23 But I will put it into the hand of those who afflict you, Who have said to you, 'Lie down, that we may walk over you.' And you have laid your body like the ground, And as the street, for those who walk over."
1 Kings 10: 3-8 So Solomon answered all her questions; there was nothing so difficult for the king that he could not explain it to her.
1 Kings 10: 4 And when the queen of Sheba had seen all the wisdom of Solomon, the house that he had built,
1 Kings 10: 5 the food on his table, the seating of his servants, the service of his waiters and their apparel, his cupbearers, and his entryway by which he went up to the house of the Lord, there was no more spirit in her.
1 Kings 10: 6 Then she said to the king: "It was a true report which I heard in my own land about your words and your wisdom.
1 Kings 10: 7 However I did not believe the words until I came and saw with my own eyes; and indeed the half was not told me. Your wisdom and prosperity exceed the fame of which I heard.
1 Kings 10: 8 Happy are your men and happy are these, your servants, who stand continually before you and hear your wisdom!
Ezek 33: 30-33 "As for you, son of man, the children of your people are talking about you beside the walls and in the doors of the houses; and they speak to one another, everyone saying to his brother, 'Please come and hear what the word is that comes from the Lord.'
Ezek 33: 31 So they come to you as people do, they sit before you as My people, and they hear your words, but they do not do them; for with their mouth they show much love, but their hearts pursue their own gain.
Ezek 33: 32 Indeed you are to them as a very lovely song of one who has a pleasant voice and can play well on an instrument; for they hear your words, but they do not do them.
Ezek 33: 33 And when this comes to pass--surely it will come--then they will know that a prophet has been among them."
Last night I cry about the congregation try to type words my heart was overwhelm my spelling is not great takes time
Awfully elaborate rationalization on why you want to sleep in on Sunday morning. I realize that you are perfect, and you are so disappointed in the failings of those lesser mortals imperfectly trying to live their faith, but you should really give it another shot. After all, as critical as Christ was of the synagogue in his day, he still managed to attend temple. What makes you so special?
Awfully elaborate rationalization on why you want to sleep in on Sunday morning. I realize that you are perfect, and you are so disappointed in the failings of those lesser mortals imperfectly trying to live their faith, but you should really give it another shot. After all, as critical as Christ was of the synagogue in his day, he still managed to attend temple. What makes you so special?
Any thoughts just on this one verse at Hebrews 10:25 to Not forsake gathering together
Greeting
I know this whatever I am with family and friends, for I know all churches have some kind of problem, and all should come as one, not leaving one behind, but the Lord send his spirit to each one of us no matter where we are and one each of us are as one, gathering into one body at home or with the congregation, but where two or three gather breaking bread their be the Holy One, in the gathering of the few.
Romans 13:10-14 Love does no harm to a neighbor; therefore love is the fulfillment of the law.
And do this, knowing the time, that now it is high time to awake out of sleep; for now our salvation is nearer than when we first believed.
The night is far spent, the day is at hand. Therefore let us cast off the works of darkness, and let us put on the armor of light.
Let us walk properly, as in the day, not in revelry and drunkenness, not in lewdness and lust, not in strife and envy.
But put on the Lord Jesus Christ, and make no provision for the flesh, to fulfill its lusts.
Acts 2:42-44 And they continued steadfastly in the apostles' doctrine and fellowship, and in breaking of bread, and in prayers.
And fear came upon every soul: and many wonders and signs were done by the apostles.
And all that believed were together, and had all things common;
Phil 2:3-5 Doing nothing through envy or through pride, but with low thoughts of self let everyone take others to be better than himself; Not looking everyone to his private good, but keeping in mind the things of others. Let this mind be in you which was in Christ Jesus, Phil 1:15-17 Though some are preaching Christ out of envy and competition, others do it out of a good heart: These do it from love, conscious that I am responsible for the cause of the good news: But those are preaching Christ in a spirit of competition, not from their hearts, but with the purpose of giving me pain in my prison.
2 Cor 1:12 For our glory is in this, in the knowledge which we have that our way of life in the world, and most of all in relation to you, has been holy and true in the eyes of God; not in the wisdom of the flesh, but in the grace of God.
Titus 1:9-10 Keeping to the true word of the teaching, so that he may be able to give comfort by right teaching and overcome the arguments of the doubters. For there are men who are not ruled by law; foolish talkers, false teachers, specially those of the circumcision, Phil 1:16-17 These do it from love, conscious that I am responsible for the cause of the good news: But those are preaching Christ in a spirit of competition, not from their hearts, but with the purpose of giving me pain in my prison.
2 Cor 12:20 For I have a fear that, when I come, you may not be answering to my desire, and that I may not be answering to yours; that there may be fighting, hate, angry feeling, divisions, evil talk about others, secrets, thoughts of pride, outbursts against authority;
Prov 30:11-14 There is a generation who put a curse on their father, and do not give a blessing to their mother. There is a generation who seem to themselves to be free from sin, but are not washed from their unclean ways. There is a generation, O how full of pride are their eyes! O how their brows are lifted up! There is a generation whose teeth are like swords, their strong teeth like knives, for the destruction of the poor from the earth, and of those who are in need from among men.
Prov 11:24-26 A man may give freely, and still his wealth will be increased; and another may keep back more than is right, but only comes to be in need. He who gives blessing will be made fat, but the curser will himself be cursed. He who keeps back grain will be cursed by the people; but a blessing will be on the head of him who lets them have it for a price.
1 Cor 11:27-34 If, then, anyone takes the bread or the cup of the Lord in the wrong spirit, he will be responsible for the body and blood of the Lord. But let no man take of the bread and the cup without testing himself. For a man puts himself in danger, if he takes part in the holy meal without being conscious that it is the Lord's body. For this cause a number of you are feeble and ill, and a number are dead. But if we were true judges of ourselves, punishment would not come on us. But if punishment does come, it is sent by the Lord, so that we may be safe when the world is judged. So then, my brothers, when you come together to the holy meal of the Lord, let there be waiting for one another. If any man is in need of food, let him take his meal in his house; so that you may not come together to your damage. And the rest I will put in order when I come.
Malachi 3: 16 - 18 Then those in whom was the fear of the Lord had talk together: and the Lord gave ear, and it was recorded in a book to be kept in mind before him, for those who had the fear of the Lord and gave thought to his name. And they will be mine, says the Lord, in the day when I make them my special property; and I will have mercy on them as a man has mercy on his son who is his servant. Then you will again see how the upright man is different from the sinner, and the servant of God from him who is not.
1 Tim 3:1-7 This is a true saying, A man desiring the position of a Bishop has a desire for a good work. The Bishop, then, is to be a man of good name, the husband of one wife, self-controlled, serious-minded, having respect for order, opening his house freely to guests, a ready teacher; Not quickly moved to wrath or blows, but gentle; no fighter, no lover of money; Ruling his house well, having his children under control with all serious behavior; (For if a man has not the art of ruling his house, how will he take care of the church of God?) Not one newly taken into the church, for fear that, through his high opinion of himself, he may come into the same sin as the Evil One. And he is to have a good name among those outside the church, so that nothing may be said against him and he may not be taken by the designs of the Evil One.
I agree with you about the people being the temple of God and glorifying the God by honoring his son Jesus.
But the problem in churches today has nothing to do with people reading the wrong bible translation. I am not trying to change your mind, but your division over "which bible translation" is just one of many divisions that cause God's people to be divided. People can worship together without carrying a bible at all, don't you think?
As for following Him as His disciple, we need the meat of His words in the KJV which modern Bible have changed His message and declined from the testimonies of the Son to such a point that they support false teachings and apostasies too.
Not all modern Bibles have capitalized the small "s" in spirit in 2 Corinthians 3:6 & John 6:63; BUT all Bibles including the KJV has John 6:30-35 & John 5:39-40 & others testify that the Son gives life; The Holy Spirit is life ( Romans 8:10 ), but the Son gives us the Holy Spirit and thus when we receive the Holy Spirit, we receive eternal life. So the Nicene creed is wrong in designating the title of the Giver of Life to the Holy Spirit. By that same creed is the practice taught to worship the Holy Spirit with the Father & the Son and all Bibles tells us to honor the Father by honoring the Son and only the Son, because once we stop honoring the Son, we are no longer honoring the Father ( John 5:22-23 ) There is no Biblical reference that teaches churches to worship the Holy Spirit with the Father & the Son.
So to expose that error of the Nicene creed as not being Biblical, you need the right Bible: a few modern Bibles and the KJV keeps that testimony regarding the Son to expose those unBiblical practice.
Then you have all the Bibles testifying that the Holy Spirit cannot speak on His own authority or on His own initiative or have His own words to speak, but speaks what He hears in John 16:13, but only the KJV keeps that testimony in Romans 8:26-27 whereas ALL modern Bibles fail in translation as if the Holy Spirit can make His own intercessions Himself and making some sounds while doing it. The KJV is the only one that testifies that the intercessions of the Holy Spirit are unspeakable with groanings which cannot be uttered at all, thus the "he" that searches our hearts is the Son, Jesus Christ, as it is that "he" that knows the mind of the Spirit is how the unspeakable intercessions of the Spirit are known to the father because Jesus presents the unspeakable intercessions of the Spirit's to the Father in according to the will of God because there is only One Mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus ( 1 Timothy 2:5 ) It is because of Romans 8:26-27 in all modern Bibles that they completely ignore the truth in His words in John 16:13 in that very same modern Bible that the Holy Spirit cannot & will not use God's gift of tongues of other men's lips to speak unto the people to turn it around and use it as a personal prayer language for Himself. Too many believers do not know that tongues without interpretation is not of Him, especially gained by seeking to receive the Holy Spirit "again" with evidence of that tongue.
So it is very important to have the right Bible where truths all lines up for discerning good & evil by Him.
So if a church is to discern good and evil in these latter days, they need the KJV, BUT they need to trust Jesus Christ as their Good Shepherd to understand His words in the KJV so they can discern good and evil by His words and repent from iniquity with His help too.
So many churches are prejudicial to rely only on the KJV, and so it would have to be a miracle from God to see the truth in His words in exposing the mistranslations in other places in those modern Bibles. Comparing it with the KJV, the Lord may help them to see that truth and know why they should stick to the KJV. So pray about it when you bring it to your church's attention.
As for following Him as His disciple, we need the meat of His words in the KJV which modern Bible have changed His message and declined from the testimonies of the Son to such a point that they support false teachings and apostasies too.
Not all modern Bibles have capitalized the small "s" in spirit in 2 Corinthians 3:6 & John 6:63; BUT all Bibles including the KJV has John 6:30-35 & John 5:39-40 & others testify that the Son gives life; The Holy Spirit is life ( Romans 8:10 ), but the Son gives us the Holy Spirit and thus when we receive the Holy Spirit, we receive eternal life. So the Nicene creed is wrong in designating the title of the Giver of Life to the Holy Spirit. By that same creed is the practice taught to worship the Holy Spirit with the Father & the Son and all Bibles tells us to honor the Father by honoring the Son and only the Son, because once we stop honoring the Son, we are no longer honoring the Father ( John 5:22-23 ) There is no Biblical reference that teaches churches to worship the Holy Spirit with the Father & the Son.
So to expose that error of the Nicene creed as not being Biblical, you need the right Bible: a few modern Bibles and the KJV keeps that testimony regarding the Son to expose those unBiblical practice.
Then you have all the Bibles testifying that the Holy Spirit cannot speak on His own authority or on His own initiative or have His own words to speak, but speaks what He hears in John 16:13, but only the KJV keeps that testimony in Romans 8:26-27 whereas ALL modern Bibles fail in translation as if the Holy Spirit can make His own intercessions Himself and making some sounds while doing it. The KJV is the only one that testifies that the intercessions of the Holy Spirit are unspeakable with groanings which cannot be uttered at all, thus the "he" that searches our hearts is the Son, Jesus Christ, as it is that "he" that knows the mind of the Spirit is how the unspeakable intercessions of the Spirit are known to the father because Jesus presents the unspeakable intercessions of the Spirit's to the Father in according to the will of God because there is only One Mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus ( 1 Timothy 2:5 ) It is because of Romans 8:26-27 in all modern Bibles that they completely ignore the truth in His words in John 16:13 in that very same modern Bible that the Holy Spirit cannot & will not use God's gift of tongues of other men's lips to speak unto the people to turn it around and use it as a personal prayer language for Himself. Too many believers do not know that tongues without interpretation is not of Him, especially gained by seeking to receive the Holy Spirit "again" with evidence of that tongue.
So it is very important to have the right Bible where truths all lines up for discerning good & evil by Him.
So if a church is to discern good and evil in these latter days, they need the KJV, BUT they need to trust Jesus Christ as their Good Shepherd to understand His words in the KJV so they can discern good and evil by His words and repent from iniquity with His help too.
So many churches are prejudicial to rely only on the KJV, and so it would have to be a miracle from God to see the truth in His words in exposing the mistranslations in other places in those modern Bibles. Comparing it with the KJV, the Lord may help them to see that truth and know why they should stick to the KJV. So pray about it when you bring it to your church's attention.
KJV is difficult to follow. The KJV was written at a time when the spoken English was different than today and written where the common people could understand at that period of time.
Nothing wrong with the modern translations of the Bible. Even if you wish to get the most accurate message of the Bible, then the best way is to get to the original texts and not the translations such as when it was first written in Hebrew or Ancient Greek.
Then you have all the Bibles testifying that the Holy Spirit cannot speak on His own authority or on His own initiative or have His own words to speak, but speaks what He hears in John 16:13, but only the KJV keeps that testimony in Romans 8:26-27 whereas ALL modern Bibles fail in translation as if the Holy Spirit can make His own intercessions Himself and making some sounds while doing it. The KJV is the only one that testifies that the intercessions of the Holy Spirit are unspeakable with groanings which cannot be uttered at all, thus the "he" that searches our hearts is the Son, Jesus Christ, as it is that "he" that knows the mind of the Spirit is how the unspeakable intercessions of the Spirit are known to the father because Jesus presents the unspeakable intercessions of the Spirit's to the Father in according to the will of God because there is only One Mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus ( 1 Timothy 2:5 ) It is because of Romans 8:26-27 in all modern Bibles that they completely ignore the truth in His words in John 16:13 in that very same modern Bible that the Holy Spirit cannot & will not use God's gift of tongues of other men's lips to speak unto the people to turn it around and use it as a personal prayer language for Himself. Too many believers do not know that tongues without interpretation is not of Him, especially gained by seeking to receive the Holy Spirit "again" with evidence of that tongue.
So it is very important to have the right Bible where truths all lines up for discerning good & evil by Him.
It hasn't done you any good, because you are blaspheming the works of the Holy Ghost, thanks to the blinding of the denomination you follow as opposed to the Word of G-d. Peace
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Man-made Tradition
gathering into one body
