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Wow here's one of the few times I've agreed with you. The term to "love less" is right on the mark in this instance. Look at how the "Amplified Bible" puts it along with the footnote
Are you serious? Is this what Christians really believe? Love should have limits for other people, but not for God? How can you love less without diminishing love? And is God a really jealous God? Suppose you love somebody with the same kind of love that God is said to have for all people, would that be wrong in your mind?
I will tell you in Advaita Vedanta Hinduism, and Mahayana Buddhism, everybody has a divine nature, therefore everybody is worthy of the same love they would give to God. To diminish one kind of love in these religions is to diminish all love.
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Notice what the scripture at Hebrews 4:12 says about God's word the Bible being a sharp sword which can penetrate the heart and reveal thoughts and intentions and motivations. It can divide peoples from one another. Even at times family members, but that is their choice.
This makes more sense that what you posted above. Obviously, some people do not like hearing the truth. However, I happen to believe that regardless of how people feel about our particular concept of truth, we should deal with all people with compassion and sensitivity, not divisiveness. Simply because somebody doesn't see your viewpoint doesn't mean there is something wrong with them. Nobody likes people who are preachy and superficially concerned.
Are you serious? Is this what Christians really believe? Love should have limits for other people, but not for God? How can you love less without diminishing love? And is God a really jealous God? Suppose you love somebody with the same kind of love that God is said to have for all people, would that be wrong in your mind?
You are completely missing the point. If a woman is a Christian and has an unbelieving husband who is opposed to her beliefs of Christianity, should she out of love for her husband stop believing ???????? Of course not. The problem unfortunately is in the misinterpreting of what Jesus was trying to say. He did'nt literally mean for someone to actually hate a family member. The same could be said of someone that had a deep love and respect for their country. If the country became communist and demanded the obolition of Christianity, would you obey out of love of country and ended your belief ????? Of course not. This is really not a tuffy here!
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Originally Posted by Magnulus
I will tell you in Advaita Vedanta Hinduism, and Mahayana Buddhism, everybody has a divine nature, therefore everybody is worthy of the same love they would give to God. To diminish one kind of love in these religions is to diminish all love.
From what I have seen of history, most of Christendom, Buddhism, Hinduism, Islam, etc have equally butchered each other of the same faith's for centuries. All have also claimed to have that superior love quality as well!
If the country became communist and demanded the obolition of Christianity, would you obey out of love of country and ended your belief ????? Of course not. This is really not a tuffy here![/b]
If a country became communist, it doesn't automaticly mean you would have to hate that country to love God. I think you can see that, though. Jesus instructed his followers to "not resist an evil man" and "turn the other cheek". He didn't say "kill your enemies, hate those that curse you". Quite the opposite. That's why I think it's obvious that Jesus remarks do not literally mean to hate parents or family members, or to love them less even, Jesus is trying to express the concept of non-attachment through the use of hyperbole. Sometimes it's necessary to distance oneself from certain people to attain a particular goal, sometimes in needs to be done with the intensity of a strong emotion, like hate, even, but without the ill-will of hate. I think that's what he's saying.
If a country became communist, it doesn't automaticly mean you would have to hate that country to love God. I think you can see that, though. Jesus instructed his followers to "not resist an evil man" and "turn the other cheek". He didn't say "kill your enemies, hate those that curse you". Quite the opposite. That's why I think it's obvious that Jesus remarks do not literally mean to hate parents or family members, or to love them less even, Jesus is trying to express the concept of non-attachment through the use of hyperbole. Sometimes it's necessary to distance oneself from certain people to attain a particular goal, sometimes in needs to be done with the intensity of a strong emotion, like hate, even, but without the ill-will of hate. I think that's what he's saying.
First of all, let's try to define what "literal" means. "Literal" literally means the straight-forward, plain meaning of words, thoughts, priciples, ideas, etc. This should be done while keeping in mind one important point... context. Obviously, context is a very important part of reading the scriptures. Case in point - when Jesus calls himself the gate or the door, he's not literally a gate or door .. but He is The Way. Context can be as small as the paragraph the verse is part of or as large as the entire counsel of God.
Whenever we read any other literature and someone uses a figure of speech or waxes poetic or makes a point by using figurative or descriptive language or by a story, everyone gets it and it's not a big deal. But, for whatever the reasons, many people do not accept this type of writing style in the Bible and feel the need to pick it apart. My question would be why?
I don't know about others, but when I read this verse in context, I understand it for the message it represents. I understand Jesus is using figurative language to get people's attention and make them think about the point he's making. He's telling us to be a follower of Christ, we must put Him first, before our family and even before ourselves. It is not our family's will be done or even our own will be done, but his. If someone in my family or something about my family member or myself impedes my relationship to God, then yes, you must get beyond that or over them to be in right relationship with God. You cannot let it become an obstacle in your path or you, too shall stumble.
That's my take on the meaning of "hate" in this verse.
The reason people get so upset when they have to understand why something is not literal in the Bible is because the bible is supposed to be nothing but the truth, and a way of life. If this is true then there is no reason why we should have to figure out whether or not something said in the Bible has a different meaning. When you write a non-fictional biography there are no figurative statements, and what is the Bible if it is not a non-functional biography? If Jesus is trying to get his point across by using words like "hate" in a figurative way then he was setting the stage for his words to be misinterpreted. If this was not the intention of Jesus then it must have been the intention of Luke himself.
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here's one of the few times I've agreed with you. The term to "love less" is right on the mark in this instance. Look at how the "Amplified Bible" puts it along with the footnote
