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Old 09-10-2012, 09:50 PM
 
Location: NYC
2,423 posts, read 2,792,621 times
Reputation: 1757

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Quote:
Originally Posted by scrantiX View Post
Where does San Francisco fall short in this?

Have you really left Chicago thinking it was that much larger than San Francisco?

I've been really looking at Chicago these days to learn more about it, I'm starting to develop personal infatuations with the place. Seems like its everything on a more realistic level. I could see the appeal that city has and why its as loved as it is. Boston is another one that's trickling up my infatuations as well.

That's fine. She likely feels for California the way I do of NYC. I like the city and its a fun place to visit but I don't think I could warm up to the idea of living there just yet. I'm in an LA-San Diego-San Francisco Bay Area state of mind.
It's been a few years since I have been to SF but I don't remember feeling like I was in a really big city. More like Boston/Philly level. Chicago is different. Its skyline is massive, the Loop/Mag Mile area is the only place in the country that can feel almost like Manhattan, and its North Side is the most impressive chunk of urbanity in the country outside of NYC. You can see skyscrapers along the LSD for almost 10 miles. First time I visited Chicago I was in awe... I was young and inexperienced - and it was before i came to NYC - but I had no doubt that i was in a massive and world class city.
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Old 09-10-2012, 09:52 PM
 
Location: Minneapolis (St. Louis Park)
5,991 posts, read 8,887,242 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by scrantiX View Post
Yes and look at the land size and population of Minneapolis. What I mean by density is the entire urban area, or as the tool 'Rovian posted, that density that accumulates more than just the city.
Urbanized Area density for the Twin Cities is about 2.7K ppsm, which is in the lower-middle tier among the top 15 metros. Atlanta is the lowest at about 1.8K ppsm. Seattle is closer to 3.0K ppsm. And Phoenix is among the highest at 3.5K ppsm.

If we use these stats, are the Twin Cities STILL the least urban? If so, we're going to have to define "urban" here.
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Old 09-10-2012, 09:59 PM
 
Location: Minneapolis (St. Louis Park)
5,991 posts, read 8,887,242 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BKmachine View Post
All of these cities are country so none.
Detroit maybe but thats it.
I wonder how many NYC posters actually grew up in one of the 5 boroughs......not saying you or any one specific NYC'er didn't, but I'm saying I bet many of you cheerleaders of everything urban are using the city's status as your own living environment pretentiously......and I just doubt all of you were born/raised in say, the Bronx, for instance.

I lived in a neighborhood with a population density North of 25K-30K ppsm too for a short while and I found out that level of density isn't all it's cracked up to be, and probably wouldn't relocate to an area that dense/busy for the foreseeable future. In other words, I don't think there is shame in growing up in a lesser "urban America" or a SFH in the city (parts of Queens fall into this category). That's not to say NYC's density isn't impressive -- it's almost amazing considered that NYC is in America, after all -- but based on my personal experiences I didn't find that density/urbanism and quality of life were positively correlated whatsoever.
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Old 09-10-2012, 10:05 PM
 
Location: Minneapolis (St. Louis Park)
5,991 posts, read 8,887,242 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fitzrovian View Post
I didn't say that NYC and Chicago are the only big cities in the country. I said they are the only ones that can measure up in "big city feel" to the likes of Barcelona and Madrid. Not to say that a city like LA doesn't feel big, but it's different kind of big. It feels big by virtue of its massive expanse, not its atmosphere.

And yeah I should visit SF again... it's been awhile. I had a good time on my past visits, but I am a married man now and my wife is not a big fan of California. The thing is if you go to California you need to take a week. And if we are gonna take a week we'd rather go to Europe or S. America. Must have something to do with their big city feel
My family lives in SF now after moving there from Chicago, and I think Chicago feels more urban. San Francisco feels just a bit more quaint, and doesn't feel as stuffy compared to some places in Chicago. I know there are statistics out there that would debunk my perception but that's the surest way I can compare two cities -- my instinct.
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Old 09-10-2012, 10:06 PM
 
Location: where u wish u lived
896 posts, read 1,001,342 times
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Quote:
LOL this coming from a small towner like you I've been to Chicago and it is only slightly more vibrant than LA, Chicago is not NYC, nor will it ever be being in flyover country, it is a big town in a sea of suburbs, LA is the big time, only city that even comes close to rivaling NYC in the nation in importance, people in Chicago wonder and talk about LA but you never see that from us, we have too much going on out here to even worry about small towns like Chicago, most people don't even know what state it's in LOL, that's the difference we are in our own world being we are in such a large metro of almost 18 million, Chicago is what 8-9? pfffft hasn't even reached mega city status, we are trend setters, and we have no rivals, we don't care who likes us or what people think of us, we are to put in simple terms to darn big and important to care to be honest, something only New Yorkers would understand, am I coming off as arrogant? Sure why not I'm from LA, a city world reknown by 2 initials, known by the educated and non, go to any country and they will know of this city, live here long enough and maybe you will one day be able to have big city arrogance like me and many of my fellow Angelenos, but as of now you are still in a small town mindset, a Chicago mindset, an envious mindset, look around you, it's beautiful, big, exciting, endless activity, be happy you're here, you being a chicano you are among your own kind, you know deep down in your heart you are much more proud to tell people that you now live in Los Angeles, and I guarantee you will never get a blank stare no matter what corner on the earth you're in

I absolutely love this quote, I'm actually thinking about framing it and putting up on my wall
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Old 09-10-2012, 10:08 PM
 
Location: Minneapolis (St. Louis Park)
5,991 posts, read 8,887,242 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CaliSon View Post
I absolutely love this quote, I'm actually thinking about framing it and putting up on my wall
I've got an emoticon that summarizes your love of this post.
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Old 09-10-2012, 10:08 PM
 
Location: Nob Hill, San Francisco, CA
2,346 posts, read 3,564,449 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CaliSon View Post
I absolutely love this quote, I'm actually thinking about framing it and putting up on my wall
Sorry man, I didn't mean to bring it into this. I just wanted to leave the original thread so the mods wouldn't close this one or so people can understand what to discuss.

Looks like I did good.
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Old 09-10-2012, 10:12 PM
 
6,610 posts, read 7,506,498 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Min-Chi-Cbus View Post
Urbanized Area density for the Twin Cities is about 2.7K ppsm, which is in the lower-middle tier among the top 15 metros. Atlanta is the lowest at about 1.8K ppsm. Seattle is closer to 3.0K ppsm. And Phoenix is among the highest at 3.5K ppsm.

If we use these stats, are the Twin Cities STILL the least urban? If so, we're going to have to define "urban" here.
Actually Atlanta's urbanized area density is 2,420 ppsm (4.75 million in 1,963 sq.mi. Atlanta - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia) Still the lowest, but not by much.

Density alone doesn't define urbanity.
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Old 09-10-2012, 10:18 PM
 
Location: where u wish u lived
896 posts, read 1,001,342 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by scrantiX View Post
Sorry man, I didn't mean to bring it into this. I just wanted to leave the original thread so the mods wouldn't close this one or so people can understand what to discuss.

Looks like I did good.
LOL its all good Scrantix, I just like belittling small towns that think they are bigger than they are
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Old 09-10-2012, 10:22 PM
 
Location: The Greatest city on Earth: City of Atlanta Proper
8,071 posts, read 12,866,099 times
Reputation: 6118
Quote:
Originally Posted by JoeTarheel View Post
I hate to answer for someone else (because I could be wrong), but I believe that by "retail nodes within residential neighborhoods" he means like these:

Candler Park

All sizes | Neighborhood Shops - Candler Park - Atlanta, Georgia | Flickr - Photo Sharing!

Virginia Highland

http://farm2.staticflickr.com/1317/5...301fe1a769.jpg


All sizes | Neighborhood commercial node at 6th St and Argonne Ave, Midtown, Atlanta, GA | Flickr - Photo Sharing!
Nope, that's exactly what I meant.

What always makes me chuckle is when people say (as has been said numerous times in this thread) that Atlanta is "urban in Downtown and Midtown only" (as if that's a small area) and by proxy are basically saying that everything out from there is just miles upon miles of houses.

Back here in reality, outside of Downtown and Midtown are several nodes of retail and residential (what's called mixed use today) in the center of just about every neighborhood. These districts were built when the neighborhoods were, which they themselves were built essentially as their own cities that were connected to Atlanta proper by streetcar (what is called TOD today), and then annexed by the city in the early part of the 20th century. Along with the examples above are places like Little 5 Points, EAV, Atkins Park, 04W, Edgewood, West End, Cascade Heights, Sweet Auburn, Gleenwood Park, Grant Park, Poncey-Highland, West Midtown, Cabbagge town, and a bunch more I won't list here.

All of these areas are served either directly (or in close proximity) to MARTA rail and spaced a few miles a part from each other in basically a loop around the city...which also happens to fall within the 22 mile Beltline loop that is currently being redeveloped to connect these neighborhoods directly with each other with transit (right now, all points on MARTA head to Downtown and Midtown) and has in it's plan to redevelop industrial areas in between in the same fashion of these older districts.

Beyond this ring of neighborhoods and retail areas, other similar "Downtown" areas serve the inner ring "suburbs" of East Point, College Park, Chamblee, Decatur, and Avondale. These areas were cities in their own right prior to the expansion of the Atlanta sprawl bubble, and take on a characteristic of in town neighborhoods above. They also all have MARTA stations within their center and offer quick access into the central city.

Now when it comes to Buckhead....that's a little bit of a special case. It was developed in a more strictly suburban method for most of the 20th century. While it has it's own neighborhood residential/retail nodes like the older parts of the city, they aren't nearly as cohesive for the most part as the one's mentioned above. Also, the CBD of Buckhead has developed in a completely more "modern" way more akin to Brickell in Miami than Midtown or Downtown Atlanta. In fact, I'd say they're pretty much the same with both having dozens of highrise residential towers with a rapid transit line snaking through it...and filled with a population wealthy enough to not use public transportation on a regular basis.

Last edited by waronxmas; 09-10-2012 at 10:33 PM..
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