Would you see the Jehovah's witnesses as Christian?

[twin.spin]

Originally Posted by OutdoorsyGal

See your predicament? You are in a Cult which spreads lies about our Gods diety. You do it for your Father who is not God of the Bible
You cannot try to minimize your Creators deity and expect to be part of his family...

One of the characteristics of the Deity God is that God is present everywhere.

Psalm 139:8
If I go up to the heavens, you are there; if I make my bed in the depths, you are there.

KJV --- If I ascend up into heaven, thou art there: if I make my bed in hell, behold, thou art there.

and what is said of the physically risen Jesus:

Ephesians 4:10
He who descended is the very one who ascended higher than all the heavens, in order to fill the whole universe.

KJV --- He that descended is the same also that ascended up far above all heavens, that he might fill all things

and what did Jesus say of himself:

Matthew 18:20
"For where two or three gather in my name, there am I with them.”

For Jesus to fill the whole universe and be in multiple places where there are two or three are gathered at the same time can only occur for one reason

[expatCA]

Originally Posted by OutdoorsyGal

Just the passage in John 20:17, uses the word LORD which is used interchangibly. Not between God and man, but God and his son whom is part of him, hence the same name. LORD. Because they are the same deity

I and the Father are one." John 10:30

Only God, who is timeless and sinless, can make things right by himself, becoming a fleshly person to come down to save us from our sins. He created humanity, they screwed up, he needs to come down himself and fix it. Not a son he gave birth to, but a son which is HIM. I AND THE FATHER ARE ONE makes it pretty simple but yes, there are verses which do highlight them as equal beings of sorts all within one body. HIs attributes seem to be segregated for lack of a better way to say it, all within one divine being.
.

So far you have quoted several verses that you (and Trinitarians) apply in violation of the grammar and meaning. Being TOLD something is true is one thing actually studying the language to see IF it is true is another.

John 8:58 is a perfect example.

John 10:30 is another.

Both twisted by Trinitarians.

Have you studied the Greek or just accepted what you are told?

[twin.spin]

Originally Posted by expatCA

So far you have quoted several verses that you (and Trinitarians) apply in violation of the grammar and meaning. Being TOLD something is true is one thing actually studying the language to see IF it is true is another.

John 8:58 is a perfect example.

John 10:30 is another.

Both twisted by Trinitarians.

Have you studied the Greek or just accepted what you are told?

Your response is typical on why it is fruitless to engage with folks like yourself ... cause it wouldn't matter if a person did studied for 8 years, gets a Masters of Divinity degree and still said that within the Bible the Triune God is taught.

People are lead to the believe in the Triune via the Holy Spirit working faith, not because it was answered by sufficiently answering skeptical \ proof demands to the satisfaction of human reason of and by the skeptics.

[expatCA]

Originally Posted by twin.spin

Your response is typical on why it is fruitless to engage with folks like yourself ... cause it wouldn't matter if a person did studied for 8 years, gets a Masters of Divinity degree and still said that within the Bible the Triune God is taught.

People are lead to the believe in the Triune via the Holy Spirit working faith, not because it was answered by sufficiently answering skeptical \ proof demands to the satisfaction of human reason of and by the skeptics.

Not useless as it is easy to find the answers and ... even Trinitarian professors and scholars provide the evidence. Note; theology is not where you look, you look to language and context and even history.

A perfect example of history and context helping:

NO "Early Church Father" used; John 1:1, John 8:58 or John 10:30 to support the Trinity. Not even one. Why? They knew the language and knew they didn't give any credence to the doctrine. In English a poor translation or a theological dissertation that violates the base grammar is what has allowed people to "believe" those scriptures teach the Trinity.

You do know why the word "one" in Greek eliminates the Trinitarian understanding, don't you, in John 10:30?

Then we have context where Jesus actually explains what it means, uses it several times and ... shows the Trinitarian view is wrong?

Oh, 8 years is nothing. I have spent over 40 years at it and can translate both Koine Greek and Coptic.

A masters degree in divinity is a theological degree not one in the languages and is formed by the bias of the theological institute doing the instruction. Oh, I have been to several seminaries and knew several professors at such and ... theology trumps facts with them.

Please explain the grammar and context of the word "one" in the book of John.

[june 7th]

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