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Oh ok. Makes sense. Yeah, whenever I go to Cleveland, I notice once I'm around the people long enough, talking to them and getting a feel for the area, it feels significantly more east coast than Cincinnati. Pittsburgh looks east coast, but if you spend enough time there, it's easy to notice that it's not east coast culturally.
Although Cincinnati looks east coast, culturally speaking, it feels mostly southern, with a mix of midwestern flair. The accents of the natives is what definitely gives the area a more southern feel. A lot of Cincy natives claim they do not, but most have a noticable southern twang, with some having full blown southern accents.
Cornhole also makes the area feel southern, although I'm not sure if it's southern culturally or not. Its something I never heard of until I moved here. It's difficult to say exactly what Cincinnati is because there are quirks that you will find here and hardly anywhere else. Saying the word "please" for someone to repeat something is another example of a discovery I made upon moving here. Again, I don't know if that is a southern attribute or not, so its hard to say exactly what Cincinnati is culturally.
Cleveland is way more like Chicago, than the east coast in everything from accents (pronouncing the o in socks a bit more like the a in cat to my SW Ohio ears) to the ethnic makeup (though without the new wave East/South Asian, and non Puerto Rican Hispanic immigration on the scale that Chicago has). I'd argue that culturally the cities of Cleveland, Toledo, Detroit and Chicago are in the same boat, with some degree of influence on St. Louis (which is kind of its own beast). The Architecture in Cleveland is a mix of Dayton Ohio (frame houses with some older brick federalist buildings here and there), Chicago (large courtyard apartments and corner buildings), and Queens (large kind of ugly apartment blocks circa late 1920s-1950s) IMO.
The Southern twang wasn't really evident until I moved to Chicago and hadn't visited SW Ohio in months, when I came back to my hometown everyone sounded really southern, it was a weird feeling. Its not full blown Kentucky southern but more a slower way of talking that's kind of similar.
First off, I love going to Cleveland nothing quite like going to the Rock and Roll Hall of fame and eating lunch as White Castle. I just am curious about why you think Cleveland is east coast, I have spent extensive time in cities such as Philly and NYC and Cleveland gives off a different vibe. But if you don't have an answer that's cool too
There is no answer, it is all subjective. Pittsburgh forumers think Pittsburgh is the end all be all of cities. Cleveland feels much more eastern than Pittsburgh to me. Pittsburgh is very Appalachia. I have lived in both cities, you live in one and visit one, there's a difference.
I am saying Cleveland is a good mix of both eastern and Midwestern. I also feel that it is more eastern than Pittsburgh. I am not saying it is full-blown east coast. But it also isn't full-blown Midwestern either.
If you're eating at White Castle in Cleveland, that says more about you than it does about the city. There are a ton of great places to eat in and around downtown, like the Great Lakes Brewing Co. (Pittsburgh's hideous IC beer can't possibly compete), Mallorca, Bluepoint, etc. Or you could jump over to Little Italy and have some amazing Italian, delis everywhere, great ethnic foods, top-notch New York-style pizza, etc.
Really, if you are settling for fast food in Cleveland, you're not even trying.
That's ok, I always hit up the nearest Applebees out at Robinson whenever I am in Pittsburgh. Certainly gives me an idea of what the Pittsburgh food scene is ALL about.
Just because Cincinnat is the oldest city west of the Alleghenies, and its downtown topography conducive to a compact neighborhood reducing the cost of urban infrastructure and construction of the times does not make it Eastern. A couple of centuries old architecture does not define a City, and particularly the entire metropolitan area.
For a city to be truely Eastern, it has to embrace far more than just architectural traits. The overall cultural characteristics and the daily living pattern have to be a match. This is where I believe Cincinnati is definitely not Eastern, and also definitely not Southern.
I have the same feeling about Pittsburgh, and why I believe it is also not Eastern, even though people comment about its row houses. When you are hemmed in by rivers, what else do you expect as to architecture?
No, but according to half the Pittsburgh forumers, they are as Eastern as you can get. It's amusing reading their posts thinking how eastern they are and how as soon as you enter Ohio, you're in flyover country. I never understood western PA, I would honestly just love to skip over it on my drives to New York or DC.
Cleveland is way more like Chicago, than the east coast in everything from accents (pronouncing the o in socks a bit more like the a in cat to my SW Ohio ears) to the ethnic makeup (though without the new wave East/South Asian, and non Puerto Rican Hispanic immigration on the scale that Chicago has). I'd argue that culturally the cities of Cleveland, Toledo, Detroit and Chicago are in the same boat, with some degree of influence on St. Louis (which is kind of its own beast). The Architecture in Cleveland is a mix of Dayton Ohio (frame houses with some older brick federalist buildings here and there), Chicago (large courtyard apartments and corner buildings), and Queens (large kind of ugly apartment blocks circa late 1920s-1950s) IMO.
The Southern twang wasn't really evident until I moved to Chicago and hadn't visited SW Ohio in months, when I came back to my hometown everyone sounded really southern, it was a weird feeling. Its not full blown Kentucky southern but more a slower way of talking that's kind of similar.
Cleveland does have a concentrated Asiatown. (just east of downtown). Nothing like Chicagos Chinatown, but still stands out.
I still think however, that at least the people I know from Cincinnati, and the ones that I met/spoke with down there when I was down there a couple times, the only ones that really have anything like a southern accent, are those that have roots in the south (Kentucky). For those whose families don't have any southern/Kentucky background, its not there.
I guess it's all relative and depends on where you're from, but it's fairly noticable to me. If you meet people from some of the outlying neighborhoods on both sides of the city: Sayler Park, Riverside, Price Hill, East End or California, it's definitely noticable. And some of the people I've talked to from the aforementioned neighborhoods are not migrants from KY. Many have been in Cincinnati for generations, yet there is a noticable twang in their accent.
Although Clermont County is not Cincinnati, it feels very southern IMO. It's also very conservative , and a very big supporter of the military. The tri-state in general has fairly strong ties to the military. It seems you hear of a local soldier dying or being injured from the war fairly often, and a majority of them appear to come from Clermont or Dearborn counties.
I guess my consensus is that Cincinnati is somewhat of a mix, but with a southern bent, while the metro area is certainly southern.
But someone from Tennessee, Kentucky, or even the deep South states would laugh at you for calling Cincinnati or anywhere else in south central or SE Ohio the South. Yes, south central and SE Ohio are completely different from the rest of the highly populated, less rural areas of the state, but they are not even remotely southern. When you cross over the river from Kentucky, you can clearly tell there is a different attitude and way of looking at things. Cincinnati is nothing like Kentucky, and has had a huge influence on NKY and that's why NKY is different from the rest of Kentucky. I detect no southern accents in Cincinnati at all, unless they are southern transplants and of course the huge inflow of residents long ago from West Virginia and Kentucky. West Virginians have huge influences all the way up to Akron. Is Akron now considered southern?
Drive through Cincinnati, then head to Memphis and you will notice a huge difference. People in Kentucky hate Ohioans anyway. I have heard they think we are big city people who drive bad and are rude. And in my opinion, driving along I-75 and going into eastern and central Kentucky is like being in another world.
But someone from Tennessee, Kentucky, or even the deep South states would laugh at you for calling Cincinnati or anywhere else in south central or SE Ohio the South. Yes, south central and SE Ohio are completely different from the rest of the highly populated, less rural areas of the state, but they are not even remotely southern. When you cross over the river from Kentucky, you can clearly tell there is a different attitude and way of looking at things. Cincinnati is nothing like Kentucky, and has had a huge influence on NKY and that's why NKY is different from the rest of Kentucky. I detect no southern accents in Cincinnati at all, unless they are southern transplants and of course the huge inflow of residents long ago from West Virginia and Kentucky. West Virginians have huge influences all the way up to Akron. Is Akron now considered southern?
Drive through Cincinnati, then head to Memphis and you will notice a huge difference. People in Kentucky hate Ohioans anyway. I have heard they think we are big city people who drive bad and are rude. And in my opinion, driving along I-75 and going into eastern and central Kentucky is like being in another world.
I'm not going to argue with you since the topic is subjective, and you can say what you want, but my opinion will remain the same. Most of the people you claim that will "laugh" at me for calling certain parts of Ohio southern are the ones who've never been here. A lot of people who are not particularly familiar with Ohio do not realize that Appalachia runs through a significant portion of the state. Before I moved to Ohio, I never imagined parts like southern and SE Ohio existed in this state. IMO, the aforementioned regions are very similar to northwest South Carolina, which makes sense being that those areas are all located in the foothills of Appalachia.
Btw, I know Appalachian is not synonymous with Southern, but almost anywhere in Appalachia tends to have a more stereotypical southern feel. You can go to some of the small towns in the Southern Tier of New York State or even Western New Hampshire, and it will look practically indistinguishable from parts of Alabama.
I'm not going to argue with you since the topic is subjective, and you can say what you want, but my opinion will remain the same. Most of the people you claim that will "laugh" at me for calling certain parts of Ohio southern are the ones who've never been here. A lot of people who are not particularly familiar with Ohio do not realize that Appalachia runs through a significant portion of the state. Before I moved to Ohio, I never imagined parts like southern and SE Ohio existed in this state. IMO, the aforementioned regions are very similar to northwest South Carolina, which makes sense being that those areas are all located in the foothills of Appalachia.
Btw, I know Appalachian is not synonymous with Southern, but almost anywhere in Appalachia tends to have a more stereotypical southern feel. You can go to some of the small towns in the Southern Tier of New York State or even Western New Hampshire, and it will look practically indistinguishable from parts of Alabama.
Who said anyone was arguing?
Cincinnati is not southern, it is plain and simple. There are only, and I mean a select few, traits that make Cincinnati seem southern. The fact that is borders a state in the Upland South (Kentucky), you get a lot of people from Kentucky visiting/living in the Cincinnati area for jobs and bigger city ammenities/things to do so you hear that accent.
And yes, the Southerners would laugh if you called any part of Ohio southern even after they visited it. Go into deep parts of Tennessee, Alabama, South Carolina, Georgia, Kentucky, Mississippi, etc. Their rural areas are a hell of a lot different than the deep parts of Ohio. The culture is completely different. The Appalachian foothills of Ohio are very similar to that of New York, but South Carolina and Georgia is a extremely long stretch. I will agree that a lot of Appalachia has a similar feel, but northern Appalachia and southern Appalachia still feel very different to me.
Comparing Cincinnati to a city like Memphis, Nashville, New Orleans, Birmingham, etc makes no sense. Cincy is just like St. Louis, it is a northern city that has some southern style because it has been influenced by the people that have moved to either of these cities from the south decades ago.
Cincinnati is not southern, it is plain and simple. There are only, and I mean a select few, traits that make Cincinnati seem southern. The fact that is borders a state in the Upland South (Kentucky), you get a lot of people from Kentucky visiting/living in the Cincinnati area for jobs and bigger city ammenities/things to do so you hear that accent.
And yes, the Southerners would laugh if you called any part of Ohio southern even after they visited it. Go into deep parts of Tennessee, Alabama, South Carolina, Georgia, Kentucky, Mississippi, etc. Their rural areas are a hell of a lot different than the deep parts of Ohio. The culture is completely different. The Appalachian foothills of Ohio are very similar to that of New York, but South Carolina and Georgia is a extremely long stretch. I will agree that a lot of Appalachia has a similar feel, but northern Appalachia and southern Appalachia still feel very different to me.
Comparing Cincinnati to a city like Memphis, Nashville, New Orleans, Birmingham, etc makes no sense. Cincy is just like St. Louis, it is a northern city that has some southern style because it has been influenced by the people that have moved to either of these cities from the south decades ago.
Good post. It really is plain and simple. Cincinnati is in a rather small state that shares a Great Lakes border with Canada, for crying out loud. To imply it's Southern is laughable, really.
The presence of a few Cracker Barrels, a pair of country radio stations and some transplants that speak with an accent doesn't make Cincinnati "Southern."
Cincinnati is not southern, it is plain and simple. There are only, and I mean a select few, traits that make Cincinnati seem southern. The fact that is borders a state in the Upland South (Kentucky), you get a lot of people from Kentucky visiting/living in the Cincinnati area for jobs and bigger city ammenities/things to do so you hear that accent.
And yes, the Southerners would laugh if you called any part of Ohio southern even after they visited it. Go into deep parts of Tennessee, Alabama, South Carolina, Georgia, Kentucky, Mississippi, etc. Their rural areas are a hell of a lot different than the deep parts of Ohio. The culture is completely different. The Appalachian foothills of Ohio are very similar to that of New York, but South Carolina and Georgia is a extremely long stretch. I will agree that a lot of Appalachia has a similar feel, but northern Appalachia and southern Appalachia still feel very different to me.
Comparing Cincinnati to a city like Memphis, Nashville, New Orleans, Birmingham, etc makes no sense. Cincy is just like St. Louis, it is a northern city that has some southern style because it has been influenced by the people that have moved to either of these cities from the south decades ago.
Exactly! Its like saying San Diego is a Mexican city or Detroit or Buffalo are Canadian cities! And honestly I'm not even sure if that is totally accurate, since Newport and Covington might have more influence from Cincinnati than vice versa.
Northern Appalachia has much more ancestry that is German, and even eastern and southern European (Polish and Italian) where education and higher culture was always a little more highly valued than areas that were purely Scots-Irish, so yet Appalachia north of the Mason-Dixon is absolutely different. Also less isolated, as northern Appalachia was more industrialized due to their proximity to bigger cities, (which of course brought in more non-Annglo-Celtic people). Just look at the ethnicity map, and see where the dividing line between people who consider themselves "American" and those that consider their ancestry German (or what have you).
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