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Old 06-14-2012, 11:04 AM
 
Location: Sunbelt
798 posts, read 1,033,811 times
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^So true. If we are not careful, we'll end up like Rome.

Didn't ancient Rome fall apart from the inside and then become so weak and disorganized that German barbarians took it down? I'm sure there are several countries that would like to see the U.S. slip from the top so that they can be the top dog.
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Old 10-01-2019, 08:50 AM
 
14,019 posts, read 15,001,786 times
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So it’s been 7 years and I think it’s still largely true that the Rust belt revival has still been largely cordoned off to a few square miles in each city while the suburbs hold fast and significant parts of the cities depopulate.

Rochester seeems to be trumpeting a revival but whenever census estimates of job numbers come out they are at the bottom of the list in growth.

Now since 2010 Milwaukee and Erie County have stabilized with basically no change in population which is the best numbers since the 1970 census. And Buffalo has resurpassed Rochester as the biggest economy in Upstate. With Chicago these cities are the bright spots of the classic rust belt cities.

The rest of the Rust belt not so much. Cuyahoga County is on pace for a ~3% decrease Wayne County ~5% while better than the disaster of the 2000s is worse than the 90s.
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Old 10-01-2019, 09:24 AM
 
93,231 posts, read 123,842,121 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by btownboss4 View Post
So it’s been 7 years and I think it’s still largely true that the Rust belt revival has still been largely cordoned off to a few square miles in each city while the suburbs hold fast and significant parts of the cities depopulate.

Rochester seeems to be trumpeting a revival but whenever census estimates of job numbers come out they are at the bottom of the list in growth.

Now since 2010 Milwaukee and Erie County have stabilized with basically no change in population which is the best numbers since the 1970 census. And Buffalo has resurpassed Rochester as the biggest economy in Upstate. With Chicago these cities are the bright spots of the classic rust belt cities.

The rest of the Rust belt not so much. Cuyahoga County is on pace for a ~3% decrease Wayne County ~5% while better than the disaster of the 2000s is worse than the 90s.
I don’t know if that is still necessarily true in regards to the Rochester area, as sometimes it depends on how many areas are in the list and the area has never had a decline in population in an official census.
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Old 10-01-2019, 10:04 AM
 
255 posts, read 159,477 times
Reputation: 441
Quote:
Originally Posted by btownboss4 View Post
So it’s been 7 years and I think it’s still largely true that the Rust belt revival has still been largely cordoned off to a few square miles in each city while the suburbs hold fast and significant parts of the cities depopulate.

Rochester seeems to be trumpeting a revival but whenever census estimates of job numbers come out they are at the bottom of the list in growth.

Now since 2010 Milwaukee and Erie County have stabilized with basically no change in population which is the best numbers since the 1970 census. And Buffalo has resurpassed Rochester as the biggest economy in Upstate. With Chicago these cities are the bright spots of the classic rust belt cities.

The rest of the Rust belt not so much. Cuyahoga County is on pace for a ~3% decrease Wayne County ~5% while better than the disaster of the 2000s is worse than the 90s.
I realize you didnt single out Grand Rapids, but would that be a good example of the rust belt revitalization? Or do you consider this the exception to the rule? How do you feel about Pittsburgh also?
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Old 10-01-2019, 10:06 AM
 
Location: St. Louis
2,693 posts, read 3,187,296 times
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If the disorganized St. Louis City and County governments would stop fighting each other, I think St. Louis could be shifted into overdrive.

As is, the city is seeing more investment and development in the central corridor and parts of south city than it's seen in years. Its population is starting to mimic what's happened in Chicago with it continuing to decrease and yet the city is getting richer as more professionals are moving back. Additionally, in terms of job growth, St. Louis has been slow but steady, but it still out performed most of its better publicized peers this last year.

The city gets hit due to crime, and its redevelopment gets less press attention since it's not solely downtown focused, but the turn around in various neighborhoods since this thread started alone is astonishing. The trouble is that if something doesn't happen to stabilize the parts of north city immediately bordering the central corridor that we'll eventually have a functional city in the central corridor and south city and then an immediate dead zone in north city before you travel further north to the more intact portions of north city.

We'll see what happens with the new NGA West development, the north/south Metrolink, etc.
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Old 10-01-2019, 01:59 PM
 
14,019 posts, read 15,001,786 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bartonro View Post
I realize you didnt single out Grand Rapids, but would that be a good example of the rust belt revitalization? Or do you consider this the exception to the rule? How do you feel about Pittsburgh also?
The issue with Grand Rapids is a struggle to call it a revival because it didn’t really fall that hard.

In Pittsburgh’s case the city is doing better it seems than most other Rust belt cities but the Suburbs are on average worse off than your typical Rust Belt City so to a visitor the region probably seems more healthy than it actually is.
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Old 10-01-2019, 02:16 PM
 
821 posts, read 760,067 times
Reputation: 1452
Quote:
Originally Posted by btownboss4 View Post
So it’s been 7 years and I think it’s still largely true that the Rust belt revival has still been largely cordoned off to a few square miles in each city while the suburbs hold fast and significant parts of the cities depopulate.

Rochester seeems to be trumpeting a revival but whenever census estimates of job numbers come out they are at the bottom of the list in growth.

Now since 2010 Milwaukee and Erie County have stabilized with basically no change in population which is the best numbers since the 1970 census. And Buffalo has resurpassed Rochester as the biggest economy in Upstate. With Chicago these cities are the bright spots of the classic rust belt cities.

The rest of the Rust belt not so much. Cuyahoga County is on pace for a ~3% decrease Wayne County ~5% while better than the disaster of the 2000s is worse than the 90s.
By what metric has Buffalo's economy passed Rochester? I thought Buffalo was always larger.
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Old 10-01-2019, 02:18 PM
 
14,019 posts, read 15,001,786 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cjoseph View Post
By what metric has Buffalo's economy passed Rochester? I thought Buffalo was always larger.
between like 2000-2014 Rochester's GMP was slightly higher but Buffalo's recovery from the economic crisis of 2008 was more robust than Rochester's.
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Old 10-01-2019, 02:21 PM
 
821 posts, read 760,067 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by btownboss4 View Post
between like 2000-2014 Rochester's GMP was slightly higher but Buffalo's recovery from the economic crisis of 2008 was more robust than Rochester's.
Yeah Rochester hasn't really gotten out of its funk yet unlike Buffalo. Rochester used to always be richer and more educated, but now Buffalo is in stiff competition with them.
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Old 10-01-2019, 02:30 PM
 
37,875 posts, read 41,910,477 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bartonro View Post
I realize you didnt single out Grand Rapids, but would that be a good example of the rust belt revitalization? Or do you consider this the exception to the rule? How do you feel about Pittsburgh also?
Grand Rapids is Midwestern but is/was it actually Rust Belt?
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