Differences between normal human offspring and Nephilim offspring (agnostic, belief, Jesus)
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You just make yourself look foolish trying to denigrate the linguistic skills of a man who has a Ph.D in Semitic languages. And knowledge is a matter of education. Not ethnicity.
There are about 14 1/2 million Jews in the world. More than half of them live outside of Israel.
''Among the many Jewish languages, only Hebrew is strongly entrenched despite the fact that most Jews do not speak it and use it only as a liturgical language.''
Which means that they can understand Biblical Hebrew much better that a Christian can...
O, I don't think so, ask any Jew how Jehoram the son of Jehoshaphat, who is one and the same as Jehoram the Son-in-law of Ahab, ruled Israel for 4 years before his Father Jehoshaphat the King of Judah died, after which he rule Judah for 8 Years, thereby ruling Israel for 12 Years and Judah for 8 or those twelve years, before, because of a sever infection from a wound received in warfare he abdicated the throne of Judah, in favor of his son Ahaziah, who ruled Judah for one year before both Jehoram and his son Ahaziah were killed by Jehu, who then became the King of Israel.
When Athaliah, the daughter of Jezebel and Ahab, and mother Athaliah learnt of her son's murder, she gave orders for all the members of the royal family of Judah to be killed. Ahaziah, (The King of Judah) had a half-sister, Jehosheba, who was married to a priest named Jehoiada. She secretly rescued one of Ahaziah's sons, Joash, and took him away from the other princes who were about to be murdered and hid him and a nurse in a bedroom at the Temple. By keeping him hidden, she saved him from death at the hands of Athaliah. For six years he remained there in hiding, while Athaliah the wife of Jehoram, and daughter of Ahab and Jezebel ruled as queen, in Jerusalem.
After six years, Joash the Great Grandson of Ahab was made King of Judah, and his grandmother Athaliah was dragged to the palace in Jerusalem and there she was killed at the horse gate.
Like I said, ask any Jew how Jehoram the son of Jehoshaphat, who is one and the same as Jehoram the Son-in-law of Ahab, ruled Israel for 4 years before his Father Jehoshaphat the King of Judah died, after which he ruled Judah for 8 Years, thereby ruling Israel for 12 Years and Judah for 8 or those twelve years, and see what response you get.
That’s a red flag if I ever saw one...And you need to bone up on your reading comprehension, a Jew doesn’t need to speak Biblical Hebrew in order to understand what he reads...Obviously you’re an exact duplicate of Michael Heiser...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Richard1965
Which means that they can understand Biblical Hebrew much better that a Christian can...
You denied that most Jews outside of Israel don't speak Hebrew. Having been shown that you were wrong you now claim that a Jew doesn't need to know how to speak Hebrew in order to understand what he reads better than a Christian can. Again, ethnicity is not the basis for understanding anything. Education is. And you, Richard (a Jew), don't have a clue about how the ancient Jews understood Genesis 6:1-4 because you aren't educated in the matter. Actually, you do know that the second Temple Period book of 1 Enoch plainly states that the Nephilim are the children of angels who mated with human women and that the Nephilim were giants. So does the book of Jubilees. But you ignore what they say because they aren't canonical books even though they reflect Jewish thought during the Second Temple period, and because you personally reject the supernatural interpretation of Genesis 6:4.
And by the way, בְּנֵ֤י הָֽאֱלֹהִים֙ in Genesis 6:4 is not 'sons of the nobles' as you claimed in post #72 and as the Complete Jewish Bible (chabad.org) translates it because of translator bias. בְּנֵ֤י הָֽאֱלֹהִים֙ means sons of God and is correctly translated as such in other Tanakh translations into English. For example;
The Jewish Virtual Library
Genesis 6:4 The Nephilim were in the earth in those days, and also after that, when the sons of G-d came in unto the daughters of men, and they bore children to them; the same were the mighty men that were of old, the men of renown. https://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org...esis-chapter-6
As a matter of fact, the Complete Jewish Bible (chabad.org) which translates בְּנֵ֣י הָֽאֱלֹהִ֔ים in Genesis 6:4 as 'sons of the nobles' translates the same phrase as 'the angels of God' in Job 2:1. Again, the reason they translate Genesis 6:4 that way is because of translator bias.
You denied that most Jews outside of Israel don't speak Hebrew. Having been shown that you were wrong you now claim that a Jew doesn't need to know how to speak Hebrew in order to understand what he reads better than a Christian can. Again, ethnicity is not the basis for understanding anything. Education is. And you, Richard (a Jew), don't have a clue about how the ancient Jews understood Genesis 6:1-4 because you aren't educated in the matter. Actually, you do know that the second Temple Period book of 1 Enoch plainly states that the Nephilim are the children of angels who mated with human women and that the Nephilim were giants. So does the book of Jubilees. But you ignore what they say because they aren't canonical books even though they reflect Jewish thought during the Second Temple period, and because you personally reject the supernatural interpretation of Genesis 6:4.
And by the way, בְּנֵ֤י הָֽאֱלֹהִים֙ in Genesis 6:4 is not 'sons of the nobles' as you claimed in post #72 and as the Complete Jewish Bible (chabad.org) translates it because of translator bias. בְּנֵ֤י הָֽאֱלֹהִים֙ means sons of God and is correctly translated as such in other Tanakh translations into English. For example;
The Jewish Virtual Library
Genesis 6:4 The Nephilim were in the earth in those days, and also after that, when the sons of G-d came in unto the daughters of men, and they bore children to them; the same were the mighty men that were of old, the men of renown. https://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org...esis-chapter-6
As a matter of fact, the Complete Jewish Bible (chabad.org) which translates בְּנֵ֣י הָֽאֱלֹהִ֔ים in Genesis 6:4 as 'sons of the nobles' translates the same phrase as 'the angels of God' in Job 2:1. Again, the reason they translate Genesis 6:4 that way is because of translator bias.
Well, you don’t have a clue either, your bias is showing...
You denied that most Jews outside of Israel don't speak Hebrew. Having been shown that you were wrong you now claim that a Jew doesn't need to know how to speak Hebrew in order to understand what he reads better than a Christian can. Again, ethnicity is not the basis for understanding anything. Education is. And you, Richard (a Jew), don't have a clue about how the ancient Jews understood Genesis 6:1-4 because you aren't educated in the matter. Actually, you do know that the second Temple Period book of 1 Enoch plainly states that the Nephilim are the children of angels who mated with human women and that the Nephilim were giants. So does the book of Jubilees. But you ignore what they say because they aren't canonical books even though they reflect Jewish thought during the Second Temple period, and because you personally reject the supernatural interpretation of Genesis 6:4.
And by the way, בְּנֵ֤י הָֽאֱלֹהִים֙ in Genesis 6:4 is not 'sons of the nobles' as you claimed in post #72 and as the Complete Jewish Bible (chabad.org) translates it because of translator bias. בְּנֵ֤י הָֽאֱלֹהִים֙ means sons of God and is correctly translated as such in other Tanakh translations into English. For example;
The Jewish Virtual Library
Genesis 6:4 The Nephilim were in the earth in those days, and also after that, when the sons of G-d came in unto the daughters of men, and they bore children to them; the same were the mighty men that were of old, the men of renown. https://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org...esis-chapter-6
As a matter of fact, the Complete Jewish Bible (chabad.org) which translates בְּנֵ֣י הָֽאֱלֹהִ֔ים in Genesis 6:4 as 'sons of the nobles' translates the same phrase as 'the angels of God' in Job 2:1. Again, the reason they translate Genesis 6:4 that way is because of translator bias.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Richard1965
Well, you don’t have a clue either, your bias is showing...
''All early sources refer to the "sons of heaven" as angels. From the third century BCE onwards, references are found in the Enochic literature, the Dead Sea Scrolls (the Genesis Apocryphon, the Damascus Document, 4Q180), Jubilees, the Testament of Reuben, 2 Baruch, Josephus, and the book of Jude (compare with 2 Peter 2). For example: 1 Enoch 7:2 "And when the angels, (3) the sons of heaven, beheld them, they became enamoured of them, saying to each other, Come, let us select for ourselves wives from the progeny of men, and let us beget children." Some Christian apologists, such as Tertullian and especially Lactantius, shared this opinion.
The earliest statement in a secondary commentary explicitly interpreting this to mean that angelic beings mated with humans can be traced to the rabbinical Targum Pseudo-Jonathan and it has since become especially commonplace in modern Christian commentaries. This line of interpretation finds additional support in the text of Genesis 6:4, which juxtaposes the sons of God (male gender, divine nature) with the daughters of men (female gender, human nature). From this parallelism it could be inferred that the sons of God are understood as some superhuman beings.[²⁴]''
24 Kosior, Wojciech (2010). "Synowie bogów i córki człowieka. Kosmiczny "mezalians" i jego efekty w Księdze Rodzaju 6:1–6". Ex Nihilo. Periodyk Młodych Religioznawców (in Polish). 1 (3) 2010: 73–74. English version of the paper (translated by Daniel Kalinowski) is available at: https://web.archive.org/web/20160205...-genesis-61-6/. [/indent]
Here is Targum Jonathan on Genesis (a Targum is an ancient Aramaic paraphrase or interpretation of the Hebrew Bible) which holds the supernatural interpretation of Genesis 6:4---that is, that the sons of God were angels and that they took human wives who bore them sons.
Targum Jonathan on Genesis 6
And it was when the sons of men began to multiply upon the face of the earth, and fair daughters were born to them; and the sons of the great saw that the daughters of men were beautiful, and painted, and curled, walking with revelation of the flesh, and with imaginations of wickedness; that they took them wives of all who pleased them. Schamchazai and Uzziel, who fell from heaven, were on the earth in those days; and also, after the sons of the Great had gone in with the daughters of men, they bare to them: and these are they who are called men who are of the world, men of names.
''All early sources refer to the "sons of heaven" as angels. From the third century BCE onwards, references are found in the Enochic literature, the Dead Sea Scrolls (the Genesis Apocryphon, the Damascus Document, 4Q180), Jubilees, the Testament of Reuben, 2 Baruch, Josephus, and the book of Jude (compare with 2 Peter 2). For example: 1 Enoch 7:2 "And when the angels, (3) the sons of heaven, beheld them, they became enamoured of them, saying to each other, Come, let us select for ourselves wives from the progeny of men, and let us beget children." Some Christian apologists, such as Tertullian and especially Lactantius, shared this opinion.
The earliest statement in a secondary commentary explicitly interpreting this to mean that angelic beings mated with humans can be traced to the rabbinical Targum Pseudo-Jonathan and it has since become especially commonplace in modern Christian commentaries. This line of interpretation finds additional support in the text of Genesis 6:4, which juxtaposes the sons of God (male gender, divine nature) with the daughters of men (female gender, human nature). From this parallelism it could be inferred that the sons of God are understood as some superhuman beings.[²⁴]''
24 Kosior, Wojciech (2010). "Synowie bogów i córki człowieka. Kosmiczny "mezalians" i jego efekty w Księdze Rodzaju 6:1–6". Ex Nihilo. Periodyk Młodych Religioznawców (in Polish). 1 (3) 2010: 73–74. English version of the paper (translated by Daniel Kalinowski) is available at: https://web.archive.org/web/20160205...-genesis-61-6/. [/indent]
Here is Targum Jonathan on Genesis (a Targum is an ancient Aramaic paraphrase or interpretation of the Hebrew Bible) which holds the supernatural interpretation of Genesis 6:4---that is, that the sons of God were angels and that they took human wives who bore them sons.
Targum Jonathan on Genesis 6
And it was when the sons of men began to multiply upon the face of the earth, and fair daughters were born to them; and the sons of the great saw that the daughters of men were beautiful, and painted, and curled, walking with revelation of the flesh, and with imaginations of wickedness; that they took them wives of all who pleased them. Schamchazai and Uzziel, who fell from heaven, were on the earth in those days; and also, after the sons of the Great had gone in with the daughters of men, they bare to them: and these are they who are called men who are of the world, men of names.
Boy, does your reading comprehension have a lot to be desired...
The evidence which has been presented is against you. And comments such as the one you made here simply show that you lack the maturity and integrity to acknowledge it. It's a waste of time even bothering with you.
The evidence which has been presented is against you. And comments such as the one you made here simply show that you lack the maturity and integrity to acknowledge it. It's a waste of time even bothering with you.
Lol...Not by a long shot, according to our Rabbis, they weren’t fallen angels as Christians believe, they didn’t rebel against G-d...It’s a waste of time bothering with YOU, because you can’t even have a discussion, you just want to preach at people in an extremely pedantic manner...And the fact that you keep shleping up other peoples work that is not your own is very telling...
Lol...Not by a long shot, according to our Rabbis, they weren’t fallen angels as Christians believe, they didn’t rebel against G-d...It’s a waste of time bothering with YOU, because you can’t even have a discussion, you just want to preach at people in an extremely pedantic manner...And the fact that you keep shleping up other peoples work that is not your own is very telling...
Again, the original Jewish sources, as has been shown, understand Genesis 6:1-4 as referring to the sons of God as angels. And I have been discussing this. You refuse to accept the evidence from the Jewish sources which have been presented and simply go 'nuh uh.' But no matter how you deny it, the original Jewish sources do hold to the supernatural view of Genesis 6:4. Period! People who can be more objective than you can read what's been posted and understand this. As for you, you can just keep going 'nuh uh.' Done.
Apparently, people look to the Nephilim as something supernatural? However, it merely relates to the fallen one's; those who have fallen. Who also were great warriors born into, and from conflict.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Meerkat2
Hmmmm
The Christian “sects” appear to resemble what the nephilim represent - they Are gigantic and supernatural
Rev 2:5 Remember therefore from whence thou art fallen, and repent, and do the first works; or else I will come unto thee quickly, and will remove thy candlestick out of his place, except thou repent.
Rev 18:2 And he cried mightily with a strong voice, saying, Babylon the great is fallen, is fallen, and is become the habitation of devils, and the hold of every foul spirit, and a cage of every unclean and hateful bird.
Rev 18:3 For all nations have drunk of the wine of the wrath of her fornication, and the kings of the earth have committed fornication with her, and the merchants of the earth are waxed rich through the abundance of her delicacies.
Rev 18:4 And I heard another voice from heaven, saying, Come out of her, my people, that ye be not partakers of her sins, and that ye receive not of her plagues.
Rev 18:5 For her sins have reached unto heaven, and God hath remembered her iniquities.
Yep.
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