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You have not reconciled anything to the Bible, you have merely superimposed your view over the scriptural facts. I would like to see some real reconciliation and not some attempt at rejecting facts.
Many good people build their case against homosexuality almost entirely on the Bible. These folks value Scripture, and are serious about seeking its guidance in their lives. Unfortunately, many of them have never really studied what the Bible does and doesn't say about homosexuality.
What the Bible Says - And Doesn't Say - About Homosexuality (http://www.soulforce.org/article/homosexuality-bible-gay-christian - broken link)
You have not reconciled anything to the Bible, you have merely superimposed your view over the scriptural facts. I would like to see some real reconciliation and not some attempt at rejecting facts.
Well Robin I do apologize that my reconciliation doesn't coincide with what you believe to be a reconciliation. Lets call a spade a spade. You are asking leading questions in this thread as there isn't one drop of information anyone (including Jesus himself) could provide that you would consider a "reconciliation". I presented information based on what was asked concerning how I reconciled it. I wasn't asked to reconcile it according to Robin.
Now if you'd like to speak to what I presented instead of just posting that I'm rejecting some fact out there I'd love to. More than happy to.
I do find it absolutely astoundingly awesome that you have the facts. Bravo! Good job. You no longer need faith. You KNOW the facts right!? It must be a great feeling to be in the KNOW.
Well Robin I do apologize that my reconciliation doesn't coincide with what you believe to be a reconciliation. Lets call a spade a spade. You are asking leading questions in this thread as there isn't one drop of information anyone (including Jesus himself) could provide that you would consider a "reconciliation". I presented information based on what was asked concerning how I reconciled it. I wasn't asked to reconcile it according to Robin.
Now if you'd like to speak to what I presented instead of just posting that I'm rejecting some fact out there I'd love to. More than happy to.
I do find it absolutely astoundingly awesome that you have the facts. Bravo! Good job. You no longer need faith. You KNOW the facts right!? It must be a great feeling to be in the KNOW.
Look at the OP, is it being addressed or not? This has nothing to do with what I personally believe it has to do with the OP.
I have been watching this thread with interest and have respected the OP by not posting opposition. With that said I would like to ask where is the Biblical support for being gay and Christian I believe the OP was looking for. So far all I see is opinions and no Biblical support. Just thought I would try to get yall back on topic.
Quote:
Originally Posted by RobinD69
I am not attacking or even giving my opinion, but a Biblical reconciliation was asked for and only opinions have been offered, nothing firm or foundational. This is what I am pointing back to in the OP and no one seems to be interested in reconciling anything with the Bible or Christianity. As I said I was merely trying to help refocus the topic on the OP because it seems to have gotten off topic on its own.
Quote:
Originally Posted by RobinD69
You have not reconciled anything to the Bible, you have merely superimposed your view over the scriptural facts. I would like to see some real reconciliation and not some attempt at rejecting facts.
Quote:
Originally Posted by RobinD69
Look at the OP, is it being addressed or not? This has nothing to do with what I personally believe it has to do with the OP.
You have a really bad habit of misreading my words by assuming I've said something I haven't said. It's dishonest, and this is the second time today you've done that, and I would appreciate it if you would stop doing it.
In my OP, I was not seeking Biblical justification for being gay and Christian. I'm asking for the personal experiences of those who do NOT believe homosexuality is wrong. In that process, I'm asking how THEY have reconciled homosexuality with what the Bible says. I'm not asking for any examples of where the Bible supports homosexuality.
As far as I'm concerned, this thread IS on topic. Please knock it off, Robin. I don't want this to turn into an argument with fundamentalists.
I think the OP is asking for opinions and testimony as to how we each individually might reconcile one's being gay and Christian, and is requesting feedback on all the complexities of the matter. To be honest, it does sound a bit like you're asking for a trial and verdict, or at least a scholastic thesis defense. I can't speak for him, but those arguments back and forth have already been made and he seems studied enough to have heard them, and he'd rather speak to us on a more personal level?
You have a really bad habit of misreading my words by assuming I've said something I haven't said. It's dishonest, and this is the second time today you've done that, and I would appreciate it if you would stop doing it.
In my OP, I was not seeking Biblical justification for being gay and Christian. I'm asking for the personal experiences of those who do NOT believe homosexuality is wrong. In that process, I'm asking how THEY have reconciled homosexuality with what the Bible says. I'm not asking for any examples of where the Bible supports homosexuality.
As far as I'm concerned, this thread IS on topic. Please knock it off, Robin. I don't want this to turn into an argument with fundamentalists.
Well if I misunderstood you OP then I apologize, no dishonesty intended.
Read the OP. Your post was in direct violation of what was requested for this thread.
You were reported and dealt with accordingly.
Why is it so difficult for the thousands of non-fundamentalist denominations of Christianity to have a discussion on this Christian forum without being forced off track by fundamentalists? I've tried starting similar threads that get contaminated.
Per the guidelines instituted by Alpha and June, I'm targeting this thread to those who are NOT opposed to homosexuality, and those who believe it can be reconciled with the Bible and Christian beliefs. I say to those people that this is for investigational/educational purposes, and to learn how/why you came to believe as you do. Since I can't outright forbid someone from posting in this thread, I would prefer that all fundamentalist evangelical Christians, and those who are opposed to homosexuality, refrain from posting in this thread as it will only incite an argument. HAVE SOME COMMON COURTESY AND RESPECT MY RIGHT TO POST THIS THREAD!! I may consider asking a moderator to delete your comment because I will view it as baiting. I've set forth my wish for this thread and I'm not interested in arguing, and I don't care how much you think you know about the subject, or what you think the Bible says about it. I'm seeking to understand why others DON'T believe it is wrong...not why you do think it's wrong.
Onwards...
For those to whom this thread is directed, I suppose I'd like to hear why you believe it's okay to be gay and how you reconcile that to what the Bible says. Do you believe the usual Bible verses used to condemn it (also called "clobber passages") have been misinterpreted? And if so, in what way?
What is your personal experience? Did you always accept that homosexuality is okay, or were you once opposed to it and then later changed your position?
Of particular note, Isaiah 5:20 says "Woe to those who call evil good and good evil." Explain to me how you view that in light of homosexuality.
I am undecided about how I think God views homosexuality, and I believe that, as a Christian, I should err on the side of love and understanding. At one time, I practiced tolerance while privately leaning in the direction that it was probably a sin. As I've grown, I've gradually shifted towards believing that homosexuality and Christianity are not at all incompatible.
What compelled the shift in my thinking? I've always believed that sexuality is innate, not chosen. I didn't choose to be straight--I just am. I think all of us of either orientation can remember those first confusing days of sexual attraction and what a mystery it was, how little control we had over it. That being said, that left me with the belief that, gay or straight, you are what God made you. And who am I, or anyone else, to say that He erred? That struck me as rather arrogant, a kind of spiritual hubris, that was contrary to Christian ideals as I've always interpreted them.
The other factor in shifting my stance is my profound love of history. The Bible is a collection of writings by numerous people, that has been translated and re-translated numerous times (can anyone say "The Telephone Game?"), and that has, during various periods of time, been under the strict control of certain individuals while the "masses" were widely illiterate, at least in the language that the Bible was written in at the time. Who's to say how its contents have been corrupted, either deliberately or unintentionally, over the centuries? That being said, how could I, as a thinking and reasoning human being, accept every word of the Bible literally and without question?
These conclusions led me to value the spirit of the Bible more than the "details", which made reconciling homosexuality with Christianity much easier.
For me, the spirit of the Bible preaches love, compassion, generosity, and a humble reverence for God. Homosexuality does not conflict with any of these principles, and, in fact, impels me to leave the matter in God's hands and love my fellow man and woman, regardless of this issue.
As to your question regarding Isaiah 5:20, which says "Woe to those who call evil good and good evil," that's a tough one. I've always been one who believes that doing the right thing is often sifmple, even easy at times--it's deciding what the right thing is that is complicated and difficult. Since none of us is infallible, we should all be careful when preaching to others what is "good" and what is "evil", because if we're mistaken, then we're spreading that woe around. For me personally, love is love, and it's hard for me to come up with too many instances where love can be evil. I just don't see the evil in a man loving another man, or a woman another woman, the way I love my husband.
I hope that answers your questions.
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It's dishonest, and this is the second time today you've done that, and I would appreciate it if you would stop doing it. 
