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True. We may call ourselves whatever we'd like but each of us is individually responsible for our conduct.
I'm a JW with kids. I'm not alone when I say there is enormous sympathy for any child anywhere that has been abused. I hope that each one finds the peace that they seek and the justice that they deserve.
The accusation that our organization covers up sexual abuse is not true. For example, the Royal Commission in Australia were provided 1,006 case files by JWs. Of those, 383 had been reported to the police at the time they had happened which resulted in 161 convictions. Obviously, cases were brought to justice and those regarded as credible resulted in convictions.
The two witness rule is ONLY for ecclesiastical purposes. It does NOT extend in any way how a JW should interact with secular authorities. Sexual abuse is a violation not only of secular laws but God's laws. Secular authorities establish the culpability of the accused in relation to whatever laws of the land exist and not religious authorities. No one would expect the justice system to also establish how the accused has violated God's laws. Otherwise, we become a theocratic state like Saudi Arabia, Iran and now add Afghanistan to the list. On the other hand, there are religious organizations who don't hold their members accountable. There are also organizations who expel a person based on hearsay. I would think that an organization that considers itself Christian and views the Bible as a book of faith would attempt to apply Bible principles in how they arrive at ecclesiastical decisions. It's not a perfect world and things don't always come out perfect but that doesn't mean application shouldn't be made as best as can be made.
I might add I was born and raised a Catholic and it's no secret there are those who just seek to smear one's faith. It's not to say that there isn't truth in what some post. It doesn't mean organizations can't make improvements on serious issues like this. But, you can expect truth/facts to be twisted by some.
Yes sir 4, we are all responsible for our actions, while many who post here believe they can do what they want, I believe that we should live the teachings of the Bible. Imagine people telling me that God is wrong in His requirements, and thinking they are righteous in doing so Jn 16:2
I don't particularly like our organization stepping out of the two witness rule. At any rate I would not do so. I would never ever report anyone, even you, but definitely not a brother of whom I had no personal knowledge about the situation. Once again, we observe God's word not opinionated persons such as yourself. Fact is sir, God's people do not molest children, of course that does not prevent us from being infiltrated by non-Christians who pose as one of us.
How many times are you going to repeatedly bring this up? As I told your co-hort, the Catholic faith does not teach that to be an acceptable practice, that is simply the truth that you two will have to get ahold of. I seriously doubt that the faiths that you two belong to allow it either.
If you become aware of a crime (in this case that would be sexual abuse of a minor) and fail to report it to the police, you are as evil as the perpetrator of the crime, and you may be liable for criminal prosecution yourself. Sometime it is called being an accessory after the fact, and sometimes it is called aiding and abetting a criminal enterprise.
The two witness rule does not apply to criminal activity. Period. Leave it to the prosecutor to decide what witnesses are required.
If you become aware of a crime (in this case that would be sexual abuse of a minor) and fail to report it to the police, you are as evil as the perpetrator of the crime, and you may be liable for criminal prosecution yourself. Sometime it is called being an accessory after the fact, and sometimes it is called aiding and abetting a criminal enterprise.
The two witness rule does not apply to criminal activity. Period. Leave it to the prosecutor to decide what witnesses are required.
If you become aware of a crime (in this case that would be sexual abuse of a minor) and fail to report it to the police, you are as evil as the perpetrator of the crime, and you may be liable for criminal prosecution yourself. Sometime it is called being an accessory after the fact, and sometimes it is called aiding and abetting a criminal enterprise.
The two witness rule does not apply to criminal activity. Period. Leave it to the prosecutor to decide what witnesses are required.
If you become aware of a crime (in this case that would be sexual abuse of a minor) and fail to report it to the police, you are as evil as the perpetrator of the crime, and you may be liable for criminal prosecution yourself. Sometime it is called being an accessory after the fact, and sometimes it is called aiding and abetting a criminal enterprise.
The two witness rule does not apply to criminal activity. Period. Leave it to the prosecutor to decide what witnesses are required.
Quote:
Originally Posted by MinivanDriver
Yep. Sin of omission.
You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to mensaguy again.
Let me just say that from a particular Law Firm in California (2018-19) that the: "Watchtower has abused the discovery process. It has zealously advocated its position and lost multiple times. Yet, it cavalierly refuses to acknowledge the consequences of these losses and the validity of the court’s orders..."
And that the U.S. Supreme Court Rejects Appeal by Jehovah’s Witnesses of 2015 California Trial Court Order...
In other words, the Organization continued its failed tactics (appeal) that it redundantly attempted to use in order for its non-disclosure stance. Whether or not the fines continue(d) is unknown to me, and irrelevant to the fact that they disobeyed court orders to produce the documents; and were fined to the tune of millions of dollars in protecting pedophiles.
In addition, $4,016,152.39 plus interest at 10% per year after terminating Watchtower’s defense, (was awarded to this person) because it refused to obey the Court’s order to produce files of known child molesters within the Jehovah Witness Organization.
yup, 4 million a year is chump change to an org that rakes in billions per year, and operates under complete financial opaqueness - no transparency at all .
Furthermore, the 'mothership' has been Very busy since that 2015 order, aggregating $Finances & $ownership away from the local kingdom halls, therefore $sheltering & $squirreling away $assets that would be subject to (local) judgements on guilty individuals in court cases, once the light of truth comes out.
That's why they're happy to shell out 4millions a year - buys them time to get their $Ducks in a row,
to the tune of hundreds of millions, perhaps even billions! Nobody really knows just how much$$.
- evidence presented here (watch past the first 1:37min intro):
It is true there will be evil men(women) who masquerade as Christians.
What is of interest is the approach taken with respect to JWs. JWs don't operate Sunday schools, youth camps, daycare, parochial schools. There is no paid clergy even the "elders" and "ministerial servants" are unpaid volunteers. The abuse didn't happen at places of worship. places operated by JWs. They happened outside of the organization. Yet what occurred outside the organization is now used to label an organization as having institutionalized child abuse. Also, unlike other religious organizations JWs ecclesiastical approach to discipline members was scrutinized as if the ecclesiastical approach by other religious organizations was above reproach.
The organization is labeled evil because some of it's members engaged in wicked actions. It's labeled evil because it's ecclesiastical approach to discipline members does not suit what others believe is appropriate.
The problem of child abuse is real. What is also real is tabloid reporting, profiteering, and anti JW/anti religious sentiment.
Did you notice the information you put forth was framed to look as if the Jehovah's Witnesses had given those names to the authorities and the opposite turned out to be true? I may be mistaken but someone said over 500 of those 1006 had confessed and nothing was done to protect children. The Watchtower never let anyone know.nAt most, they got disfellowshipped. I don't think you knew that when you posted it. I think you believed it to be true at the time. I just want to say this to you: do not lay down your life or allow another family member to do so over the blood doctrine. Do not shun your children if they decide to leave.
Yes sir 4, we are all responsible for our actions, while many who post here believe they can do what they want, I believe that we should live the teachings of the Bible. Imagine people telling me that God is wrong in His requirements, and thinking they are righteous in doing so Jn 16:2
I can imagine that you have already been told things in error from Your Preferred Organization.
OMG - I couldn't even watch beyond the first 5 minutes:
- "we should be obedient and submissive, even if what the elders are asking us to do is not the best..." 1:59
- "being obedient and submissive to those taking the lead, is much more important, then how..." 3:52
that just grosses me out.
That looks like total perp grooming right there!
I'm really sad for the individuals and families that mixed up with this organization!
Really breaks my heart!
Thank the Lord my children were instead taught about a well-formed conscience: "Man has the right to act in conscience and in freedom so as personally to make moral decisions. "He must not be forced to act contrary to his conscience. Nor must he be prevented from acting according to his conscience, especially in religious matters." (1782 of the Catholic catechism).
Last edited by CCCyou; 10-04-2021 at 04:39 PM..
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Nobody really knows just how much$$.
1:59
3:52
