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Old 03-24-2009, 09:38 PM
 
Location: Canada
589 posts, read 1,420,550 times
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Originally Posted by HotinAZ View Post
But along these lines that you have laid out, here comes more. It says in Acts that we were reconciled back to Father by Way of Jesus, right? Back? Does this mean it is where we 'started'? In the OT is says the spirit returnes to the Father who gave it? When was it given? Is this where we started, and if so, why the heck are we here? What did we do that was so wrong to be put in the flesh, go through trials and tribulations, learn love and joy, and utimately find the peace, safety and forgiveness under the reign of our King, Jesus. If we were there before, as Elohim, then is it not within reason we still are, but have forgotten? Too many questions...
I don't know the answer to most of your questions, the only thing I know is that God created us mortal so that we will learn to love righteousness through experiencing the consequences of sin... while still in the flesh. We are given free will so in effect God is hands off to what we decide to do, to accept or reject his way and nature. In the end we will all be resurrected to face the Great White Throne Judgment when God will judge who will be given the ultimate gift of eternal life or to die a second death in the Lake of Fire.

Why not right away create us immortal like the angels? Well, they have free will and a third of them decided to rebel and commit evil. Their final fate is eternal torment in the Lake of Fire only because they are immortal and cannot die. God in all his mercy does not want humans to suffer the same fate... hence he came up with this plan!

Last edited by wilvan; 03-24-2009 at 09:52 PM..
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Old 03-24-2009, 10:01 PM
 
Location: Bora Bora: Vava'u.
738 posts, read 1,750,486 times
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Calling a human magistrate((a minor judicial officer)) a "god" indicates three things:
1) he has authority over other human beings
2) the power he wields as a civil authority is to be feared
3) he derives his power and authority from God Himself, who is pictured as judging the whole earth .

"I said, `You are gods; you are all sons of the Most High.' But you will die like mere men; you will fall like every other ruler."

This passage is saying that God has appointed men to positions of authority in which they are considered as gods among the people. They are to remember that, even though they are representing God in this world, they are mortal and must eventually give an account to God for how they used that authority.
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Old 03-24-2009, 10:15 PM
2K5Gx2km
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RAZZEL View Post
Calling a human magistrate((a minor judicial officer)) a "god" indicates three things:
1) he has authority over other human beings
2) the power he wields as a civil authority is to be feared
3) he derives his power and authority from God Himself, who is pictured as judging the whole earth .

"I said, `You are gods; you are all sons of the Most High.' But you will die like mere men; you will fall like every other ruler."

This passage is saying that God has appointed men to positions of authority in which they are considered as gods among the people. They are to remember that, even though they are representing God in this world, they are mortal and must eventually give an account to God for how they used that authority.
No it is not. How are men going to die like men??? That is quit redundant. In the Ps God is talking to His council who are called 'elohim' (gods) not to humans. They are the sons of God who take there place in the divine council of YHWH. By the way this is who God is talking to in Gen.1:26.

Once again I will point people to the articles I posted earlier on this Ps and its relation to Jesus' words in John. if people would read them it would clear alot of things up
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Old 03-25-2009, 04:33 PM
 
Location: South Carolina
3,586 posts, read 5,736,335 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HotinAZ View Post
What does this mean, haven't I said "ye are gods"?

Jhn 10:34
Jesus answered them, Is it not written in your law, I said, Ye are gods? If he called them gods, unto whom the word of God came, and the scripture cannot be broken;


Lets figure this out, you who call upon the Name of the Most High!
I think this may mean or be kind of similar, when God says King of Kings, and Lord of Lords.

Of course we will never be a God or God

I found this: The Hebrew word translated "gods" is Elohim. This is the masculine plural form of the root word El, denoting strength and power.

Sometimes translated "god." It is also attributed to angels. The reason God called the judges "gods" was because of their strength and power of position, not because of any deity within them.

the word does not always imply deity, whether it be false or true, but can refer to different offices, peoples, or concepts.

The Jews continually came at Jesus with the Scriptures trying to destroy His claims, so Jesus used their own methods on them.
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Old 03-25-2009, 08:59 PM
 
2,949 posts, read 5,069,490 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HotinAZ View Post
Just because it is a "little g" in the translation doesn't take away from from the word god or gods=אלהים 'elohiym in the Word. Please stop taking man's word for it and let us do the actual research. Who are YOU? As a child of the Most High, which those on here claim to be, are you not therefore 'elohiym? By understanding this, you will then understand where your inheritence lies. No, Jesus did not lie. Nor did He claim to be something He wasn't. He did not say He was Yahweh, the Father Most High, nor did He claim to be. He said it as it was.
amen,hot...good post. unfortunately most of the people on here are so heavely influenced by the church it is hard for them to do independent study of scripture without that church taught doctrine influencing their studies. They have been taught that it is taboo to believe we could be called gods at some point, that they look for a way for it to mean something else.
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Old 03-26-2009, 07:30 AM
 
7,780 posts, read 13,936,714 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by spm62 View Post
amen,hot...good post. unfortunately most of the people on here are so heavely influenced by the church it is hard for them to do independent study of scripture without that church taught doctrine influencing their studies. They have been taught that it is taboo to believe we could be called gods at some point, that they look for a way for it to mean something else.
When I responded to Hot's post, I made a point not to look at any man made doctrines or beliefs. I said a quick prayer, turned to John, cross referenced Psalms, and trusted the Lord to guide me.

Toss it out.

Pass it by.

Believe what you want about what I posted and how I got there.....but I know and God knows where my words came from.

And nothing you typed above is true.
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Old 03-26-2009, 11:37 AM
 
47,538 posts, read 30,063,576 times
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Of course we are NOT God . . . but it seems to me we would have to completely disregard the implications of the word "children" to abandon any notion of what we are supposed to become. Just saying.
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Old 03-26-2009, 11:40 AM
 
3,553 posts, read 4,646,366 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alpha8207 View Post
When I responded to Hot's post, I made a point not to look at any man made doctrines or beliefs. I said a quick prayer, turned to John, cross referenced Psalms, and trusted the Lord to guide me.

Toss it out.

Pass it by.

Believe what you want about what I posted and how I got there.....but I know and God knows where my words came from.

And nothing you typed above is true.
See Alpha, I would hope that you of all people could reconcile the fact that we are God's Children. This much you have said, and it is Truth. But take it a step further, and may His Light shine forth.

We get our life from the Father of Life. Does that part of the Father not make us by the very nature of Him, a part of Him? We know that we are carnal humans on earth, yet we as spiritual beings only reside in this earthly vessel. Both are formed by Him, and this marriage between heaven and earth in completed in our human form. We can't see the spiritual side, because of our blindness. This blindness happens when our carnal side rules over us. We sin, and we fall.

But, when we are "born-again", and our spiritual side is renewed by the Blood of the Lamb, we can see our spiritual side as it has never been seen before by us. The barriers that were held up, are taken down. This mirror of our former self grows dim, and we are enlightened, by the Father of all Light. Our relationship with Father is renewed, and we live in the spirit, through His Spirit.

But back to the original post.

If we, ALL of us, as His children, are both human AND spiritual, then going back into the genesis of creation, it is easy to SEE both of the trees within us, in our garden, which is His creation. The breath of life, given to us by Father, is His Life. A part of Him, and being a part of Him, it goes without reason that we are OF His substance. Hence, this part is called elohim. It is why it is called as such, for we cannot be called Father, though He resides in our hearts. We cannot be called the Son, though He also resides iun our hearts. They both are in us, and most importantly, we are IN them. By this deduction then, what would we be called?

Little gods?

Rather let us be called what we are. One with Father. One with the Son. One with each other, called the Body, called the Kingdom, called the bride, called the temple, called wha ever makes you realize that since He is ALL in ALL, and we are one with Him. Though individually we walk this earth, and learn our own lessons strolling in our garden, His desire is to walk with us in the cool of the day. As a Father to a son, and although not begotten, yet adopted, it never the less does not take away from the reality and the beauty for what it is.

See though the glass darkly, and the reflection which looks back at you. See the real YOU, and give thanks to the Father IN you!
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Old 03-26-2009, 04:33 PM
 
2,949 posts, read 5,069,490 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alpha8207 View Post
Believe what you want about what I posted and how I got there.....but I know and God knows where my words came from.
You may not have looked at any man made doctrines prior to posting but those doctrines are already a part of your belief system. They have already been drilled into you by the church. It`s like people from any other culture or country.... they believe as they do because it`s part of their culture and belief system...be it hindu, buddha..muslim..whatever. They bring their pre taught ideas into any study or new idea of belief. Maybe you do it unknowingly but you can`t help it..it`s already there. But you are right, God does know. Just as he knows where my words and belief come from. As you know,I used to be part of the church system just like you. God knows that prayer and study have brought me to where I am now.
Quote:
And nothing you typed above is true.
As usual, your opinion.
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Old 03-26-2009, 04:38 PM
 
8,989 posts, read 13,174,568 times
Reputation: 748
Quote:
Originally Posted by spm62 View Post
You may not have looked at any man made doctrines prior to posting but those doctrines are already a part of your belief system. They have already been drilled into you by the church. It`s like people from any other culture or country.... they believe as they do because it`s part of their culture and belief system...be it hindu, buddha..muslim..whatever. They bring their pre taught ideas into any study or new idea of belief. Maybe you do it unknowingly but you can`t help it..it`s already there. But you are right, God does know. Just as he knows where my words and belief come from. As you know,I used to be part of the church system just like you. God knows that prayer and study have brought me to where I am now.
As usual, your opinion.
Alpha only follows the bible just like any good Christian should. Do you have the gift of interpretation and teaching that the bible talks about? if not how do you know you are correct in your interpretation and is scripture contradicting itself by the Holy Spirit allowing you to believe that's all you need?
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