Cincinnati is becoming second fiddle to Columbus (Cleveland, Toledo: contractors, universities)

[abr7rmj]

Originally Posted by unusualfire

I think a whole lot of metro's will be jealous when the two are officially joined. Some will still not accept it. Businesses wise it's accepted. That's why there is so many branch offices are covering both areas. They love the larger market.

Ding ding ding ding ding ... we have a winner.

A lot of metros won't like it, starting with the one on exceptionally flat land in the middle of the state that jbcmh81 fancies.

[chet_kinkaid]

the reason dayton isnt part of the cincinnati csa are #1.dayton is a metro area of over 1 million people 54 miles from cincinnati.its doesnt fit any profile of current csa definitions in that the majority of the residents of montgomery county ,which would be the only county added if a csa change were to occur,work in montgomery county ,with the majority of residents of greene county working in montgomery county,etc.clark county could soon be part of the columbus csa if changes to commutes and employment continue trending that way.#2 officials in dayton would fight to the death to prevent it.having their community being further marginalized,#3.the areas are in decline losing population,montgomery,northern butler counties are losing population,usually only counties that are growing as a result of economic activity related to the larger core city are added to msa/csa areas .

[unusualfire]

Chit you are wrong on ALL counts.

#1 The Dayton metro is 835,000.

#2 The exchange rate inbound from Clark to Franklin county is 2.2 and from Franklin county to Clark county is .8%

Further more it not just one county, it the core counties that are counted as far as commuter exchange rate to form a CSA.

#3. The CSA threshold is 15% where community delegates would agree or disagree for the area to be combined. At 25% exchange rate it is automatically designated.


Back in 2000 the exchange rate was 9% between the metro's of Cincinnati and Dayton. It uses the lowest labor pool which would be Dayton at 390,000. So to make the threshold back in 2000 58,000 commuters had to make the commute between the Cincinnati and Dayton area. 35,000 traveled for work between the 2 metro's in 2000. It's a combined commuter exchange rate. Cincinnati-Dayton has had a decade to improve them numbers.

Community delegates would never turn down the combination, because it would bring in more federal dollars to the region.

"Combined Statistical Areas are composed of adjacent Metropolitan and Micropolitan Statistical Areas which have demonstrated economic or social linkage. It may comprise two or more Metropolitan areas, a Metropolitan and Micropolitan area, two or more Micropolitan areas, or multiples of each.

Combined Statistical Areas are automatically created when there is 25% or more of employment "interchange" (commuting). For areas between 15% and 25% interchange, the decision to create a Combined area was based upon local opinion as provided by the Congressional delegation."

[jbcmh81]

Originally Posted by unusualfire

I think a whole lot of metro's will be jealous when the two are officially joined. Some will still not accept it. Businesses wise it's accepted. That's why there is so many branch offices are covering both areas. They love the larger market.

I don't really get this argument either. Cincinnati is already the largest metro in Ohio, so shouldn't it already be attracting more business than the others if this were true? Cleveland and Columbus seem to be attracting business just fine, and Columbus still leads, by far, in actual growth. What will the addition of Dayton actually change?

[jbcmh81]

Originally Posted by unusualfire

Chit you are wrong on ALL counts.

#1 The Dayton metro is 835,000.

#2 The exchange rate inbound from Clark to Franklin county is 2.2 and from Franklin county to Clark county is .8%

Further more it not just one county, it the core counties that are counted as far as commuter exchange rate to form a CSA.

#3. The CSA threshold is 15% where community delegates would agree or disagree for the area to be combined. At 25% exchange rate it is automatically designated.


Back in 2000 the exchange rate was 9% between the metro's of Cincinnati and Dayton. It uses the lowest labor pool which would be Dayton at 390,000. So to make the threshold back in 2000 58,000 commuters had to make the commute between the Cincinnati and Dayton area. 35,000 traveled for work between the 2 metro's in 2000. It's a combined commuter exchange rate. Cincinnati-Dayton has had a decade to improve them numbers.

Community delegates would never turn down the combination, because it would bring in more federal dollars to the region.

"Combined Statistical Areas are composed of adjacent Metropolitan and Micropolitan Statistical Areas which have demonstrated economic or social linkage. It may comprise two or more Metropolitan areas, a Metropolitan and Micropolitan area, two or more Micropolitan areas, or multiples of each.

Combined Statistical Areas are automatically created when there is 25% or more of employment "interchange" (commuting). For areas between 15% and 25% interchange, the decision to create a Combined area was based upon local opinion as provided by the Congressional delegation."

What were the exchange rates in 2010?

[Tourian]

Originally Posted by jbcmh81

I don't really get this argument either. Cincinnati is already the largest metro in Ohio, so shouldn't it already be attracting more business than the others if this were true? Cleveland and Columbus seem to be attracting business just fine, and Columbus still leads, by far, in actual growth. What will the addition of Dayton actually change?

Well it would make the region more powerful and perhaps attract more business, people, jobs and prosperity. That's obivous. Maybe just being a little bigger then Columbus and Cleveland isn't enough for some people? They want to see to go after and be more prosperous then other metros in the country? Have you every been to the City vs City section of this board? If you had you wouldn't be asking why and you would 'get it.'

[abr7rmj]

Originally Posted by jbcmh81

I don't really get this argument either. Cincinnati is already the largest metro in Ohio, so shouldn't it already be attracting more business than the others if this were true? Cleveland and Columbus seem to be attracting business just fine, and Columbus still leads, by far, in actual growth. What will the addition of Dayton actually change?

The combination of Cincinnati and Dayton into a single CSA isn't intended to prevent Columbus from attracting businesses. The attraction of jobs into all parts of Ohio from out of state is beneficial and most welcome.

The addition of Dayton to Cincinnati's CSA will simply verify what many already know and accept: The two metros are increasingly a seamless, singular unit. It will allow the cities to market and brand themselves together similar to "Dallas-Fort Worth," "Cleveland-Akron" or "Seattle-Tacoma." The increased prestige of such a nationally known joint metroplex would be beneficial in attracting even more business, not to mention a host of secondary benefits (more university students for UC, X, Miami, UD, NKU, WSU and our many smaller colleges; better airline service for both cities' airports or even an eventual joint airport; intercity rail transit linking the two downtowns, suburbs and airports; even more cross-marketing for tourism-related sites such as the zoo, CMC, Air Force Museum, Reds, Kings Island/waterparks, Lebanon/Waynesville, Masters tennis, NASCAR race and more; added international recognition, etc.). And while I certainly want to see Columbus attract jobs/business over, say, Charlotte or Atlanta (yuck), I would prefer Cincinnati-Dayton to attract them first.

[kjbrill]

This continuing back and forth concerning the MSA, CSA, or whatever other measurement between Cincinnati-Dayton, Columbus, Cleveland-Akron just does contain that much signirficance to me. It will become what it becomes.

Cincinnati, Dayton, and Cleveland have been separate significant entities for how many years? To think they are just suddently going to seamlessly merge into one entity is naive. Each will fight for their own identity, which I understand.

What disturbs me much more is that the governor refuses to apply for financial disaster aid for our southern localities devastated by the tornados of last Friday. These people lost basically everything they own, and have very little to recover with. But the governor says we do not need federal disaster aid. That is about one of the most absurb statements I have heard recently.

I figure Cincinnati-Dayton will become one, but pushing it now is premature. The same goes for Cleveland-Akron, they are not quite there yet. But maybe we should also recognize some of the other cities in this great state, such as Toledo, Youngstown, Zanesville, and others.

[rrtechno]

All the arguing about what is or isn't, what should or shouldn't be, what the night time satellite pictures show or don't show mean nothing according to what the official definition and criteria determine. The latest Combined Statistical Area breakdowns that I found are here.

http://www.policom.com/PDF%20COMBINED/OHCOM.pdf

In other areas of the state and country, Cin-Day are recognized as being "one" regardless of what the official definition is. Talk here was that "If they were combined, they could be marketed together to businesses." Why can't that be done anyhow. If you put Dayton with Cincinnati, what will that do to the rest of the Dayton-Springfield-Greenville Area. How much of that would be added to Columbus area and what will the overall result be?

To me it seems like a pretty insignificant thing to get all worked up about. There are more things that need attention.

[TomJones123]

Springfield is it's own metro for a couple years now.