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If Adam and Eve didn't know good from evil, how could it be a sin when they disobeyed? They were ignorant of it and God's plan all along was for the fall. Earth is a stage for the spirit, it needs an adversary and trials and tribulations because there is none in Heaven.
As we can know Adam and Eve DID know good from evil - Genesis 2:17
God forewarned so that they (us) can be forearmed as to why Not break the law of Gen. 2:17
All Adam had to do was to step on a bug and see what death is.
The offer of Everlasting life on Earth was Not a stepping stone to anywhere else.
Adam was Not meant to turn into a spirit angel, but remain forever here on a beautiful paradisical Earth.
Yes, No forbidden tree account for the angels. Heaven is the stage/home for spirit angels.
And we ask God that His will be done right here on Earth as it is done in Heaven.
In Heaven there is No pollution, No crime, No violence, No war, No sickness and No death in Heaven.
So, we are asking God for those same good-and-healthy heavenly conditions to come and exist on Earth.
Thus, God's purpose after the fall was to restore righteous humanity to the same conditions Adam and Eve originally had.
That is what the first prophecy of Gen. 3:15 is all about.
Jesus as Messiah will undo all the damage Satan and Adam brought upon humanity. - 1st. Corinthians 15:24-26
Free will was God’s design, as that was the only way LOVE was possible, that is from us to Him.
Good point ^above^ about LOVE. They can show their love for God by avoiding eating from the forbidden tree.
Kind of like if we had a very generous neighbor who had lots of fruit trees and told us we can come over any time we want and have as much fruit as we want just don't touch his one tree in the middle of the yard.
We can show our love and respect and appreciation for our generous neighbor by leaving his one tree alone.
If Adam and Eve didn't know good from evil, how could it be a sin when they disobeyed? They were ignorant of it and God's plan all along was for the fall. Earth is a stage for the spirit, it needs an adversary and trials and tribulations because there is none in Heaven.
Its true they didn't know good and evil. What they did know was what God told them. So the sin was in the disobedience of what God told them. For argument's sake, Adam and Eve could have committed any evil they wanted to do. They could have mistreated the animals, could have beat each other, so on and so forth, and their nature wouldn't have fell. It was only in the command to not eat, would they have rebelled against God.
And if this wasn't so, one has to wonder why did it take the serpent's temptation to convince them to eat? If they truly had no problem whatsoever about eating the fruit (Or had no understanding of it being wrong), they would have done it before the serpent's suggestion. Yet absent the serpent, they didn't eat from that tree.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ShanaBrown
1 Peter 1:19-20
19 but with precious blood, as of a lamb unblemished and unspotted -- Christ's --
20 foreknown, indeed, before the foundation of the world, and manifested in the last times because of you,
Jesus was slain in the plan of God from the foundation or before the foundation of the world. Either way, Jesus was slain before Adam sinned. All were created through Jesus Christ, the Word of God, and in Him all things consist. Believers were chosen in Him before the foundation of the world, to be holy and blameless before Him. God designed a group of people to be saved first, to be the firstfruits.
Ephesians 1
1 Paul, an apostle of Christ Jesus [a]by the will of God,
To the [b]saints who are [c]at Ephesus and are faithful in Christ Jesus: 2 Grace to you and peace from God our Father and the Lord Jesus Christ. Believers have been predestined to adoption as sons and daughters t through Jesus Christ to Himself. Believers have redemption in His blood, the forgiveness of sins, and have been made known the mystery of His will. Believers heard the message and believed.
Ephesians 1
3 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who has blessed us with every spiritual blessing in the heavenly places in Christ, 4 just as He chose us in Him before the foundation of the world, that we would be holy and blameless before [d]Him. In love 5 [e]He predestined us to adoption as sons and daughters through Jesus Christ to Himself, according to the good pleasure of His will, 6 to the praise of the glory of His grace, with which He favored us in the Beloved. 7 In [f]Him we have redemption through His blood, the forgiveness of our wrongdoings, according to the riches of His grace 8 which He [g]lavished on [h]us. In all wisdom and insight 9 He [i]made known to us the mystery of His will, according to His good pleasure which He set forth in Him, 10 regarding His plan of the fullness of the times, to bring all things together in Christ, things [j]in the heavens and things on the earth. 11 [k]In Him we also have obtained an inheritance, having been predestined according to the purpose of Him who works all things in accordance with the plan of His will, 12 to the end that [l]we who were the first to hope in the [m]Christ would be to the praise of His glory. 13 In [n]Him, [o]you also, after listening to the message of truth, the gospel of your salvation—having also [p]believed, you were sealed in [q]Him with the Holy Spirit of the promise, 14 who is a first installment of our inheritance, in regard to the redemption of God’s own possession, to the praise of His glory.
15 For this reason I too, having heard of the faith in the Lord Jesus which exists among you and [r]your love for all the [s]saints, 16 do not cease giving thanks for you, while making mention of you in my prayers; 17 that the God of our Lord Jesus Christ, the Father of glory, may give you a spirit of wisdom and of revelation in the [t]knowledge of Him. 18 I pray that the eyes of your heart [u]may be enlightened, so that you will know what is the hope of His calling, what are the riches of the glory of His inheritance in the [v]saints, 19 and what is the [w]boundless greatness of His power toward us who believe. These are in accordance with the working of the strength of His might 20 which He brought about in Christ, when He raised Him from the dead and seated Him at His right hand in the heavenly places, 21 far above all rule and authority and power and dominion, and every name that is named, not only in this age but also in the one to come. 22 And He put all things in subjection under His feet, and made Him head over all things to the church, 23 which is His body, the fullness of Him who fills all in all.
Before the foundation of the world, the lamb was slain in the plan of God and a body of persons, called believers, the elect, the saints, were chosen to be God's adopted sons and daughters. All of this was in the plan of God in the beginning before the foundation of the world. And in the end, the creation will be changed and restored just believers have been. Romans 8.
8 I consider that our present sufferings are not worth comparing with the glory that will be revealed in us. 19 For the creation waits in eager expectation for the children of God to be revealed. 20 For the creation was subjected to frustration, not by its own choice, but by the will of the one who subjected it, in **hope 21 that[h] the creation itself will be liberated from its bondage to decay and brought into the freedom and glory of the children of God.
All in the grand design of God who knows all things. God bless.
The versage in 1 Peter is interesting. As I understand it, its saying Jesus Himself was foreknown before the foundation of the world. This is not to say God didn't know us before creation, because after all He is our creator. 1 Peter does mention the blood here, but I'm not seeing in the translation that this equates to Jesus being slain before the foundation of the world, but that Jesus was known before the foundation. (And His blood being what we are redeemed with. Or in other words, this Person, Jesus, who was foreknown, is who we are redeemed with.)
And with what Paul states, I believe it falls in line with what he states concerning everything being created through Jesus in 1 Corinthians 8:6. Of course this is just my current understanding. If Jesus was the Lamb slain before the foundation, why doesn't Revelation 13:8 state it? Most people probably wouldn't think about these things in these terms. Most would simply read Revelation 13:8's "from the foundation" as though it were "before". And I would read it that way to, if not for the verses that mention "before the foundation". I'm led to believe there is a difference.
Its true they didn't know good and evil. What they did know was what God told them. So the sin was in the disobedience of what God told them. For argument's sake, Adam and Eve could have committed any evil they wanted to do. They could have mistreated the animals, could have beat each other, so on and so forth, and their nature wouldn't have fell. It was only in the command to not eat, would they have rebelled against God.
And if this wasn't so, one has to wonder why did it take the serpent's temptation to convince them to eat? If they truly had no problem whatsoever about eating the fruit (Or had no understanding of it being wrong), they would have done it before the serpent's suggestion. Yet absent the serpent, they didn't eat from that tree.
The versage in 1 Peter is interesting. As I understand it, its saying Jesus Himself was foreknown before the foundation of the world. This is not to say God didn't know us before creation, because after all He is our creator. 1 Peter does mention the blood here, but I'm not seeing in the translation that this equates to Jesus being slain before the foundation of the world, but that Jesus was known before the foundation. (And His blood being what we are redeemed with. Or in other words, this Person, Jesus, who was foreknown, is who we are redeemed with.)
And with what Paul states, I believe it falls in line with what he states concerning everything being created through Jesus in 1 Corinthians 8:6. Of course this is just my current understanding. If Jesus was the Lamb slain before the foundation, why doesn't Revelation 13:8 state it? Most people probably wouldn't think about these things in these terms. Most would simply read Revelation 13:8's "from the foundation" as though it were "before". And I would read it that way to, if not for the verses that mention "before the foundation". I'm led to believe there is a difference.
My belief is that God knows all things before they happen and that He intended for the perfect lamb to be slain before the foundation of the world. That was in the design of God who knew what Adam would do and who created the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, as well as the serpent, everything. The verse in Revelation has been translated in many different ways, leading to different interpretations. There are also differing translations of the verse in 1 Peter. God bless.
My belief is that God knows all things before they happen and that He intended for the perfect lamb to be slain before the foundation of the world. That was in the design of God who knew what Adam would do and who created the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, as well as the serpent, everything..............
I find the 'founding of the world' is 'Not the founding of Earth' as some might think, but the 'founding of righteous mankind' according to Jesus at Matthew 23:35 starting foundation of our world is: righteous Abel.
Genesis 3:15 ( first prophecy ) is Not made until ' after ' A&E sinned.
Angelic Satan turned himself into a Satan, a Devil according to James 1:13-15
I see a key definition of the word translated as "from" as separation, departing and I want to explore that more.
On the word translated as world in the passage
kosmos: order, the world
Original Word: κόσμος, ου, ὁ
Part of Speech: Noun, Masculine
Transliteration: kosmos
Phonetic Spelling: (kos'-mos)
Definition: order, the world
Usage: the world, universe; worldly affairs; the inhabitants of the world; adornment.
HELPS Word-studies
2889 kósmos (literally, "something ordered") – properly, an "ordered system" (like the universe, creation); the world.
[The English term "cosmetic" is derived from 2889 /kósmos, i.e. the order ("ensemble") used of treating the face as a whole.]
I don't read that Jesus was lamb slain before the founding of righteous mankind, Matthew, even though He was slain before righteous men came into being. I see that this refers to the entire universe. Jesus was sent be the Savior of the world. 1 John 2:2 And he is the propitiation for our sins: and not for ours only, but also for the sins of the whole world.
I read the passage in Matthew 23 as referring to the condemnation of those who persecuted righteous individuals, namely the condemnation of the religious leaders. God bless.
Last edited by ShanaBrown; 03-03-2024 at 06:38 PM..
Lowlyservant, do you believe that God knows all things and that He knew what would happen in the garden? Why do you believe that He caused the tree of the knowledge of good and evil to grow in the garden? God bless.
I do believe that God is omniscient. I believe that the tree was put there to teach Adam and Eve obedience. They were given a choice, as we all are, and failed. A lesson that we should all learn from.
I do believe that God is omniscient. I believe that the tree was put there to teach Adam and Eve obedience. They were given a choice, as we all are, and failed. A lesson that we should all learn from.
Unfortunately, we have taken the wrong lesson from it. It was never about obedience for obedience's sake. The principle was to learn that there are things we might desire to do that we must learn to discriminate among because of the negative consequences of failing to do so, NOT so we will be obedient to God! That is the import of knowing Good and Evil, NOT obedience to God.
My belief is that God knows all things before they happen and that He intended for the perfect lamb to be slain before the foundation of the world. That was in the design of God who knew what Adam would do and who created the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, as well as the serpent, everything. The verse in Revelation has been translated in many different ways, leading to different interpretations. There are also differing translations of the verse in 1 Peter. God bless.
Unfortunately, we have taken the wrong lesson from it. It was never about obedience for obedience's sake. The principle was to learn that there are things we might desire to do that we must learn to discriminate among because of the negative consequences of failing to do so, NOT so we will be obedient to God! That is the import of knowing Good and Evil, NOT obedience to God.
I do believe that God is omniscient. I believe that the tree was put there to teach Adam and Eve obedience. They were given a choice, as we all are, and failed. A lesson that we should all learn from.
Hi I believe that they were given a choice but not a choice born entirely from their own free will. I believe that God, in knowing all things, knew what choice would be made, and had a purpose for all that has transpired as a result. I agree that that we are to learn obedience. God bless.
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