Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
What happened to it from the time after he died on the cross and on?
Like, where did the matter that made the universe come from, nobody knows.
The gospels would have us believe that either, Jesus came out of the tomb after he (apparently) expired on the crioss, and went back to Galilee, and the apostles went back there to see him (Mark, Matthew and John). Or (Luke-Acts) he stayed in Jerusalem, lecturing the apostles and then ascended (in the solid body, which could nevertheless walk through a solid door (1) to heaven. The apostles stayed in Jerusalem and founded the Apostoloc church.
Now the version which is the one the Church teaches, because it suits it better than Jesus and his followers going back to Galilee, is Luke, a later writer, not one of Jesus' followers (as Matthew and John are claimed to be), but the letters of Paul in fact support Luke, or rather, the gospel of Luke was written using material that Mark, Matthew and John didn't have -and didn't know (3). That is - the letters of Paul and, it appears,the works of Josephus. Thus Luke based a revision of the synoptic gospel (4) on Paul's claim that the apostles were in Jerusalem carrying on Jesus' work.
So three possibilities.
(a) he stayed in the tomb, dead, and perhaps was even shifted to a Family tomb in Talpiot (q.v)
(b) he went back to Galilee and maybe stayed there or moves abroad when it got too hot for him, To Egypt, Rome (where Suetonius records him stirring up trouble) or even India.
(c) the solid body ascended into heaven.
This so undermines the 'back to Galilee' claim that Christianity will pass off going back to Galilee as an episode (2)
(1) but note, the tomb apparently had to have the door opened so he could come out!
(2) absurdly, After appearing to the disciples in Jerusalem, they all troop to Galilee to see him again and then return to Jerusalem so he can instruct them. This is totally ludicrous, but that is - rather quietly- what Christianity seems to think we should believe.
(3) think about that: Paul - who never met Jesus - knew facts about him that the gospel writers apparently didn't.
(4) the evidence is most clearly seen in the angel's message (24.6) where 'Jesus going back to Galilee where they will see him is altered to what Jesus said when they were in Galilee, and the disciples do not have to go to Galilee at all.
Last edited by TRANSPONDER; 10-22-2017 at 07:59 AM..
Like, where did the matter that made the universe come from, nobodyknows.
Au contraire...you just haven't been reading the right books! Tony Stubbs, "An Ascension Handbook".
You might like this better since Richard Dawkins wrote the Afterword:
''A Universe from Nothing: Why There Is Something Rather Than Nothing''
by Lawrence M. Krauss
Even I could tell you...and decades ago before any books came out! From being shown...
remember I'm a person that sits for 3- 6 hours meditating... 'Things' happen!
Kraus nothing isn't nothing. Its a summation to zero potential. That's not nothing.
no, we don't know how or why. But we are here now and the biosphere is best described as "alive". We are part of that aliveness. I think that's what religious and spiritual people are feeling. They just are misrepresenting it sometimes.
some milli mentals and religion haters will deny that because of a warped agenda, but it has explanation, mechanism, and prediction components that make denying it for selling "I hate religion so much I can poop all over how the universe works if I want" seem lame.
What happened to it from the time after he died on the cross and on?
According to the Gospel accounts, after Jesus died His body was taken down off the cross and placed into the tomb which belonged to Joseph of Arimathea. On the third day He was resurrected. The stone which had covered the entrance had been removed, not so that Jesus could get out, but so that witnesses could see that He was no longer in the tomb. After His resurrection He appeared on a number of occasions to various people over a forty day period and then ascended bodily into heaven.
Aside from the Gospel accounts, an even earlier tradition of the risen Jesus is given by the apostle Paul in 1 Corinthians 15:3-7 in which Paul conveys an oral tradition from soon after Jesus rose. Scholars acknowledge that 1 Corinthians 15:3-7 is what they refer to as a pre-Pauline creed or tradition which most scholars believe that Paul received from Peter and James, the Lord's brother when he went to see them some three years after his encounter with the risen Jesus on the Damascus road (See Galatians 1:18-19). In other words, oral accounts of Jesus' resurrection were circulating long before the Gospels were written.
''The account of the Resurrection appearances of Jesus in verses 3-7 appears to be an early pre-Pauline creedal statement.[1]
The antiquity of the creed has been located by most biblical scholars to no more than five years after Jesus' death, probably originating from the Jerusalem apostolic community.[2] Based on linguistic analysis, the version received by Paul seems to have included verses 3b-6a and 7.[3] The creed has been deemed to be historically reliable and is claimed to preserve a unique and verifiable testimony of the time.''
''Moreover, even skeptical scholars agree that the creed in 1 Corinthians 15 is not an interpolation but was a creed formulated and taught at a very early date after Jesus' death. Gerd Lüdemann, a skeptic scholar, maintains that "the elements in the tradition are to be dated to the first two years after the crucifixion of Jesus... not later than three years..."[11] Michael Goulder, another skeptic scholar, states that it "goes back at least to what Paul was taught when he was converted, a couple of years after the crucifixion".''
I think it is worth noting that one would have to be a total idiot to die for something that you knew was a lie. Yet apostles died knowing what was true. All but one died. John was banished.
I sure wouldn’t die for something I knew to be untrue.
I see no reason to doubt the resurrection account.
I think it is worth noting that one would have to be a total idiot to die for something that you knew was a lie. Yet apostles died knowing what was true. All but one died. John was banished.
I sure wouldn’t die for something I knew to be untrue.
That's how some tell the story.
I've also heard that no one knows for sure how any apostle other than James died. And that the bible only records his death and none of the others.
I think it is worth noting that one would have to be a total idiot to die for something that you knew was a lie. Yet apostles died knowing what was true. All but one died. John was banished.
I sure wouldn’t die for something I knew to be untrue.
I see no reason to doubt the resurrection account.
I guess that either means that the radical Muslim suicide bombers are idiots or what they believe about Islam is true.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
'Things' happen!
