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Human, Anthropos, is a complex construction, some parts belong to material world some parts belong to spiritual world, some mortal some not. What is a point to keep immortal part in a grave? God said to Earth let us create human being and it is mortal material body containing immortal spirit of God - Gen 1. Ecc. 12:7 illustrates that nicely.
I'm not sure why some are falling over themselves to congratulate you G. Ecclesiastes 12:7 states nothing that I haven't already addressed and acknowledged:
Ecclesiastes 12:7 - before the dust returns to the ground from which it came and the spirit returns to God who gave it. and the dust returns to the ground it came from, and the spirit returns to God who gave it.
It's 'simply' a reversal of creation, i.e. the human form created from dust and being given the breath of life by God while, at death, the once living soul returning to the dust and the breath of life returning to God.
If we're giving credibility to the first example then we probably need to extend that credibility to the later example. To my mortal mind I can't get my head around it. However, those who penned scripture tell us that the immortal spirit to which you refer will be reunited with its previous owner on resurrection day and not before. Why is this biblical teaching even in dispute? I'm even making enemies here simply by my siding with scripture rather than my siding with the made-up stuff.
I'm not sure why some are falling over themselves to congratulate you G. Ecclesiastes 12:7 states nothing that I haven't already addressed and acknowledged:
Ecclesiastes 12:7 - before the dust returns to the ground from which it came and the spirit returns to God who gave it. and the dust returns to the ground it came from, and the spirit returns to God who gave it.
It's 'simply' a reversal of creation, i.e. the human form created from dust and being given the breath of life by God while, at death, the once living soul returning to the dust and the breath of life returning to God.
If we're giving credibility to the first example then we probably need to extend that credibility to the later example. To my mortal mind I can't get my head around it. However, those who penned scripture tell us that the immortal spirit to which you refer will be reunited with its previous owner on resurrection day and not before. Why is this biblical teaching even in dispute? I'm even making enemies here simply by my siding with scripture rather than my siding with the made-up stuff.
You're not siding with Scripture. You don't even understand it. And with your arrogance you never will.
spirit: pneuma: wind, spirit
Original Word: πνεῦμα, ατος, τό
Part of Speech: Noun, Neuter
Transliteration: pneuma
Phonetic Spelling: (pnyoo'-mah)
Definition: wind, spirit
Usage: wind, breath, spirit.
HELPS Word-studies
4151 pneúma – properly, spirit (Spirit), wind, or breath. The most frequent meaning (translation) of 4151 (pneúma) in the NT is "spirit" ("Spirit"). Only the context however determines which sense(s) is meant.
[Any of the above renderings (spirit-Spirit, wind, breath) of 4151 (pneúma) is always theoretically possible (spirit, Spirit, wind, breath). But when the attributive adjective ("holy") is used, it always refers to the Holy Spirit. "Spirit" ("spirit") is by far the most common translation (application) of 4151 (pneúma).
The Hebrew counterpart (rûach) has the same range of meaning as 4151 (pneúma), i.e. it likewise can refer to spirit/Spirit, wind, or breath.]
The usage of the word 'spirit' in the above examples of your post, Kat, have nothing to do with the subject matter and using them in an attempt to contradict the consistency of what the Bible has to say about the state of the dead is unreasonable.
We today use terms such as someone being low in spirit when sad or showing spirit when make a strong stand for something. Using the term 'spirit' or 'spirited' in that respect doesn't refer to 'breath' either.
Perhaps I have tunnel vision, Michael. Or, perhaps you do. Whatever ...how about you calm down and stick with scripture just as I'm attempting to do?
It's becoming quite clear as to why so many wars have been caused over religion.
I did stick to the scripture. And you're ignoring it because it refutes you. Post 85 is there for all to see and read. And yes, you do have tunnel vision on the matter.
I'm not sure why some are falling over themselves to congratulate you G. Ecclesiastes 12:7 states nothing that I haven't already addressed and acknowledged:
Ecclesiastes 12:7 - before the dust returns to the ground from which it came and the spirit returns to God who gave it. and the dust returns to the ground it came from, and the spirit returns to God who gave it.
It's 'simply' a reversal of creation, i.e. the human form created from dust and being given the breath of life by God while, at death, the once living soul returning to the dust and the breath of life returning to God.
If we're giving credibility to the first example then we probably need to extend that credibility to the later example. To my mortal mind I can't get my head around it. However, those who penned scripture tell us that the immortal spirit to which you refer will be reunited with its previous owner on resurrection day and not before. Why is this biblical teaching even in dispute? I'm even making enemies here simply by my siding with scripture rather than my siding with the made-up stuff.
'mortal mind' it is part of amnesia of humanity, but it is not final, 'spirit and truth. is given as the way out of that situation.
I side with notion that sheol =hades =afterlife, that my understanding of death.
this , from Bullinger, helped me years ago: https://levendwater.org/companion/append139.html
God is very rational.
My wife attends Adv. church for years, she is not Adventist and just agreed to disagree...
This matter has got nothing to do with one's denomination or as to whether one agrees or disagrees. Are the conclusions that we are coming to biblical? If they are then we agree to accept the Bible definition of the state of the dead regardless of the denomination that we belong to. However, that's not the way it works for most. One's loyalty to one's beloved church/denomination and the doctrines held by that beloved denomination are very powerful incentives to ignore or to reject any beliefs of 'outsiders' if they appear to be in conflict with those doctrines ...even if those outsider beliefs just might align with scripture. It's simple psychology. Just pretend they're not there. Even more than that. Most Christians - and possibly most people generally - believe that their beloved dead are presently in Heaven. That's also powerful. No one should attempt to shatter such a comforting belief. And, if they do ...then woe betide! By the way, you (a general 'you') will notice that no one's beloved dead are EVER in hell! That's especially odd because most of these very same people really DO believe in hell.
I've attempted to make a case for what I believe the scriptures to say about the state of the dead - in response to the thread title! - by actually presenting a few of many scriptures that back it up. However, if you check the posts of others, it's as though these scriptures don't exist. Has anyone actually attempted to offer a counter explanation for these scriptures that refer to death as sleep? Nope. All I've managed to do is to have created an atmosphere of hostility or, at best, mistrust toward me. Not that I can't handle that. I'm just stating a fact. I'm my own man.
As I've questioned before ...does it even matter if the dead are resting in their graves until resurrection day or presently in heaven practicing their harp ...or, um, in hell shoveling coal to keep the eternal fire burning? Debating the topic does seem rather pointless. However, someone DID ask the question. And so, I contend that if one must have a belief in something then it might be a sound idea to base it on truth. I personally don't know for certain that ANY of the Bible is true. But, for the sake of argument I'm counting on at least some of the major parts of the Bible to be so.
I like the way that Michael Heiser answers that question in the 5 minute video below. I personally think of heaven as being interdimensional rather than spacially distant from our physical realm. That is, heaven could be occupying the same space as we are but on a different plane of existence. If God were to raise the curtain so to speak we could see that spiritual realm.
Where do we go when we die? The Afterlife by Dr Michael Heiser
It is on a different plane, but it's all work, heaven is not a box where people go when they die, they are each appointed a job depending on their progress, and that is why so few people make it to the the Zoe kingdom Jesus always spoke of where no liars may tread. I sure dont expect to make it there.
They are high priests knowing the secrets of Torah, high priests of God's religion, "Judaism."
God's religion is not called by a different name, and the people who follow God alone, they are not joined by any others because God only has one religion, one people, not two people.
When you die, if you have not become a high priest, there are yet two other outcomes, two other kingdoms as relayed in Hebrews 8 that temple design is merely showing us what the after life is 3 different sections,3 outcomes.
.... and of course we ALL know those 144k are all Jehovah witnesses. Where do I sign up?
Not everyone 7, it seems that few here know it, even though it is common sense. Why would God select someone who chooses not to worship Him to reign over the earth? Of course no one ever answers that when I ask.
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.... and of course we ALL know those 144k are all Jehovah witnesses. Where do I sign up? 
