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Old 05-24-2018, 08:45 AM
 
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John 3:14-16 - 14 "As Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, even so must the Son of Man be lifted up; 15 so that whoever believes will in Him have eternal life. 16 "For God so loved the world, that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him shall not perish, but have eternal life.


Numbers 21:2-10 - 2 So Israel made a vow to the LORD and said, "If You will indeed deliver this people into my hand, then I will utterly destroy their cities." 3 The LORD heard the voice of Israel and delivered up the Canaanites; then they utterly destroyed them and their cities. Thus the name of the place was called Hormah.

4 Then they set out from Mount Hor by the way of the Red Sea, to go around the land of Edom; and the people became impatient because of the journey. 5 The people spoke against God and Moses, "Why have you brought us up out of Egypt to die in the wilderness? For there is no food and no water, and we loathe this miserable food."

6 The LORD sent fiery serpents among the people and they bit the people, so that many people of Israel died. 7 So the people came to Moses and said, "We have sinned, because we have spoken against the LORD and you; intercede with the LORD, that He may remove the serpents from us." And Moses interceded for the people. 8 Then the LORD said to Moses, "Make a fiery serpent, and set it on a standard; and it shall come about, that everyone who is bitten, when he looks at it, he will live." 9 And Moses made a bronze serpent and set it on the standard; and it came about, that if a serpent bit any man, when he looked to the bronze serpent, he lived.


Jesus compares obtaining eternal life to the event that occurred in the wilderness with the Israelites.

The Lord was upset with them because soon after He delivered them from the Canaanites, they complained to Him about their conditions.

What needed to occur for them to live, if they were bitten by a snake, was to acknowledge their sin, and look at the snake provided on the staff. Otherwise, they died.

So it is for us. Jesus foretold that He was to be lifted up on the cross - and whomever believes in Him (our acknowledgement of our sin, His death for sin, His physical resurrection to new & eternal life) will have eternal life with God.

Last edited by DRob4JC; 05-24-2018 at 08:55 AM.. Reason: grammar
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Old 05-24-2018, 08:54 AM
 
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Yes. He did. And yes, he was lifted up for us.

Good post.
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Old 05-24-2018, 09:35 AM
 
Location: El Paso, TX
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Good post DRob.
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Old 05-24-2018, 09:53 AM
 
Location: Southern Oregon
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Magical thinking says it is about looking on the person rather than committing to a new way of living in community.
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Old 05-24-2018, 10:13 AM
 
Location: Florida
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nateswift View Post
Magical thinking says it is about looking on the person rather than committing to a new way of living in community.
It's not magic.

Your resume from the community is not enough.

"For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: Not of works, lest any man should boast."

Besides, the resume argument contradicts your universal salvation argument.

Last edited by Finn_Jarber; 05-24-2018 at 10:36 AM..
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Old 05-24-2018, 10:35 AM
 
Location: Free State of Texas
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Originally Posted by Mike555 View Post
Good post DRob.
Ditto!
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Old 05-24-2018, 10:36 AM
 
18,976 posts, read 7,020,934 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nateswift View Post
Magical thinking says it is about looking on the person rather than committing to a new way of living in community.
Wait...aren't you Mr. LooktoJesusAndNotWhatHeSaid?
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Old 05-24-2018, 11:06 AM
 
45,582 posts, read 27,187,569 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nateswift View Post
Magical thinking says it is about looking on the person rather than committing to a new way of living in community.
I am taking a direct quote and reference from Jesus, and you are calling it magic. I'm sure Jesus is pleased with you.

It's not magic... you just don't believe what He said.
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Old 05-24-2018, 11:20 AM
 
Location: Southern Oregon
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Originally Posted by BaptistFundie View Post
Wait...aren't you Mr. LooktoJesusAndNotWhatHeSaid?
You obviously don't pay attention. I am Mr. BelievethepromiseofJesus rather than a book made by men. or Mr. CofirmeverythingbythenatureoftheSpiritpromised.
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Old 05-24-2018, 11:24 AM
 
Location: Southern Oregon
17,071 posts, read 10,920,829 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Finn_Jarber View Post
It's not magic.

Your resume from the community is not enough.

"For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: Not of works, lest any man should boast."

Besides, the resume argument contradicts your universal salvation argument.
You might have a point if commitment had anything to do with "works," and there is no contradiction in saying that everyone will see the value of love eventually: that there is no justice in punishment without opportunity for change.
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