Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
Too many from the sun belt think that St Louis is washed up. If they only knew what was happening there more people would be moving there. Keep it as one of the best kept secrets for as long as possible.
St. Louis is a city that suffers greatly from an image problem. I will concede that the region has some serious problems with crime, poverty, decay, but one of its biggest obstacles is how the region is packaged and sold to outsiders and even many locals. The most tragic part is that St. Louis was one of America's first great cities and most people know nothing of it besides the Arch, Cardinals, and maybe crime, BBQ, or Nelly?
Just released ... There are some extremely ambitious development plans on tap for Cleveland's downtown and lakefront areas. This proposed SKY LIFT would be an iconic addition to the core of the city. These plans are in their infancy as of now, but there are already some major sponsors backing the project.
I would say that if adequate support is garnered we can expect to see this project become reality within a few short years - Cleveland is seeing a huge amount of development occurring in the downtown area right now, so I would not be one to dismiss the probability of this project.
Oh, Gawd!!! Don't have a tantrum over this. Blame Google! I typed in my search query for 2013 population figures for Cleveland's MSA / CMSA - my search return was the link I provided. St. Louis was also on that list of 48 cities with metro populations over 1 million.
This thread pertains primarily to which city will stage a stronger come-back - Again, I believe that Cleveland will emerge in a much stronger position than St. Louis. In Cleveland, we're much better aligned to major shipping channels, we are closer to other major cities and the amenities in our region are arguably much more substantial than in the St. Louis area. Our setting on a GREAT LAKE provides infinite possibilities ... far greater than those that exist on the banks of the muddy Mississippi River.
Before you even try to go there ... our Cuyahoga River doesn't catch fire anymore! LOL
I'm just curious as to whether or not that was deliberate that you simply didn't expect people to notice, or if it was more of an inherent bias where you saw favorable numbers so you innately tended to not question the comparison as being off. I see this with a lot of boosters on the forum and I can never tell what the psychology behind it is.
I think the OP's question is skewed a bit: Cleveland was decimated more than any metro area in recent decades, with the possible exception of Detroit -- I haven't heard St. Louis suffering economic blows anywhere near what Cleveland has... That said, as JohnDBumgarndner has noted, Cleveland has picked itself up off the canvas amazingly in the past 5 years with things such as the new medically-oriented convention center, population growth in several in-city neighborhoods, notably downtown... That's not blind boosterism, that's fact ... sorry it offends certain posters... It also isn't saying that Cleveland has solved all it's economic and other woes, because it most certainly has not... but it shows that this city has hardly thrown in the towel, either, which has to be admirable I don't care what city you come from/root for.
The fact that St. Louis leads in the above "poll" 2-to-1 shows more hometown boosterism more-so that people dealing with actual fact.
I think the OP's question is skewed a bit: Cleveland was decimated more than any metro area in recent decades, with the possible exception of Detroit -- I haven't heard St. Louis suffering economic blows anywhere near what Cleveland has... That said, as JohnDBumgarndner has noted, Cleveland has picked itself up off the canvas amazingly in the past 5 years with things such as the new medically-oriented convention center, population growth in several in-city neighborhoods, notably downtown... That's not blind boosterism, that's fact ... sorry it offends certain posters... It also isn't saying that Cleveland has solved all it's economic and other woes, because it most certainly has not... but it shows that this city has hardly thrown in the towel, either, which has to be admirable I don't care what city you come from/root for.
The fact that St. Louis leads in the above "poll" 2-to-1 shows more hometown boosterism more-so that people dealing with actual fact.
I thought the premise of the thread was "which Midwestern metro area has the better chance of making a comeback", not which one has fallen the hardest and therefore has to work harder to become nationally relevant again.
I also dont think its fair for you to imply that everyone who votes for St. Louis over Cleveland is a victim of blind boosterism when A) There are most likely just as many people on this forum from Cleveland as St. Louis B) Not everyone on this forum is from St. Louis or even the Midwest and C) St. Louis gets dragged in the mud just as much if not more than Cleveland, whether it's for urban decay or "most dangerous city".
I also don't see anything Cleveland is doing that St. Louis is currently not doing, as far as reinventing itself. It's really just a matter of personal perception and preference.
I think this map says a lot about why people may think St. Louis has a better chance to comeback.
How so? I think St. Louis is obviously further on the road back, but I don't see where that map shows that.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.