The remaking of CVG (Columbus, Cincinnati: hotels, buying, taxes)

[kjbrill]

I would assume the United flights out of CVG are mainly to Chicago, since that is a major facility for them. Likewise I would expect American to be feeding Dallas/Fort Worth. We would expect US Airways to be serving the east coast, specifically Charlotte.

Knocking CVG is the game of the day. But I do not feel we have gotten anywhere close to an accounting as to why the fares out of CVG are so high. Do they charge premium airport usage fees to pay their way? I don't believe they have a large tax revenue to operate the airport. Correct me if I am wrong.

We all know Delta made the most out of their situation during the heyday of the hub operation. And why not? People would avoid Atlanta, St Louis, Chicago, Detroit, and other really malfunctioning airports to fly through Cincinnati, it was just such a more pleasant experience. To say Delta had a stranglehold, no it was just simply good business.

But the hub concept hit the wall. 9/11 was a major influence with all of the increased security requirements. Suddenly flying was no longer fun anymore, but something to be endured. Rising fuel costs killed the regional jet, the heart of the hub system.

I am often critized that I have absolutely no credibility to comment about the main City of Cincinnati since I rarely go there. But CVG is something I will argue for. It is a great facility. Those who argue against it, I venture none of you have one iota of experience with running an airport. Flap your gums all you want, but CVG is still the best airport in the area. Yes we would like to get the fares down, but first we need facts as to why the fares are up to begin with. I have never seeen an analysis which convinces me as to the reason.

[Wilson513]

What we need is to get the fares up. The airlines take turns filing bankruptcy and every time they do creditors, banks and shareholders contribute to subsidizing the yahoos and hayseeds that think that it is their inalienable right to fly to Orlando or NYC for $299. It is the airlines fault for creating this nonsense, but it should cost $800 to fly round trip to NYC and if it did we would not all be treated like cargo, have the planes packed to the gills and flights canceled every time they only sell 75% of the seats.

But, we have a part in it too. Scouring the Internet for hours to see if we can save a few dollars by some goofy combination of flights. And, unless we switch to Communism we cannot climb out of this mess.

Without tossing capitalism in the dust bin, a start would be that every seat on every flight must be sold at the same price to every passenger. That would stop some of the nonsense. And, bring the airlines into line with every other retailer who (by regulation) cannot advertise an item for $1 and then tell the customer that there were only three of their 10,000 such items in inventory at $1, the rest are $9.99 which is what the airlines get away with. They run a full page ad saying "NYC or LA just $299" but that is only for three seats on a plane with 250 seats. The rest sell for everywhere from $299 to $1299. Its ridiculous.

Its a bad problem. No easy solution at this point. I would start with an FTC/FAA rule that says every flight must have a posted price and stick to it. And, no flight could be canceled for lack of sales without penalty. A big penalty.

[kjbrill]

Wilson... I think that is a great idea. And while we are at it, extend it to hotels/motels, a room price is a room price. Same for cruise ships and such. You either have to stay with your advertised price, or if you drop it all affected accommodations must be the same price for some period of time. And if someone checks in after you lower the price you must honor the new price to them. Run these so-called we will get you a lower price to fill the capacity outfits out of business, as they contribute absolutely nothing constructively to the economy.

[Wilson513]

Originally Posted by kjbrill

Wilson... I think that is a great idea. And while we are at it, extend it to hotels/motels, a room price is a room price. Same for cruise ships and such. You either have to stay with your advertised price, or if you drop it all affected accommodations must be the same price for some period of time. And if someone checks in after you lower the price you must honor the new price to them. Run these so-called we will get you a lower price to fill the capacity outfits out of business, as they contribute absolutely nothing constructively to the economy.

If a car dealer did what the airlines do, they would be in handcuffs.

Imagine a big row of Ford Focus with the first on having a big sign $9999. Then when you try to buy one, they tell you the price was just for the one and its sold. They'd be shut down in a minute.

But, the airlines have a different price for every seat on that plane. And, people are working the system right up until flight time to try to beat the system.

No wonder it doesn't work.

[jlawrence01]

Originally Posted by kjbrill

, I venture none of you have one iota of experience with running an airport. Flap your gums all you want, but CVG is still the best airport in the area. Yes we would like to get the fares down, but first we need facts as to why the fares are up to begin with. I have never seeen an analysis which convinces me as to the reason.

That is why so many people vote with their feet and fly out of ANY airport besides CVG.

CVG made a pact with the devil and allowed Delta to run a monopoly at the airport, much to the detriment of the consumers. Now that Delta has pretty much divorced CVG in favor of Detroit and Minneapolis, you get what you have - limited service at a very high price.

[kjbrill]

Originally Posted by jlawrence01

That is why so many people vote with their feet and fly out of ANY airport besides CVG.

CVG made a pact with the devil and allowed Delta to run a monopoly at the airport, much to the detriment of the consumers. Now that Delta has pretty much divorced CVG in favor of Detroit and Minneapolis, you get what you have - limited service at a very high price.

If that were so true, why are other carriers not rushing in here to undercut Delta? Just doesn't seem that simple to me. And why aren't other major carriers like United and American who operate out of CVG running ads as to their fare advantage. Maybe because they are charging the same fares as Delta?

If it wasn't for Delta, CVG would still be milking the old Terminals #1 & #2, the quonset huts. Delta put CVG on the map. Unfortunately those same forces have shrunk their traffic at CVG significantly. But Terminal #3 is a testament as to what Delta has done for CVG. A fine and modern fadility.

I hope the outfit you work for never has a hiccup and oops situation to deal with. The outfit I worked for did and retired me 3 years yearly. I was not overly upset as I already had over 45 years working for them, so I was ready to cash it in. I did do some special projects for them after I retired.

Quit slamming Delta. They made a great deal with CVG for the time, and built CVG into one of the best airports to fly in and out of in the Eastern half of the country. Again, what portion of the expansion was paid for directly by Delta? And while their hub was humming and I was still working, I could get a direct flight to just about any city where we had customers. That was a great convenience to me.

And how much of the reduction was due to the aftermath from 9/11? And it is still going on.

I just do not see Southwest, JetBlue, and the rest of the discount airlines as being the saviors of the traveling populace. They may do something for the vacation traveler, but for the business traveler which must be there on a given day and time, take your risk.

[Wilson513]

Delta releases strangle-hold on CVG

Read and you will understand.

[pontiac51]

Originally Posted by kjbrill

I am often critized that I have absolutely no credibility to comment about the main City of Cincinnati since I rarely go there. But CVG is something I will argue for. It is a great facility. Those who argue against it, I venture none of you have one iota of experience with running an airport. Flap your gums all you want, but CVG is still the best airport in the area. Yes we would like to get the fares down, but first we need facts as to why the fares are up to begin with. I have never seeen an analysis which convinces me as to the reason.

Yes CVG is a great facility, and I'm sure that the renovated concourse is beautiful. But, primarily because of Delta, the place is a ghost town. And while CVG may be the best airport in the area, the high fares are driving people to CMH, DAY, IND and the other airports in the region that have much lower fares.
In 2011, CVG had less passengers than IND, and after this year, CMH may be busier than CVG. This is happening because Delta is absolutely running CVG into the ground. But I don't know if anything can be done about it.

How many airlines does CVG have, four?

[TomJones123]

Originally Posted by pontiac51

How many airlines does CVG have, four?

They have all the majors, but Delta (as noted) is kingpin there.

[jlawrence01]

Originally Posted by pontiac51

Yes CVG is a great facility, and I'm sure that the renovated concourse is beautiful. But, primarily because of Delta, the place is a ghost town. And while CVG may be the best airport in the area, the high fares are driving people to CMH, DAY, IND and the other airports in the region that have much lower fares.

How many airlines does CVG have, four?

Actually ten to twelve - most of them commuter jets for the major airlines.

I looked at fares between ORD-CVG last night as I may need to fly home for a funeral. $933 was the lowest fare for a flight out on Monday and back on Tuesday on Orbitz.

MDW-SDF (Louisville) was $360 on Southwest. MDW-CMH was $380 on Southwest. MKE-DAY was $400 on Airtran. Which would YOU choose?