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Old 11-09-2008, 08:02 PM
 
2,949 posts, read 5,499,740 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by soonerguy View Post
The Bible does mention several false gods, but I have never seen nor heard of a Bible that said Moses and Satan were gods. Satan was once an angel, but never a god.
Satan was an angel? Are you sure? Or are you listening to the church telling you that lucifer is satan? These are just more verses where the church is telling you what to believe. Where are the verses that plainly state that satan is lucifer and not someone`s interpretation that satan is lucifer?
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Old 11-09-2008, 08:03 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by meerkat2 View Post
How does John 17:21 fit into this? And also 1 Cor 15:28 If "I and the father are one" means "trinity" then starting with the disciples all who are born of the Spirit are one with the father and Jesus makes a "pantheistic" "panentheistic" God where ultimately everyone is God.

Jesus is the firstborn of all creation.

That they all may be one; as thou, Father, [art] in me, and I in thee, that they also may be one in us: that the world may believe that thou hast sent me.
good post and reps
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Old 11-09-2008, 08:04 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by meerkat2 View Post
John 20:17 Jesus saith unto her, Touch me not; for I am not yet ascended to my Father: but go to my brethren, and say unto them, I ascend unto my Father, and your Father; and [to] my God, and your God.
Romans 8:16-17 The Spirit itself beareth witness with our spirit, that we are the children of God:
Rom 8:17 And if children, then heirs; heirs of God, and joint-heirs with Christ; if so be that we suffer with [him], that we may be also glorified together.
Rom 8:29 For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate [to be] conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren.
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Old 11-09-2008, 08:06 PM
 
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thx for the list
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Old 11-09-2008, 08:06 PM
 
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When God made Moses a god to Pharoah, it was only temporary and a means to an end, so to speak. God was using Moses to accomplish something. It in no way compares to the Holy Trinity.
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Old 11-09-2008, 08:55 PM
 
Location: Chandler, AZ
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Originally Posted by Jesse69 View Post
You study the Bible to denounce it?
This attitude is EXACTLY why people believe in God in the first place.
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Old 11-09-2008, 09:14 PM
 
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John 8:58 (NIV) - "I tell you the truth," Jesus answered, "before Abraham was born, I am!"

Jesus himself is speaking and calling himself the I AM, which is the name God told Moses to tell the people of Israel was his name, so they would know Moses spoke with God. God = I AM; Jesus = I AM.

Revelation 1:8 (NIV) - "I am the Alpha and the Omega," says the Lord God, "who is, and who was, and who is to come, the Almighty."

Jesus revealed these words to John. This is Jesus speaking. Jesus is calling himself "The Almighty" which is what God called himself in OT. God = The Almighty; Jesus = The Almighty.

These two verses of many show that Jesus the Son and God the Father are ONE God, the same God. As this, IMO, refutes several of your points, I believe the rest can be dealt with similarly and therefore show that Jesus is Diety Supreme. Whether others agree or understand this is no reflection upon the truth of the matter -- that Jesus claimed he was God.
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Old 11-09-2008, 09:19 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jesse69 View Post
You study the Bible to denounce it?

I don't mind if sometimes I don't understand God, and if he's a mystery to me...

So if you argue against Jesus, he will also argue to God not to let you in Heaven! - I wouldn't risk that!
I think He said if anyone denounces Him He will also denounce him to his Father.
Fear guides you.
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Old 11-09-2008, 10:22 PM
 
2,949 posts, read 5,499,740 times
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Originally Posted by spm62 View Post
thx for the list

I only think this list proves that Jesus isn`t the Father. But you left out scripture that says Jesus is Lord and the old testament says the Lord was the creator. You also left out verses in the new testament that say Jesus is God. So Jesus is deity because the Father made him God and gave him all things.
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Old 11-09-2008, 10:59 PM
 
Location: Cicero, NY
623 posts, read 1,817,227 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by spm62 View Post
Satan was an angel? Are you sure? Or are you listening to the church telling you that lucifer is satan? These are just more verses where the church is telling you what to believe. Where are the verses that plainly state that satan is lucifer and not someone`s interpretation that satan is lucifer?
Satan is not a being, it is a generic description for fallen angels.
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