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Do you realize the cost of living index rates philadelphia as more expensive than Seattle . I realize there are lots of philly boosters here but please check your facts before you boost we dont need made up numbers. And I guess that puts Philadelphia at the bottom of the pack . I would consider Chicago much more urban than Philadelphia . And when it comes to living in a city I would rather live in a downtown with all the amenities within walking distance. Philadelphia is very urban but still needs alot of work . I only comment because I have lived in city centers have of my life. So like everyday stuff not just tourist stuff like movie theaters, Grocery stores, And department stores the idea is you never have to leave the city center . Wont have to take a trip out of the city center to see movies or go shopping. So I would say Seattle has a better ballence than philadelphia and is cheaper.
They are pretty close actually on COL
Also you do realize there are grocery stores, depatrment stores, and even movie theaters even in the DT (within wlaking distance), right?
I imagine Seattle has more theaters and am positive it has more department stores in the DT
I know you love Seattle and while I do think Philly still needs work (but doesnt everyplace) as far as DTs go I dont see Seattle at the level of Philadelphia, in fact based on my experiences it has far more work to go to be complete. There is far more than movie theaters and grocery stores (they give admission to even play in the first place) not really the distinguishing factors of a DT
Chicago you are right is bigger in terms its urban space when compared to Philly just as Philly is bigger when compared to Seattle
Seattle though is definately an option though but a top 5 or 6 DT in country to me it is not, I imagine we will differ on this opinion but many more likely would place Philly ahead in this regard.
On completeness and never having to leave the DT - there was study that found only 5 complete DTs existed in the US, Seattle was not one (Philadelphia was) of them but was considered an emerging DT (which was still among a very respectable DT group)
regardless both offer about the same COL (as does Chicago in this regard) and would probably fit the OP question
Are we talking about downtown COL, within the city COL or metro COL? Most COLs I can find compare metro to metro, which isn't what the OP is looking for when he mentions "urban amenities". Greater Phila is for sure more expensive than the Seattle Metro, downtown areas are probably comparable in cost, but the one place I could find that compared city cost to city cost (not metro and not restricted to any one part of the city) had Seattle at 41% more expensive than Philly on the whole.
Pittsburgh has far more amenities. It all depends on what your view of "amenities" are. Pittsburgh has rail transit, diverse city neighborhoods, a great park system, density, great colleges, and a diverse economy. Las Vegas has one of the worst economies in the country right now, right up there with Detroit. I see what you're saying about restaurants and entertainment along the strip, but Las Vegas just doesn't have neighborhoods like Oakland and Shadyside. You may get a lot for your money in Vegas, but you also get a lot for your money in a myriad of other cities listed here that offer better economies and much better amenities depending on what you want out of an area.
Do you realize the cost of living index rates philadelphia as more expensive than Seattle . I realize there are lots of philly boosters here but please check your facts before you boost we dont need made up numbers. And I guess that puts Philadelphia at the bottom of the pack . I would consider Chicago much more urban than Philadelphia . And when it comes to living in a city I would rather live in a downtown with all the amenities within walking distance. Philadelphia is very urban but still needs alot of work . I only comment because I have lived in city centers have of my life. So like everyday stuff not just tourist stuff like movie theaters, Grocery stores, And department stores the idea is you never have to leave the city center . Wont have to take a trip out of the city center to see movies or go shopping. So I would say Seattle has a better ballence than philadelphia and is cheaper.
I wouldn't say Chicago is "much more" urban than Philly. IMHO, I think Philly is more urban than Chicago. From the row houses to the packed streets, Philly just has a more urban feel to it. From Center City to South Philly, it is a great range of density and architecture, that yes, you find in the Loop, but not to the same extent as you do in Philadelphia.
Love this area (DC/Baltimore), but if COL is a deal breaker then Denver, Minneapolis/St Paul, Chicago (chicago burbs suck and living in the city may be too expensive) and Seattle (Seattle may be too high COL too).
COL in Vegas is offset by the lack of industry. You can...what? Be a stripper or a hooker? Options, man.
Let's be fair here there are more occupational options in Vegas. You can be a scumbag real estate scammer, subprime bank loan officer, a mafia dude, a pimp, a card dealer, and/or a timeshare salesman too.
I'm not sure how much longer it will last (until Philly is on a more equal col with NY, Boston, DC) but I truly believe Philadelphia to have the best col/amenities balance in the US. I'm sure this could be proven somehow, and Chicago could give Philly some competition, but the location just isn't the same.
Let's be fair here there are more occupational options in Vegas. You can be a scumbag real estate scammer, subprime bank loan officer, a mafia dude, a pimp, a card dealer, and/or a timeshare salesman too.
Actually you can be a Doctor, Lawyer, Engineer, Nurse, Grocer...and better paid in Las Vegas than in Pittsburgh say or most of the rust belt.
The Strip is the steel mill of Las Vegas. And it provides a huge number of well paying jobs. Those are not equaled by any of the rust built cities.
The Las Vegas construction industry is on its backside and not likely to recover any time soon. But the rest of the economy does as well or better than the US averages.
And it is a best buy on housing and cost of living.
It has a superior freeway system thus reducing the need for rail transport.
And it has a superior park system and its location provides easy access to such things as Grand Canyon and Zion National Park. Lake Mead Recreation area is within a half hour.
And on top of all that it has restaurants comparable to NY and LA and vastly superior to anywhere in the rust belts plus all the entertainment one could desire.
It continues to attract retirees in large numbers by its climate and amenities.
Again the prejudice of the easterners shows up in these threads...and facts just cause confusion.
I will also note my personal observation that there really is no where worth living east of the Mississippi.
Actually you can be a Doctor, Lawyer, Engineer, Nurse, Grocer...and better paid in Las Vegas than in Pittsburgh say or most of the rust belt.
The Strip is the steel mill of Las Vegas. And it provides a huge number of well paying jobs. Those are not equaled by any of the rust built cities.
The Las Vegas construction industry is on its backside and not likely to recover any time soon. But the rest of the economy does as well or better than the US averages.
And it is a best buy on housing and cost of living.
It has a superior freeway system thus reducing the need for rail transport.
And it has a superior park system and its location provides easy access to such things as Grand Canyon and Zion National Park. Lake Mead Recreation area is within a half hour.
And on top of all that it has restaurants comparable to NY and LA and vastly superior to anywhere in the rust belts plus all the entertainment one could desire.
It continues to attract retirees in large numbers by its climate and amenities.
Again the prejudice of the easterners shows up in these threads...and facts just cause confusion.
I will also note my personal observation that there really is no where worth living east of the Mississippi.
The super high unemployment rate in Las Vegas indicates that there's much more going on behind the scenes and automatically negates a lot of those basic COL benefits. Plus Vegas is still a seedy city full of transient get rich types. The social scene reflects that where a night out is with a bunch of drunken tourists or befriending shady fly by night "professionals" in the city. I've known many many people who have lived and worked in Vegas too.
I'm not sure how much longer it will last (until Philly is on a more equal col with NY, Boston, DC) but I truly believe Philadelphia to have the best col/amenities balance in the US. I'm sure this could be proven somehow, and Chicago could give Philly some competition, but the location just isn't the same.
Given how subjective any of this is I highly doubt you could "prove" your belief to the satisfaction of a majority of folks. I think you have a reasonable case w.r.t Philadelphia's position in the Northeast but the a lot of the other regions in the country are lower cost and can also offer urban amenities. Much of the midwest comes to mind immediately: Chicago, Minneapolis, Milwaukee etc and the sunbelt has always been historically one of the cheapest regions to live in with some areas that also support more than just suburbs.
In general downtowns have been strengthening over the last decade and that trend seems to be continuing so your choices and opportunities to live an urban lifestyle are expanding.
Ben
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