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Nope. If it was true, it wouldn't. It would just make you arrogant and condescending.
But it's not true. So that just leave you as arrogant and condescending, as well as wrong. But I guess personal insults and boasting are the fruits of that "agape love" you always brag about.
Nope. If it was true, it wouldn't. It would just make you arrogant and condescending.
But it's not true. So that just leave you as arrogant and condescending, as well as wrong. But I guess personal insults and boasting are the fruits of that "agape love" you always brag about.
My statement did not refer to any specific person. You are the one who turned it into a PERSONAL insult by turning your judgment of it on me.
The problem with this view is that it seems to me you're presuming that to be angry or to punish are inherently bad things.
I just can't agree with your premise. It is right and good to be angry at injustices. It is right and good to punish evil if one is in a legitimate position to do so, and if the punishment would ultimately result in the betterment of the one being punished.
Anger is a human psychological weakness born of our human impotence against injustice and evil. God is neither weak nor impotent against evil so He has no anger. That does not mean He has no desire to balance the scales of Justice using His perfect justice, NOT our imperfect human justice.
First of all - there is no Spirit (capital "S") rebirth - as the Holy Spirit as never been dead.
Second - How do you know I can't relate to a spiritual rebirth? Did you ask me - or is your head so stuck in your own pride and platitudes that you just hear yourself - and everyone else is like Charlie Brown's teacher? You can't even hear Christ - because if you did, He would tell you that He was physically resurrected from death. Ultimately - Christ has to equip you to hear Him. I guess it hasn't happened to this point.
Third - your rendition of a Bad News Gospel is a lie... a strawman. It is your lack of understanding of who God is - and your lack of acceptance of how God has revealed Himself that fuels you to come up with a god, or an idol, fashioned into something that you like and you can control... which in the end makes you, your own god - and with respect to that, you are correct in saying that I can't relate.
First, you do not realize that you are a Spirit growing and developing in a physical body. Second, I did much better than hear Christ. I met His consciousness directly in deep meditation. How do I know it was His. Because of the descriptions of Him in the Bible. I have no doubt whatsoever. Third, what is it with you fundies. Do you all have reading difficulties or do you just deliberately NOT read or even try to understand what I write?
I do NOT USE MY OWN ANYTHING! I use the God revealed and unambiguously demonstrated by the "mind of Christ" on the Cross as the exemplar of the "mind of God." HE is my standard of Truth, period, NOT my own ideas or likes or dislikes. His revelation of God's True Nature was UNAMBIGUOUS under those circumstances!!!
Jesus was angry at the money changers in the temple. He was so angry that he inflicted duly deserved violence upon them.
If a mere human was doing that, your interpretation of it as the result of anger would be likely. But since it was Jesus who didn't even get angry at His scourging and crucifixion, it cannot be anger, just correction. He was forcefully intervening and stopping what He saw as a desecration of the temple and the people coming to worship God.
There are spiritual consequences based on what we have become, but they are not imposed by God's non-existent wrath. I am more worried about what you have become than me. I really doubt God actually wants parrots.
Anger is a human psychological weakness born of our human impotence against injustice and evil. God is neither weak nor impotent against evil so He has no anger. That does not mean He has no desire to balance the scales of Justice using His perfect justice, NOT our imperfect human justice.
These are all your views of how God should be in your own perfect world but scripture says otherwise and Jesus upheld the law and the prophets which you do not. So as far as you being a believer and follower of Jesus it just does not compute. You have no insight because you reject His word.
“Whoever hears my word and does not keep it I am not the one to condemn him for I did not come to condemn the world but to save it. Anyone who rejects me and does not accept my word he already has his judge, namely the words I’ve spoken that’s what will condemn him on the last day.â€
The problem with this view is that it seems to me you're presuming that to be angry or to punish are inherently bad things.
I just can't agree with your premise. It is right and good to be angry at injustices. It is right and good to punish evil if one is in a legitimate position to do so, and if the punishment would ultimately result in the betterment of the one being punished.
I agree
The wrath spoken of is against all unrighteousness
There is no excusing it
Rom 1:18**For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who hold the truth in unrighteousness;
Rom 1:19**Because that which may be known of God is manifest in them; for God hath shewed it unto them.
Rom 1:20**For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse:
Rom 1:21**Because that, when they knew God, they glorified him not as God, neither were thankful; but became vain in their imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened.
Rom 1:22**Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools,
Rom 1:23**And changed the glory of the uncorruptible God into an image made like to corruptible man, and to birds, and fourfooted beasts, and creeping things.
Rom 1:24**Wherefore God also gave them up to uncleanness through the lusts of their own hearts, to dishonour their own bodies between themselves:
Rom 1:25**Who changed the truth of God into a lie, and worshipped and served the creature more than the Creator, who is blessed for ever. Amen.
The wrath spoken of is against all unrighteousness
There is no excusing it
Rom 1:18**For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who hold the truth in unrighteousness;
Rom 1:19**Because that which may be known of God is manifest in them; for God hath shewed it unto them.
Rom 1:20**For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse:
Rom 1:21**Because that, when they knew God, they glorified him not as God, neither were thankful; but became vain in their imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened.
Rom 1:22**Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools,
Rom 1:23**And changed the glory of the uncorruptible God into an image made like to corruptible man, and to birds, and fourfooted beasts, and creeping things.
Rom 1:24**Wherefore God also gave them up to uncleanness through the lusts of their own hearts, to dishonour their own bodies between themselves:
Rom 1:25**Who changed the truth of God into a lie, and worshipped and served the creature more than the Creator, who is blessed forever. Amen.
You do not understand what I am saying because you are locked into the human acceptance of anger and punishment as appropriate. The feelings of injustice and unrighteousness that provoke human anger are legitimate. The anger is NOT because it seeks punishment or vengeance to assuage the injustice. Our human justice is imperfect because as humans, we are impotent to actually correct its negative effects which evoke our anger and we demand punishment.
God is NOT so limited, He just will take care of it in the next life and balance the scales for ALL involved. No need for anger. His ways are not our ways. There is NO wrath in God, just negative spiritual consequences for what we have done and become, period. Our human penchant for anger and vengeance is why we were told to leave any thoughts of vengeance to God.
You do not understand what I am saying because you are locked into the human acceptance of anger and punishment as appropriate. The feelings of injustice and unrighteousness that provoke human anger are legitimate. The anger is NOT because it seeks punishment or vengeance to assuage the injustice. Our human justice is imperfect because as humans, we are impotent to actually correct its negative effects which evoke our anger and we demand punishment.
God is NOT so limited, He just will take care of it in the next life and balance the scales for ALL involved. No need for anger. His ways are not our ways. There is NO wrath in God, just negative spiritual consequences for what we have done and become, period. Our human penchant for anger and vengeance is why we were told to leave any thoughts of vengeance to God.
In my post I am only agreeing with what mike had said in his post....I was not addressing your post at all
I believe we should be addressing things relationally ie, the human things with human things.... and step by step
And not mixing/comparing earthly things Indiscriminately with the divine/spiritual/symbolic things
John 3:12
Joh 3:11**Verily, verily, I say unto thee, We speak that we do know, and testify that we have seen; and ye receive not our witness.
Joh 3:12**If I have told you earthly things, and ye believe not, how shall ye believe, if I tell you of heavenly things?
Joh 3:13**And no man hath ascended up to heaven, but he that came down from heaven, even the Son of man which is in heaven.
Joh 3:14**And as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, even so must the Son of man be lifted up:
Joh 3:15**That whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have eternal life.
Different books of the bible have a different perspective
John is not the same as Paul, or Peter, or James but they are all witnesses of the same kingdom
Last edited by Meerkat2; 08-10-2021 at 07:48 PM..
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