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...the verse in 2 Thes., is talking about those in the church. I don't see where it says homeless, or unbelievers.
It is true...OnOurWay2MO (interesting name!)...that those verses specifically are talking about how to deal with professing Christians who live off the generosity of others.
Good point.
However I believe that righteousness is righteousness. There is not one standard of what is right for those in the church and one for unbelievers. If a believer steals it is wrong. Just as for an unbeliever. If a believer lies...it is likewise wrong/sinful for an unbeliever to lie.
To live off the generosity of others while not having a willingness to work to meet your own needs is wrong. For both the believer and the unbeliever.
Would God have us deal with the believer so as to help them repent (by not giving them free food and money not connected to them working for it in some way) while having us become part of the problem for the panhandler by encouraging his lifestyle?
Would God have us withold food from the believer so that his hunger would drive him to repent and work for his food only to have us turn around and give to an unbeliever what he wants?
Why would God have us love the believer by helping him to repent only to help the unbeliever stay in his sin by giving him free money or food?
That doesn't make sense to me. I don't think God would have us deal differently with a believer who is living off the generosity of others OR an unbeliever. We should deal the same with both. We should help them come to a place of repentance in their life by not giving them free food and money not connected to their having to work for it.
The point of what Paul says is to help such a person repent. Do we not likewise want to help an unbeliever repent by applying the same principles that will help a believer, living a similar lifestyle, to repent? Namely using the ensuing hunger to drive them to work?
I still need to think this through a bit more but that is how I see it at this point in time.
Our church goes to the next town, it's bigger, and serves at a soup line one Friday night a month. We give to groups who help people who need it. Our church who is in the process of building is planning an emergency women's shelter down the line and a counseling center. Their focus is on serving the community.
You know what really gets to me driftwood? In the sense of making my blood boil sometimes?
And I say this...not to diminish the good your church is doing...so please don't take this personally...it's just that in reading what you said...it came to mind.
But...I don't for the life of me understand why Christians do not open their homes to the homeless instead of serving at soup kitchens and the like?
We, as Christians, isolate ourselves from the very people that need our help. There is a boundary beyond which many of us won't let them in.
We are okay volunteering to help them as long as it is at arm's length.
But we don't invite them to our homes or go hang out with them where they live, invite them out to dinner, or a movie, or even a coffee somewhere. One on one.
I've asked many Christians why not...and the main answer I get back is that...well...it's not safe to do so.
To which I say...since when did following Christ involve being safe? Keeping our possessions and valuables safe or not taking any personal risks?
If every Christian home adopted a homeless person and started doing things with them one on one...inviting them to hang out with their Christian friends...in real life...not just at the soup kitchen...imagine the impact of that! The world would get turned upside down. The world would notice such a thing. To the glory of God.
Instead we all (well most of us) go to our buildings on Sunday, hear someone tell us what the Bible says, wish each other well, go home and live sheltered lives the rest of the week. Without letting those in need, whatever that need is, affect our personal lives or pocketbooks too much, if at all.
Again driftwoodpoint...I mean nothing personal directed at you in what I said. I don't know you or all that you might be doing as a Christian. But I wanted to say what I did in so far as your brief comment brought to mind how little we, as Christians in general, are willing to risk our personal lives, money, and comfortableness to live as Jesus did.
And how much we need to lay it all on the altar and love as Jesus would have loved and taught his disciples to do.
I know this may seem to go against the grain of what I have been saying about how to deal with panhandlers but love, as God intended, is most often in my experience the furthest thing from what I would naturally think of doing in line with loving someone.
God's ideas are not very often, if at all, that which we are the most comfortable doing. Nor are they the most naturally logical thing to do.
I used to feel like you did. Then I learned that I am NOT responsible for the actions of others. God calls us to care for our neighbor, give the shirt off our back, feed the hungry, etc. However, Scripture doesn't tell us to place conditions on other's actions [Give so-and-so money IF he won't squander it; give so-and-so a shirt AS LONG AS she will care for it ..]. The Bible just says GIVE. Oftentimes *I* place conditions on the needy people around me ("I won't give him money because he will probably spend it."). But you know what? I'm not responsible for how the homeless guy abuses my generosity. It's the parable of the talents -- you abuse and you lose. There are repercussions and judgment for those people who waste/abuse gifts given to them. HOWEVER, God will always look favorably on a kind heart. I think it's always better to be obedient to God and let God dole out the consequences.
I don't think you are expected to drive homeless through drive thrus unless God prompts you. But even if you live in your truck, you can talk with him, pray with him, and get him food later. I know many people who won't give money away but will buy food for the people. I've been prompted to buy food for certain homeless, too, but I've always been nervous about it since I am a female.
I understand we live in a culture that values work (and we have to work -- sometimes too much), but I think it is easy to get caught up in the earthly perspective vs. the heavenly perspective. I would rather "waste" my time being obedience to Christ.
I hope this helps! =)
It's your responsibility to give wisely. I don't believe that Jesus would have given money to someone to someone that he knew would buy crack with it.
It's your responsibility to give wisely. I don't believe that Jesus would have given money to someone to someone that he knew would buy crack with it.
Jesus didn't have any money to give.
He gave all He had to folks that spit on Him (forgive them Father), so I don't know if He would have qualified any gift He gave...the only record of any type of qualified gift I can think of is healings followed with a 'Go, and sin no more!'
You may be right, I'm not being confrontational, I just don't know.
Jesus gave freely but generally speaking, He gave freely to those who had faith that He could do for them what they were asking for.
To those who responded to Him by trusting Him or what He said.
The ten lepers were healed (and given to) because they went on their way to do what Jesus said to do to receive their healing.
Lazarus was raised from the dead because his sisters believed that anything Jesus would ask of God would be given to Him and so...they rolled the stone away from the tomb Lazarus was in at which point Jesus commanded Lazarus to come forth.
Peter and the other fishermen caught a great big load of fish because they did what Jesus said to do. Even though they had caught nothing all night long they cast their nets on the other side of the boat, at Jesus's bidding, and caught so many fish the net started to break.
All these and many, many more received (i.e. were given to by the Lord) based on their willingness to have faith in who Jesus was and said to do.
If we withhold free money from a panhandler and instead make him (or her) work for it somehow (in line with what the Bible says to do with those who make it a habit to live off the generosity of others) we are not qualifying our gift any more than Jesus did.
We are rewarding a choice upon the part of the panhandler to do what is right. A choice to believe that working for their money is preferable to having someone give them yet one more handout. It is rewarding faith exhibited by the panhandler, albeit not faith in God but rather in us, that if they do some work we will indeed give to them in the form of money or whatever else they are asking of us. That takes faith since they have never seen us or know anything about us. While that faith is not in God but rather in us...it is a short step from faith in us to faith in God. It is the object of that faith that must change. From us to God.
But to work for a promise of being given what they are asking for but that as yet they have not seen is to exercise faith nevertheless.
Faith is the assurance of things hoped for. The conviction of things not seen.
We would do well as Christians to help the panhandler exercise faith in the promise of being given what they want in exchange for some form of work. That is a good thing, for them. It is a loving thing to do for them.
To just give them what they want freely, without connecting it to having to work for it somehow is not biblical, does not promote or encourage godliness in them, and does not glorify God at all.
Jesus would not have enabled the lazy man, panhandling for a living, by giving them free money. Instead I believe he would have warned them to work for the food they eat and to pay their own way in life in so far as they were able.
Dealing with the homeless and the panhandlers is always a tricky thing. You really have to walk in discernment and not be foolish. At the same time, the love God asks us to have for others is not the type of love that one has to qualify for.
Once someone gets to the bottom of the barrel financially, it can be difficult to find work. So many jobs require internet access and resumes. A person needs at least a cell phone and a place to get ready for work AT. So, it is easy to judge from the outside looking in. Without money how is one to wash their clothes or even get to work?
So, the best we can do is to follow the Holy Spirit as to what we should do in each situation. I think as Christians we should also constantly pray for compassion and a Godly understanding of how people get into lives that are all messed up and wisdom as to when we have to walk away. We should only do what we are LED to do....no more and no less.
Dealing with the homeless and the panhandlers is always a tricky thing. You really have to walk in discernment and not be foolish. At the same time, the love God asks us to have for others is not the type of love that one has to qualify for.
If you are calling not giving a panhandler money as a way of helping them repent from a lifestyle of living off the generosity of others "qualifying" a gift to them...then I say that such a qualification of one's gift of money is the most loving thing you can do for a panhandler.
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Once someone gets to the bottom of the barrel financially, it can be difficult to find work. So many jobs require internet access and resumes. A person needs at least a cell phone and a place to get ready for work AT. So, it is easy to judge from the outside looking in. Without money how is one to wash their clothes or even get to work?
I am judging no one in a way that I would not want to be judged. Making a judgement as to what is the best way to love someone is not wrong. There is a mistaken notion in the Christian world that all forms of judgment are wrong.
There is judgement which IS wrong and ungodly. And there is also judgement which IS right and honoring to God.
Jesus said to judge with righteous judgement. I believe the Bible is very clear in saying that we should not give indiscriminately to someone who is living off the generosity of others without being willing to work for the food that they eat. It's not good for them to receive what they are not willing to work for, not good for society, and not glorifying to God for us to encourage their lifestyle by giving to them indiscriminately.
Incidentally I can speak from personal experience as to how difficult it is to get work when you are at the bottom financially. I've been there. And it IS possible to find and get work. One does not need Internet, or a cell phone, a car, a resume, or any number of other things that are most often seen as absolutely vital to getting work. I have gotten work without any of that before.
What one really needs is a willingness to work coupled with a faith in God that He will provide a way. A faith that will be evidenced by the steps taken to find work.
Now I am not talking about a professional position. Rather I am talking about getting work such that panhandlers no longer need to panhandle.
Once a panhandler gets some work they can start improving their lot in life by aiming to get better work. But the point is that they need to begin. To turn from a life of living off the generosity of others to a life of working to meet their own needs and even to have enough to give to others.
I once went around the city with a couple of snow shovels on public buses and went door to door in various neighborhoods to shovel snow. The Lord always provided enough for me to eat. One day at a time. He even provided just enough for me to buy the snow shovels I needed on the day I needed them.
A panhandler does not want to work. That is the nature of panhandling. They want to get free money. As Christians we need to help them turn from that way of life for their own good and the good of society in general. We do not help them as such by continuing to give them free money and/or food.
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Yet we, as Christians are called to make judgements about all manner of things.
So, the best we can do is to follow the Holy Spirit as to what we should do in each situation. I think as Christians we should also constantly pray for compassion and a Godly understanding of how people get into lives that are all messed up and wisdom as to when we have to walk away. We should only do what we are LED to do....no more and no less.
I would like to address something here if I might...and this does not neccessarily apply to you personally...but what you said brought to my mind that there is another mistaken notion in some Christian circles that says something to the effect that we must be LED to do something before we do it...even if the Bible says clearly to do something.
If the Bible says clearly, and I believe it does, to not give indiscriminately to someone living off the generosity of others then we do not wait to be LED to not give. Conversily if we are LED to give anyway...even though the Bible says not to...then we are deceived. Our aim is to honor the Lord by obeying His commands. By doing what He says to do.
If, as Christians, we believe that the Bible reveals God's heart and desire for how we are to live...then we must follow what it says to do where it clearly says to do or not do something.
To be sure, there may be some leading in the timing of something, but that leading will never contradict what the Bible clearly says to do.
The only real question then becomes..."Does the Bible say not to give indiscriminately to someone who lives off the generosity of others without having a corresponding willingness to work?". I believe it does..though I am most certainly open to seeing it differently if someone can show me a plausible and Biblical argument for why we should continue to give to such a person as an expression of love.
I have been a (polite and respectful) panhandler myself. I think that one way for someone to show agape would have been to give me a little bit of money so I could have eaten, which some did. Before the police showed up and violated my right to freedom of speech, I received $4 out of the goodness of passerby's hearts, which let me get lunch. I sincerely appreciated it.
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