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Quote: 8That is, it is not the children of the flesh who are children of God, but the children of the promise are regarded as descendants. 9For this is the word of promise: "AT THIS TIME I WILL COME, AND SARAH SHALL HAVE A SON." 10And not only this, but there was (Rebekah also, when she had conceived twins by one man, our father Isaac; 11for though the twins were not yet born and had not done anything good or bad, so that God's purpose according to His choice would stand, not because of works but because of Him who calls, 12it was said to her, "THE OLDER WILL SERVE THE YOUNGER." 13Just as it is written, "JACOB I LOVED, BUT ESAU I HATED." 14What shall we say then? There is no injustice with God, is there? May it never be! 15For He says to Moses, "I WILL HAVE MERCY ON WHOM I HAVE MERCY, AND I WILL HAVE COMPASSION ON WHOM I HAVE COMPASSION." 16So then it does not depend on the man who wills or the man who runs, but on God who has mercy.
17For the Scripture says to Pharaoh, "FOR THIS VERY PURPOSE I RAISED YOU UP, TO DEMONSTRATE MY POWER IN YOU, AND THAT MY NAME MIGHT BE PROCLAIMED THROUGHOUT THE WHOLE EARTH." 18So then He has mercy on whom He desires, and He hardens whom He desires. 19You will say to me then, "Why does He still find fault? For who resists His will?" 20On the contrary, who are you, O man, who answers back to God? The thing molded will not say to the molder, "Why did you make me like this," will it?
Why is Paul feeling He has to defend God's justice? what justice? I mean if it's human choice this passage would make no sense because Paul wouldn't have to defend if people are the one's who make the choice.
Is there anything in scripture for you to feel the need to defend God? Paul thought so
There is simply too much evidence (and our relationships with Him, i.e. knowing Him) that tells us of His sovereignty - He does what He wants, and that's that. That's why I defer back to what His will is, and interpret scripture around that.
There is simply too much evidence (and our relationships with Him, i.e. knowing Him) that tells us of His sovereignty - He does what He wants, and that's that. That's why I defer back to what His will is, and interpret scripture around that.
That is exactly right . The carnal mind interprets scripture according to the law or tradition.
That is exactly right . The carnal mind interprets scripture according to the law or tradition.
I have grown weary of this "carnal mind" term being misused and abused, carnal means fleshly and a true Christian does not remain carnal as he or she grows in holiness. Who are you to judge what is and who is carnal? are you not flesh and blood yourself? are you without sin?
I have grown weary of this "carnal mind" term being misused and abused, carnal means fleshly and a true Christian does not remain carnal as he or she grows in holiness. Who are you to judge what is and who is carnal? are you not flesh and blood yourself? are you without sin?
No i am not and i think carnally much of the time but like i have said to you on previous posts i am being transformed by the renewing of my mind , which is an obvious admission on my behalf that i am not perfect and still need to repent on a daily business.
You on the other hand must think you are perfect because you say you do not need to repent after believing.
By the way it is getting weary reading you trying to change the word from All to some , that is carnality in my mind according to the scripture "the natural man receiveth not the things of God" His word is spiritually discerned.
I am not judging you or any other i am judging what you say.How difficult is that to understand ?
No i am not and i think carnally much of the time but like i have said to you on previous posts i am being transformed by the renewing of my mind , which is an obvious admission on my behalf that i am not perfect and still need to repent on a daily business.
You on the other hand must think you are perfect because you say you do not need to repent after believing.
By the way it is getting weary reading you trying to change the word from All to some , that is carnality in my mind according to the scripture "the natural man receiveth not the things of God" His word is spiritually discerned.
I am not judging you or any other i am judging what you say.How difficult is that to understand ?
Understand this PCAMP I never said, you didn't need to repent. I said, you only repent once because if you repent over and over again then Christ is dieing for you over and over again. Christ died once therefore you repent once. If you repented a second time then you were never transformed the first time, once the Holy Spirit dwells in you, why would you need to repent again; you are a new creature. All things have passed away.
Understand this PCAMP I never said, you didn't need to repent. I said, you only repent once because if you repent over and over again then Christ is dieing for you over and over again. Christ died once therefore you repent once. If you repented a second time then you were never transformed the first time, once the Holy Spirit dwells in you, why would you need to repent again; you are a new creature. All things have passed away.
Repent means to change one's mind.
I never said otherwise read my post again.
If you do not repent you must be sinless so you are contradicting yourself having just accused me that i am claiming to be sinless ??
Why is Paul feeling He has to defend God's justice? what justice? I mean if it's human choice this passage would make no sense because Paul wouldn't have to defend if people are the one's who make the choice.
Is there anything in scripture for you to feel the need to defend God? Paul thought so
Wow! no one feels there is nothing in scripture to defend God?
8Even if I caused you sorrow by my letter, I do not regret it. Though I did regret it—I see that my letter hurt you, but only for a little while— 9yet now I am happy, not because you were made sorry, but because your sorrow led you to repentance. For you became sorrowful as God intended and so were not harmed in any way by us. 10Godly sorrow brings repentance that leads to salvation and leaves no regret, but worldly sorrow brings death. 11See what this godly sorrow has produced in you: what earnestness, what eagerness to clear yourselves, what indignation, what alarm, what longing, what concern, what readiness to see justice done. At every point you have proved yourselves to be innocent in this matter. 12So even though I wrote to you, it was not on account of the one who did the wrong or of the injured party, but rather that before God you could see for yourselves how devoted to us you are. 13By all this we are encouraged.
I would say that it is the Unis that are judging carnally, they look at the outward fleshly [carnal] sinner and see not as God does the inner heart of wickedness. They make too light of the sin that has blighted mankind and sent the Son of God to die for His people who He has chosen to save.
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so you are contradicting yourself having just accused me that i am claiming to be sinless ??
